KickStarter Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pre-DLC Thread [GO TO NEW THREAD]

[Fedora Master]

Can you rename animal companions?

 

[hell bovine]

Also, it looks like you can sneak attack undead! :D

What critters (if any) are immune to sneaks in pathfinder?

 

[Yosharian]

So, not playing now, waiting for patches etc.
My primary character will be Rogue-based as usual, but... I thinking about something else.
Like some class that have a lot of Natural weapon attacks (or how it's called) like claws and fangs, I guess some Druid should have it, paired with sneak dices, maybe Druide with some Rogue or it's subclusses levels.
Imagine 2-3-5 Natural Weapon attacks per round, with 3d6 sneak attacks, what do you think deuxhero?

Natural attacks are trash because they don't scale very well (no +enhancement bonuses that weapons get).

Two-weapon fighting is far superior for putting out sheer numbers of attacks per round that can actually scale as you find better weapons.

 

[Ruchy]

I created a dedicated builds and strategies thread for this. http://www.rpgcodex.net/forums/inde...er-kingmaker-builds-and-strats-thread.124160/
Just to avoid clogging this up with that talk. Feel free to ignore.

 

[Yosharian]

Also, it looks like you can sneak attack undead! :D

What critters (if any) are immune to sneaks in pathfinder?

Pathfinder completely removed the concept of Undead being immune to Sneak Attacks.

Some creatures, like Elementals, are immune to Sneak Attacks and crits. Here's some info:

Spoiler

Precision damage (such as that dealt by a rogue’s sneak attack ability) applies to more creatures than it did in previous editions of the game.

Some may balk at this but it can easily be imagined or explained as the rogue having found a weak point in the undead’s “body” (such as a zombie’s head) or even finding a crack or flaw in a construct’s “body.”

There is some degree of confusion as to what should separate a “critical hit” from a “precision-based attack” but in any event, in some cases they are treated differently.

Critical Hits

The following creature types (or subtypes) have immunity to critical hits (that is, they do not take any additional damage from critical hits):

Aeon (subtype): “Immunity to cold, poison, and critical hits.“
Elemental (subtype): Elementals are “not subject to critical hits or flanking. Does not take additional damage from precision-based attacks, such as sneak attack.“
Incorporeal (subtype): “An incorporeal creature is immune to critical hits (unless the attacks are made using a weapon with the ghost touch special weapon quality.)“
Ooze (Type): <Oozes are…> “not subject to critical hits or flanking. Does not take additional damage from precision-based attacks (such as sneak attack.)“
Protean (subtype): (50% chance to ignore, see below*)
Swarm (Type): “A swarm has no clear front or back and no discernible anatomy, so it is not subject to critical hits.“
Precision-Based Damage (like Sneak Attack)

The following creature types (or subtypes) do not take additional damage from precision-based attacks (such as sneak attack):

Elemental (subtype): “<An elemental…> does not take additional damage from precision-based attacks (such as sneak attack.)“
Incorporeal (subtype): “An incorporeal creature is immune to precision-based damage (such as sneak attack damage) unless the attacks are made using a weapon with the ghost touch special weapon quality.“
Ooze (Type): “<An ooze is…> does not take additional damage from precision-based attacks (such as sneak attack.)“
Protean (subtype): (50% chance to ignore, see below*)
Creatures Immune to Flanking

Opponents do not gain any special flanking bonuses against the following creature types (or subtypes):

Ooze (Type): “<An ooze is…> not subject to … flanking.“
Swarm (Type): “A swarm has no clear front or back and no discernible anatomy, so it is not subject to flanking.“
Elemental (subtype): “<Elementals are…> not subject to flanking.“
*Special: Proteans have a special ability called “Amorphous Anatomy” which might protect them: “<Amorphous Anatomy> grants <a protean> a 50% chance to ignore additional damage caused by critical hits and sneak attacks,”

 

[hell bovine]

Well in this case I am going to multiclass both Octavia and her boytoy as arcane tricksters, to see who is better at sneak attacking with spells. I do so like experimenting on npcs... :D

 

[glass blackbird]

I think I'm going to make a Halfling Sylvan Sorcerer. any thoughts? seems like a good fit but I've never really done a pathfinder sorcerer before so I've no idea whether that's actually good or not.

I can't recommend it. I've played a bit with a sylvan, but the problem is that while the animal companion is really good at killing stuff early on, a sorcerer just lacks the druid buffing spells specific for them.

Imo, a pure sorcerer with a bloodline will give you more in the long run (provided they didn't screw up in implementing their abilities, lol). E.g. the fey bloodline gives you spells & abilities similar to sylvan, but instead gets +2 dc on compulsion spells.

I decided to hell with it, I'm going to make a barb/bard-> dragon disciple. gimmick builds are the best builds

 

[Yosharian]

That build I posted actually has 20 Wisdom but oh well, the joys of being unable to edit old posts

I actually forgot to raise all the racials, oh well

Actually, let's pretend this was intended

 

[haderlump]

I assume they somehow borked the Stag Lord battle. The Owlbear simply doesn't do anything anymore. Also, the achievement for killing the bandits and the quest progress happen while the battle isn't over. It's nice to see all the messages popping up while the party gets wiped.

That occasionally happened to me even before the last two patches. I think it helps if you have a character near his cage when the battle starts, same for that other guy you can recruit. But with a bit of luck you can win the battle before either of them show up.

 

[AwesomeButton]

I think most people here would want things to be balanced SCS style, except Obsidian fans. They praised Sawyer in the PoE2 thread for increasing the enemy stat boosts, and prefer to play with level scaling. The contrast between the two threads is very amusing in this regard.

The PoEs already vary enemy composition on the difficulties below PotD. Of course that's not enough for the true pro gamers who need the boost.

Both the stat boost and the increased headcount take second place to improved tactics. The former two are simply the cheaper option to do. I don't know who did you see claiming the opposite, that buffs and bigger crowds are preferable.

 

[Jenkem]

while waiting for the patch I decided to play some dumpsterfire and wtf? I even started a new game because I was flabbergasted by how popamole it was.. on the new game I literally rushed to first quest to get my ship and took it to the main island, I didn't do any sidequests and had a total of 6 or so fights and by the time I got to the main hub I had a full party with everyone at level 4 and did jack shit... W T F after playing pathfinder kingmaker the dumpsterfire's shallowness shines. there is more game in the first 20 minutes of pathfinder kingmaker than the majority of josh sawyer's afterbirth

fucking owlcat please patch... don't take my incline away

 

[Luckmann]

Eldritch scoundrel works too.

Eldritch Scoundrel casts spells exactly like a Wizard only he gets up to 6th level spells. Sure, you could do that, but why the fuck would you want to? It's drastically inferior to playing a Rogue1/Wizard3/Trickster which can cast up to 9th level spells. Also, you can enter this prestige class using a level of Vivisectionist Alchemist instead of Rogue.

Woah, woah, woah, woah, woah. Hold on.

Alchemists in PF:K qualifies as arcane casters, and their extracts as arcane spells? That has... potential, especially if they introduce more PrC:s later.

Charge hints for the dummies that can't seem to figure it out-


Set it up to pause on enemy spot - before combat is initiated your characters can charge with 0 second delay or initiative roll.

Personally, I sent in my high AC character and have the rest auto combat. This is so all enemies get on her and my others follow quickly after.


If you charge after combat initiates, it rolls initiative and you could have to wait to charge for 3.5 seconds or so.

While it's smart to set up pause-on-enemy-spotted, you actually charge straight in upon spotting? You don't actually sneak up and position yourself? Because that sounds retarded.

So has anyone found anything that 'Use Magical Device' is actually useful for?

Wands, mostly, but also scrolls. There's probably more, some checks here and there (although I haven't run into any).

 

[Polanski]

Now I feel stupid. You can apparently build stuff in kingdom mode by clicking the city icon on the map. I was looking for it for several months and figured I just had complete some quests to build able to build stuff.

How the fuck did they not tell me that after over-explaining all other kingdom stuff!!!

 

[AwesomeButton]

I didn't do any sidequests and had a total of 6 or so fights and by the time I got to the main hub I had a full party with everyone at level 4 and did jack shit...

You need to have advanced by at least 5 levels before the tutorial ends, because the characters need enough XP to unlock their clicky thingies which can be click-pointed at baddies. (To be fair, the XP has some sort of an arithmetic progression, so the latter levels will take longer and longer to reach. The majority of gameplay will pass between 10th-14th level)

 

[Multi-headed Cow]

Alright, I have one thing that might be slightly torches and pitchforks-worthy. Minor spoiler about the beginning of chapter 2 but what the hell.

Spoiler

The "Baron meets the nymph by himself" thing. That's all well and good, except apparently I can't load up my party and travel somewhere and leave my team outside of a cave or a glade or whatever the fuck the nymph wants. I apparently have to leave the whole party back in the capital and haul my ass out there alone. Annoying, but seems doable at first glance. Except the fact that my reedy little wizard arms can't even carry the 80 pounds of potatoes I'm lugging around, not to mention my autistic murderhobo collection of various potions, scrolls, and "Just in case" weapons and armors that no one is using. I don't trust the stashes due to bugs and I don't particularly feel keen on selling my big stash either. I'll wrestle with it tomorrow but it's late enough and I'm groggy enough that I felt pissed off at the sudden blob of inventory management looming up out of the fog ahead of me so I called it quits for the evening.

Other than getting pissed off at that though it was a fun evening. Explored the whole abandoned dwarf watch tower area which gave me some really pleasing BG1 vibes. Multiple varied combat encounters in one large area, multiple little self contained stories (The hunters, the ruin, arguably the bandit ambush, the greedy peasants looking for treasure), and a few skill checks and a text adventure bit. And some of the combat encounters were reasonably tough for a 5th level party so it wasn't completely braindead auto-attacking through everything. Really enjoyable area, shame most of the areas are smaller maybe 5 minute jaunts, although those are common enough that I don't mind 'em much in the grand scheme of things.

 

[Ibbz]

Alright, I have one thing that might be slightly torches and pitchforks-worthy. Minor spoiler about the beginning of chapter 2 but what the hell.

In the bottom left of the screen, there's a set of buttons when you're on the overland map - one of them is the group / party manager which lets you swap (or remove) party members when you're not at your keep no matter where you are.

 

[Multi-headed Cow]

Alright, I have one thing that might be slightly torches and pitchforks-worthy. Minor spoiler about the beginning of chapter 2 but what the hell.

In the bottom left of the screen, there's a set of buttons when you're on the overland map - one of them is the group / party manager which lets you swap (or remove) party members when you're not at your keep no matter where you are.

Son of a bitch! No idea how I missed that. Especially given how I noticed you could do some kingdom management shit from the map. Guess I'll still have some inventory management to do, but maybe I can just drop it in a big shitpile in the nymph's zone and pick it up again after or something. Thanks!

 

[Cael]

Alrighty then!

This spoiler may help you not feel bad about your defeat:

Spoiler

The treasure is +2 agile dueling sword (it's exotic proficiency)

Wait, nevermind. Being high on my victory against the greater enraged owlbears, I misread the name of the beast! That treasure is in the swamp...

The big owlbear was pretty easy battle. If you are talking about the one in the city. It is really a shame that battles that look interesting and epic end up in a flop after a turn or two,while a five wolfs in the wood endup killing your party. They made it hard in the wrong places.

+6 to all stats for 1 creature is not as potent as +6 to all stats for 5 creatures. One of the reasons why it is bad to have a party face one boss and nothing else. The boss encounter should always consist of multiple enemies. A single big CR enemy is a recipe for a walkover, especially at higher levels.

I see you haven't played drakensang games . The best bosses in any CRPG i have played. Extremely hard and hell of a satisfying to beat the shit out of them and leave on your last HP with four wounds.

Isn't that one of those twitch type games? The one that spawned Nier?

 

[Jimmious]

Couldn't hold my self, even if I knew that the game is buggy. Restarted with an Elven Conjurer. Damn char gen and level ups are so much fun in this game

 

[Cael]

So has anyone found anything that 'Use Magical Device' is actually useful for?

Wands, mostly, but also scrolls. There's probably more, some checks here and there (although I haven't run into any).

As in IWD2, a well built party simply won't need UMD if it is restricted to just wands and scrolls. Even the PnP allows you to use things you otherwise can't, like use the Holy Avenger as though you are a Paladin.

NWN1/2 actually had a pretty good compromise with what you can do with UMD. Instead of rolling all the time to see if you keep qualifying, it just says you do if the item is below a certain gp value.

 

[Thonius]

So has anyone found anything that 'Use Magical Device' is actually useful for?

Scrolls, wands restricted items. I got wand of true strike on Valerie +20 roll on one atack.

 

[Valtiel]

Haven't payed it yet but looking at how people are reacting in here...imagine Pathfinder 2 with epic levels and set between planes and high level shit a la MotB

 

[Luckmann]

So has anyone found anything that 'Use Magical Device' is actually useful for?

Wands, mostly, but also scrolls. There's probably more, some checks here and there (although I haven't run into any).

As in IWD2, a well built party simply won't need UMD if it is restricted to just wands and scrolls. Even the PnP allows you to use things you otherwise can't, like use the Holy Avenger as though you are a Paladin.

NWN1/2 actually had a pretty good compromise with what you can do with UMD. Instead of rolling all the time to see if you keep qualifying, it just says you do if the item is below a certain gp value.

Yup, I agree. UMD can be useful but it's ultimately redundant. There's plenty of self-targeting wands, though, so especially a magus or something can probably make pretty good use of it. That said, the reduced number of skills means that there's really no reason *not* to take UMD in a lot of cases, because you've got all the bases covered anyway.

 

[Luckmann]

Alright, I have one thing that might be slightly torches and pitchforks-worthy. Minor spoiler about the beginning of chapter 2 but what the hell.

In the bottom left of the screen, there's a set of buttons when you're on the overland map - one of them is the group / party manager which lets you swap (or remove) party members when you're not at your keep no matter where you are.

 

[fantadomat]

Alrighty then!

This spoiler may help you not feel bad about your defeat:

Spoiler

The treasure is +2 agile dueling sword (it's exotic proficiency)

Wait, nevermind. Being high on my victory against the greater enraged owlbears, I misread the name of the beast! That treasure is in the swamp...

The big owlbear was pretty easy battle. If you are talking about the one in the city. It is really a shame that battles that look interesting and epic end up in a flop after a turn or two,while a five wolfs in the wood endup killing your party. They made it hard in the wrong places.

+6 to all stats for 1 creature is not as potent as +6 to all stats for 5 creatures. One of the reasons why it is bad to have a party face one boss and nothing else. The boss encounter should always consist of multiple enemies. A single big CR enemy is a recipe for a walkover, especially at higher levels.

I see you haven't played drakensang games . The best bosses in any CRPG i have played. Extremely hard and hell of a satisfying to beat the shit out of them and leave on your last HP with four wounds.

Isn't that one of those twitch type games? The one that spawned Nier?

It is a fucking old school german PnP adaptation in rtwp. It is one of the most hardcore crpgs! The system alone is far more fun than D&D. Don't be uneducated pig and go play the fucking games!!!