Pathfinder Pathfinder: Wrath of the Righteous - Enhanced Edition - now with A Dance of Masks epilogue DLC

[Grunker]

I dunno what it has to do with length

unless your gm is fudging (which is basically cheating, so you may as well take toybox and give your pc godmode and play on the honor system).

I honestly suspect it's meant to be a grace period so that as long as the mc is resed before the combat ends the game can continue, but then someone threw in a variable trying to account for stuff like breath of life which have conditions to resability and now it just shows up as a random delay.

lol that would be very owlcat

Makes sense, hexes are incredibly strong, especially the buff ones as there's no saving throws.

They're strong but also kind of boring

 

[Grunker]

Any reason demon DR is working against Woljif's Cold Iron arrows or is that just a bug?

EDIT: Turning the arrows off and on again apparantly works

 

[Jaedar]

They're strong but also kind of boring

Rerolling failed dice is the funnest of mechanics though. Also iirc there's a sleep hex which is pretty fun and stronk early on, although hex DCs quickly become automatic saves as the game goes on.

 

[Haplo]

Some more fun in Blackwater.
On Unfair those cyber-enhanced mobs have really high CMD, so the Mobility checks are not easy to make. Still its a fun and effective playstyle.

I mean, I did some investigation in the thread, literally checking 50+ pages manually, so some of the questions are resolved, however some are still remain the actual (Very new to Wrath, had some experience with Kingmaker & D&D overall before).
I believe the build on the screen is (going to be)
Sword Saint 13 / Rowdy Rogue 1 / Loremaster 1 / Instinctual Warrior 2 / Mutation Warrior 3
It's using Trickster Mobility 2 as a core feature, obviously has stuff like Combat Reflexes, Stealthy, Power attack and (very likely) stats spread like that:
STR 13
DEX 19
CON 10 (11?)
WIS 14
INT 16
CHA 7

Also in your case it's using scythe and I'm not sure how it is possible to finesse that weapon (I was planning to use elven curved blade, like guy from here https://www.reddit.com/r/Pathfinder...crit_dmg_per_aoo_46_aoo_per_round_30k_dpr_ss/)

Few more questions besides that:
- How's that character moving in a such a... "teleportation" manner?
- Is build like that playable on console with no mods (TTT)?
- It seems to be there's a spike in character awesomeness, when is that happening? I see that it's at least level 11, but maybe earlier?

I'd REALLY appreciate if you (or somebody else) will share some build breakdown for newbies, because I had a lot of fun even just watching the demonstration videos!

Thanks!

I'm not using Rowdy->Loremaster. I finally decided against using Vital Strike (although it is certainly a valid approach). As long as you're able to reliably beat the Mobility checks, spending the entire Standard action on a single attack, even strong, is a DPR loss. Could move a lot during that Standard action and trigger a lot of AoOs. Of course, a Vital Strike could still be the better course of action vs some tough bossess or enemies who's CMD you can't beat (for example on Unfair).

STR 11 (+4 Str belt or buff -2 Reduce Person will still allow the use of Power Attack - on the other hand, it will be a while before you can pick it)
DEX 19 (should be. I went with 20 - which is a mistake, considering that the best Dex item cannot be boosted to odd value with Arcana Trick)
CON 11
WIS 17 ( I actually have 15 here due to too many points spent on Dex)
INT 15
CHA 7

The build is:

As for how one can use a scythe? It needs fighter Weapon Training in Heavy Blades (needs 5 fighter levels) and Fighter's Finesse (makes any trained weapon finessable) plus Mythic Weapon Finesse feat - to add Dex to damage to finessable weapons.

The other questions:
- How's that character moving in a such a... "teleportation" manner?
It isn't really. I move while enmies cannot because I play in Turn Based mode. Mobility Trick 1 adds +50% move speed in Acrobatic Movement mode. I get bonus speed from buffs and barbarian levels. And last but not least, from Impossible Speed mythic ability from the TableTop Tweaks mod.

- Is build like that playable on console with no mods (TTT)?
Yes. Biggest loss is Impossible Speed, which really improves your Move Speed by a lot early, as well as earlier 2nd Improved Trick (for example to improve crits with Perception earlier) and TTT modifications to Perception Tricks (without TTT you'd need to buy the crit feats to improve the crit rate/damage). You're also loosing stuff like Shingle Runner to boost your Mobility further (but in vanilla you can stack some +Dex effects you cannot with TTT - perhaps kitsune Master Shapeshifter and Reduce/Microscopic Proportions, so this one might even out). Also Graceful Athlete to easily max Athletics skill. But in general that playstyle should still be quite playable.

- It seems to be there's a spike in character awesomeness, when is that happening? I see that it's at least level 11, but maybe earlier?
Well, early game is so-so. You start pretty weak, become a decent tank with Mutagen Discovery at Mutation Warrior 3. The your offense improves a little with MW 5 and Finesse Training in Heavy Blades. Things improve a lot at the start of Act 2 when you buy Wide Sweep scythe, which is a fantastic weapon that'll serve you well even before getting Mythic Weapon Finesse. When you get it at Lost Chapel around level 8 things will improve again... and again with Power Attack.
But things really take off only in Act 3 - probably not sooner then at level 11. You need to access and do your Mythic Quest to reach Mythic Rank 4 to pick Mobility Improved Trick. It is possible before doing pretty much any act 3 content by pursuing quests in the capital and managing the army and kingdom, but it'll take a while.

If you have any other questions - shoot.

Thank you so much, absolutely fantastic write up.
Few more questions, sir!
1) I was using yours Sanctified Slayer build before that, but Trickster videos completely stole my attention and casting reduce person before mounting every time wasn't fun. How do you compare these two builds, which is more fun for you?

Well casting Reduce is only somewhat troublesome before getting Greater Enduring Spells on your caster. And you can potentially also go for a bigger mount.
Personally, currently I'm having more fun with the Mobility Trickster. But I do think it's not necessarily the best pick for a first playtrough. The Trickster mythic Path story isn't great and mechanics-wise you end up breaking and subverting some game mechanics.
On the other hand, the Sanctified Slayer is a great skill monkey, party leader (despite bad Cha) and potentially even scout.

2) It seems like you're missing mythic skill tricks in the table, like mobility 1, 2, perception 1 etc?

Yes, I intentionally skipped them, as I've not gone very far with this build yet. And I believe there are differences in when you get some of those between vanilla game and TTT.
I can recommend 3 first Tricks: first Arcana 1, then Mobility 1 & 2. Later you'll also want Mobility 3, World 1 (maybe late game 2?). Perception is tricky. Modded tier 2 can be gotten at the start of Act 4, which is good. In vanilla you'd have to wait till very late Act 4 AND need to spend feats to benefit (respec to fit them, perhaps?). Athletics can also be considered. Or maybe even UMD.

3) Why scythe though? Isn't the elven curved blade has better crit range and you don't need to have 5 levels of mutation warrior (and can just use 3) because it's finessable weapon?

Because of the early Wide Sweep specimen. It deals its damage to all enemies around the attack target. So if there are 3 enemies close together and you run past their threat ranges and pass the Mobility checks, a normal weapon will grant you 3 AoOs. But with Wide Sweep, you'll hit each of them 3 times (for a total of 9 strikes). Also the crit properties of scythes are a good fit for Vek's TTT modification to Perception 2 Trick - which now improves the crit Threat Range by a flat 2 points (but without spending feats on it and also lets you ignore crit immunities and re-roll fortification checks).

4) Any other class dips/levels that could help to improve character speed? (considering that I do no have an access to mods on console). I do not play on Unfair, it's usually "classic" difficulty, so I don't think that enemies will have sky-high CMD which would require mods to squeeze as much Mobility as possible

Hmm, tricky. There are Rage Powers to improve Move Speed further (+10, can be picked up to 3 times). So maybe Instinctual Warrior 4 and Extra Rage Power feats? Or slightly easier, a party skald that picks those Rage Powers?

> perhaps kitsune and Reduce/Microscopic Proportions
5) So possible improvement would be to use Kitsune with Master Shapeshifter mythic feat to boost the stats?

In vanilla that should be possible. Although Owlcats have been fixing various things, so I cannot guarantee that stacking Size and Polymorph bonuses will always keep working as it does now. You do have a free Mythic Ability in Impossible Speed slot (I'd probably take Master Shapeshifter as first Mythic Ability then).

 

[Yosharian]

The move speed rage power is terrible.

 

[traa]

I've started with Kitsune, +4 buff to three stats looks more or less interesting, plus that extra bite attack pretty useful at start.

Personally, currently I'm having more fun with the Mobility Trickster. But I do think it's not necessarily the best pick for a first playtrough

Yea, Trickster is definitely a bit more... tricky than Sanctified Slayer, I miss some of SS bonuses, plus sneak attack was a really really helping early game which is why I was thinking about possible ways to increase the damage with sneak.

There are Rage Powers to improve Move Speed further (+10, can be picked up to 3 times)

Ahh, no offence, but I do agree with Yosharian that it sucks, sounds like a pretty bad trade off of two levels. Maybe some sneak attack levels of some other class and elven curved blade as a weapon with much more higher critical range? I'm just unsure which two (potentially even 4 if going to 11 SS instead of 13 and dropping that late int damage bonus) levels can make a difference, considering the fact that going to crit oriented weapon means that it's more efficient to focus on some pure damage bonuses instead of sneak attack which doesn't multiply on crit (at least it was working like that in NWN)

And you can potentially also go for a bigger mount.

I have an efficiency OCD, so knowing that leopard a bit better in terms of effective charging I can't really use anything else, hehe

Also the crit properties of scythes are a good fit for Vek's TTT modification to Perception 2 Trick

I'd appreciate any vanilla game change advices in your build since I'm a console player retard.

And of course, - thanks a lot again, very valuable feedback!

 

[ArchAngel]

Brown Fur Transmuter is busted lol. She gives (of course I made a supporting character a girl) huge bonuses to whole party with Mass Bear's, Mass Bull's and Mass Cat's Grace and then also buffed Legendary. This shit is insane. I took Mythic Extend spell so she has free extend on all her spells. This shit is funny. And then Pounce on Rage Song lets my dudes insta kill most targets on surprise charge :D
And of course she gives additional bonuses in camp..

Spoiler

By cooking for everyone you perverts!

 

[Grunker]

Any tips for Unfair Topaz Solutions? I've cleaned out the entirety of Chap 1 before Gray Garrison, but I'm having a hard time with this one. The mimics deal incredible damage, I can get them down, or I can get the alchemist down, but both are tricky

 

[Haplo]

Any tips for Unfair Topaz Solutions? I've cleaned out the entirety of Chap 1 before Gray Garrison, but I'm having a hard time with this one. The mimics deal incredible damage, I can get them down, or I can get the alchemist down, but both are tricky

Slumber.

 

[Grunker]

Any tips for Unfair Topaz Solutions? I've cleaned out the entirety of Chap 1 before Gray Garrison, but I'm having a hard time with this one. The mimics deal incredible damage, I can get them down, or I can get the alchemist down, but both are tricky

Slumber.

Didn't have it, it's the one advice from Daidre I shouldn't have taken

But FUYEAH:

 

[Kjaska]

Fought the swarm guy. One of the writers is a Naruto fag.

First time I had to actually deploy tactics and look into the spell lists of my casters. Pretty cool.

I fucking hate Azata path. I picked it for the themes, when it was still just about the moon goddess and shit and now I have to suffer this retarded dragon all the other lgbtq+ inserts. I couldn't pin-point it at first, but now I can't unhear it: Arueshalae's VA sounds just like Amber Heard when trying to "tell the truth" on her stand.

On a more positive note, I like how the puzzles in this game actually take some effort to solve.

 

[Grunker]

Jaedar is an Azata-enjoyer. I told him it made it a cuck, but I fear he is lost forever

 

[Humbaba]

Azata is a good path with good abilities.

 

[Jaedar]

I fucking hate Azata path. I picked it for the themes, when it was still just about the moon goddess and shit and now I have to suffer this retarded dragon all the other lgbtq+ inserts. I couldn't pin-point it at first, but now I can't unhear it: Arueshalae's VA sounds just like Amber Heard when trying to "tell the truth" on her stand.

• Baby dragon is cute. It also casts greater dispel with CL 40 (although I think the B-team nerfed this at some point?).
• LGBTQ insert is you reading something into it that isn't there. You can certainly argue they are mental cases, but I think it is more accurate to recognize them as True Heroes who don't let the fact that they're 80cm tall stop them from being better crusaders than anyone Galfrey would ever let within 10 km of a crusade (I wonder why she's been losing for 100+ years?)
• You are right that Desna is awesome, you wouldn't think the goddess of dreams and butterflies would be, but she is the only god to slay a demon lord , so if she's weak, what does that make the rest of the rabble?
• I think Aru has a good plot and character development if you follow her romance sidequest, without that her arc feels unearned. I like her VA, shame you don't I guess :shrug:. Even more of a shame if you let someone like Heard ruin the character for you. Aru is also not Azata specific, although very thematic since she follows Desna.

Azata is a good path with good abilities.

Yeah, arguably the strongest! Giving everyone in your party (including animal companions) 7 casts of changestaff (a level 7 spell) per rest at the main base is insane for when you get it.

I had way more fun with Azata than Lich, even though arcane omnipotence is usually more my style.

Jaedar is an Azata-enjoyer. I told him it made it a cuck, but I fear he is lost forever

Join the light side Grunker. We have cookie, sunshine and powers beyond the ken of the Gods themselves :3

(spoiler alert: the best power was friendship all along)

 

[Grunker]

"begone thot!"

 

[Haplo]

The move speed rage power is terrible.

Well, it isn't the best. But the question was how its possible to increase Move Speed - while practically having little-to-none level budget. Fast Move Rage Power would be one such solution, particularly if you offload it on another character (Skald). Also +30 Move Speed Translates to effective +90 Move range here (+50% from Mobility 1, X2 for both Move and Standard actions).

 

[Grunker]

Fuck, the Jeslyn fight was a motherfucker man, though still not as hard as the room with 2 Brimoraks in it which I have no idea how to beat if I don't get to level 6 before I have to leave the Garrison.

Also: when the fuck did Owlcat decide to do *actual dungeons*??? I fucking love this place. Yeah it's not insanely complicated, but each and every single room has something unique in it, the encounter design is insanely varied and it's generally just a blast to explore. This is some of my favorite content across the two games, period. And it's been so long since exploring a dungeon in an isometric RPG felt like an actual dungeon and not just 1 level cut short due to resource restraints.

EDIT: Also Bubble Buffs is my favorite thing ever in the entire universe and I'm going to marry the author

 

[InD_ImaginE]

Also: when the fuck did Owlcat decide to do *actual dungeons*???

Dungeons in WotR in general is much better than Kingmaker yes. Or a lot of recent non DRPG.

Once again something that heavily missing in penultimate chapter unfortunately.

 

[Cyberarmy]

Dungeons in Kingmaker and WotR are the best parts of the games. Even Nenio's dungeon would be great if it wasn't that long.

 

[Yosharian]

The move speed rage power is terrible.

Well, it isn't the best. But the question was how its possible to increase Move Speed - while practically having little-to-none level budget. Fast Move Rage Power would be one such solution, particularly if you offload it on another character (Skald). Also +30 Move Speed Translates to effective +90 Move range here (+50% from Mobility 1, X2 for both Move and Standard actions).

The reason its terrible is because it's an enhancement bonus so it doesn't stack with Expeditious Retreat, which you can easily obtain from a friendly Alchemist or BFT (and you should have at least one of those)

 

[Grunker]

Kingmaker "dungeons" were absolutely terrible IMO. Very short and full of rooms with copy-pasted enemies and no encounter design. Here every room has a completely unique encounter (like succubus or alchemist) which actually pose a unique challenge, there are multiple instances of variance based on formerly secured allies (though it is a little annoying that you have to keep them alive which is basically impossible on Unfair), a couple of different routes through the dungeon, a good deal of missable content, a puzzle that actually had me stop and think and wasn't just "push colored buttons in right order" etc. Don't think it merits any comparison to Kingmaker dungeons.

EDIT: Absolutely terrible might be too harsh, but they were certainly boring.

 

[Stoned Ape]

Fuck, the Jeslyn fight was a motherfucker man, though still not as hard as the room with 2 Brimoraks in it which I have no idea how to beat if I don't get to level 6 before I have to leave the Garrison.

Also: when the fuck did Owlcat decide to do *actual dungeons*??? I fucking love this place. Yeah it's not insanely complicated, but each and every single room has something unique in it, the encounter design is insanely varied and it's generally just a blast to explore. This is something of my favorite content across the two games, period. And it's been so long since exploring a dungeon in an isometric RPG felt like an actual dungeon and not just 1 level cut short due to resource restraints.

EDIT: Also Bubble Buffs is my favorite thing ever in the entire universe and I'm going to marry the author

There are a number of excellent dungeons/combat areas in the game. The Grey Garrison is great, but just wait until you get to the act 2 finale, I think it has the best design in the game.

 

[Jaedar]

There are a number of excellent dungeons/combat areas in the game. The Grey Garrison is great, but just wait until you get to the act 2 finale, I think it has the best design in the game.

I think the act 2 finale is really cool, but it's also at least twice as long as it should be.

 

[AwesomeButton]

Regardless of rest, I am finding Chap 1 a good bit harder than Prologue. This is because unlike the Prologue you can't oneshot any enemies - but all they need is one lucky hit to one-shot you.

I oneshotted quite a few dretches and cultists, for example in the tower of estrod. Level 4 party, Gendarme player character, core difficulty.

 

[AwesomeButton]

Camellia is basically as disappointing as me and Daidred predicted, lol. Crusader just doesn't really work as intended.

Heh, I took one level of Crusader after I saw your xls, but then I went "Nope!" - and back to Shaman