Gold Box SSI's Gold Box Series Thread

[EtcEtcEtc]

The character combat icon editor is quite nice. For such an old and low graphical game, you sure are able to make quite an an immersive looking party with a large enough selection of body parts and colors. I feel more immersed in my party of 2 framed sprites than the modern 3D cRPGs are able to provide.
.

It's pretty good, but get prepped if you play the rest of the goldbox games because those icons are going to be your only options for three of the Forgotten Realms games, two of the Krynn games, and one(? i believe) of the savage frontier games.

Assuming you plan to play the rest of the series, and if you like to tinker, download the Gold Box Companion - it's pretty great - http://gbc.zorbus.net/ - adds a lot of nice QOL things to the game and lets you import your own custom sprites as long as they fit whatever size the games run under.

 

[EtcEtcEtc]

I think for now I might be moving on to the first of the Krynn games before immediately continuing to CotAB, though I definitely plan on getting to that game as well eventually. I'm less familiar with Krynn as a setting (having only read the very first Dragonlance book) so any character tips are welcome. I looked a bit at the classes already and I'm probably gonna take a Knight, though I'm not entirely sure what separates them from a Fighter and Paladin, and I think I want a Cleric of Majere as their special ability is to Turn Undead at twice their level, which should be quite nice for wrecking undead enemies.

Honestly, having done a similar run - coming to them as a rookie welllllll after they were made - in 2014/15 - you might want to consider skipping a lot of the SSI ones besides Curse of the Azure Bonds and the first Krynn.

The remaining games range from decent to good, but none of them are amazing. And the more you play through the more likely you are to get burned out on the awesome engine.

I'd recommend skipping to Unlimited Adventures and getting some of the fan made campaigns. Specifically the realmz games. I did a few low level ones which were quick and alot of fun, and then played Temple of Elemental Evil which is LONG AS SHIT - and also on par with Pools of Radiance in awesomeness - and loved it. Unfortunately I had played through four-five other good to middling gold box games before, so I was pretty burnt out and never continued with some of his stuff.

I'm sure at the end of the day I'd rather have played Pools, TOEE and a bunch of other Realmz campaigns then Secret of the Silver Blades or Death Knight of Krynn.

 

[mediocrepoet]

The character combat icon editor is quite nice. For such an old and low graphical game, you sure are able to make quite an an immersive looking party with a large enough selection of body parts and colors. I feel more immersed in my party of 2 framed sprites than the modern 3D cRPGs are able to provide.
.

It's pretty good, but get prepped if you play the rest of the goldbox games because those icons are going to be your only options for three of the Forgotten Realms games, two of the Krynn games, and one(? i believe) of the savage frontier games.

I tended to find that if I try to make the characters look good, I end up with a bunch of guys that look more or less the same (because I'm artistically retarded). So I usually just give everyone a different weapon and then try to have blue guy, green guy, etc. Head and hair colours being the same is pretty much a given.

On a related (but off topic note), I remember trying City of Heroes on my buddy's account back in the day and he was laughing when I had to design my superhero costume and I ended up with a guy who was basically all monotone brown. Brown coat, brown hat, etc.

 

[Zed Duke of Banville]

Knights are easily the best warrior types in the game. They can use the best non-magical armour and at higher levels they are almost as good as a Cleric when it comes to spell casting.
Paladins feel like an anachronism to me, at least based on my knowledge of Krynn from the Dragonlance books.

Paladins were explicitly permitted as a character class in the Dragonlance Adventures campaign setting book, although they are clearly superfluous given the prominence of the Knights of Solamnia, who comprise three related classes, with Knights of the Sword even possessing clerical abilities similar to paladins.

 

[Dorateen]

Furthermore, Margaret Weiss in the annotated Chronicles referred to Sturm Brightblade saying, "he was our paladin", meaning that an aspiring Knight of Solamnia filled that class role in a narrative sense.

 

[Null Null]

Majere clerics turn as two levels higher, not twice the level.

The DBF thing is interesting.

The one advantage the Paladin over the Knight is the ability to turn undead, which comes in handy in Death Knights with its many undead.

As far as party design: are you planning to carry the same party through all three games? Level limits can trip you up, though not as troublesome as in the Forgotten Realms games. In Krynn games, elves can max out as clerics, rangers, thieves (Qualinesti only) and mages, half-elves as clerics and thieves, dwarves as fighters, and kender as thieves.

Kender have a cap of level 12 as clerics, and with a wisdom of 16 can't get 6th or 7th level spells (though they can get 6th level spells in Death Knights because they goofed), but with the taunt ability are part of the fun of the Krynn games. Note that turn ability peaks at level 14, though, so if you have a kender cleric of Majere they can get maximum turn ability at least.

You want to have at least one white and one red mage, because they get slightly different spells. At least one neutral cleric is useful in Death Knights because good clerics can't get 7th level spells in that game due to a poorly chosen level cutoff.

You can't change human class in Krynn games, so forget about the ranger->mage trick.

There are also subtle differences in optimal balance between the games. For Champions it's nice to have a few mages so you can spam the mobs of draconians with fireballs and make at least some of them go boom. For Death Knights (the middle entry) there are a shitload of undead, so it's good to have three or four clerics. A single-class mage becomes useful in Dark Queen of Krynn because the XP curve turns linear at high levels, so your just-a-mage starts casting spells at 8 or 10 levels higher than his multiclassed comrades by the end of the game, rather than 1 or 2 levels higher as before. This makes a big difference fighting mobs of extra-strength Draconians. Obviously it's hard to have all of these in a party with six members, so there are all kinds of tradeoffs.

Adds replayability, of course--my default Death Knights of Krynn party of knight, paladin, ranger/cleric, cleric/thief, and cleric/fighter/red mage and cleric/fighter/white mage had an easier time in that game than my three-game party of knight, cleric/ranger x2, cleric/thief, and white mage and red mage, but my single-class mages made short work of the draconian mobs in the last game. So it's all up to you.

 

[Cael]

Welp, I finished PoR. What an absolutely amazing game. The penultimate fight against the group of 8th level fighters was harder than Tyranthraxus, but it was still a fight that made me sweat a little bit. The Hill Giant pots I had been hoarding were likely what saved me in the dragon fight as they allowed my best fighter and f/m hybrid to hit him consistently. After a few rounds of missing, drinking pots and then whacking the dragon down he went. The praise the game has gotten is well deserved, this is definitely one of the better RPGs I've played.

I think for now I might be moving on to the first of the Krynn games before immediately continuing to CotAB, though I definitely plan on getting to that game as well eventually. I'm less familiar with Krynn as a setting (having only read the very first Dragonlance book) so any character tips are welcome. I looked a bit at the classes already and I'm probably gonna take a Knight, though I'm not entirely sure what separates them from a Fighter and Paladin, and I think I want a Cleric of Majere as their special ability is to Turn Undead at twice their level, which should be quite nice for wrecking undead enemies.

Knights of the Crown are basically Fighters with an extra HD.

Knights of the Sword/Rose are basically Fighter/Clerics, and their XP requirements reflect this. You cannot go above level 18 as a Sword, but can as a Rose. So, basically, there is no point going Rose until towards the end of DQK.

Knights of the Sword/Rose completely outclass Paladins due to them getting more and higher level spells than Paladins. Turn Undead and Lay on Hands is not enough to counter Blade Barrier, Heal and Resurrect (or even Cure Critical). In setting, Knights only come from Solamnia. Everyone else gets Paladins. But in the game, it doesn't matter.

To make things easier for you, have at least one Red Robe with you. You'd want their crazy low XP requirements in DQK as their higher level mean you do more damage (there is no cap on damage with spells in GB, as far as I can tell) and better spell resistance penetration. Elven Fighter/Mages can cast in armour, so you don't really lose much having a Qualinesti Fighter/Red Robe on your team. A Qualinesti Thief/Mage will level faster than a Knight of the Rose and not that much slower than a Ranger or Paladin, so if you want a thief in your party, that should be your go to option.

Speaking of elves, forget about Silvanestis. Qualinesti elves get up to level 14 Fighter, which is exactly where you get 2 attacks per round. Silvanestis don't, plus they are arrogant dicks.

 

[Hobo Elf]

I've drafted my party for Champions of Krynn but one slot still remains a mystery. Is there any benefit to taking a pure single class Fighter over a Knight? I already have one Knight in my party but I have no idea if I'm better served taking a 2nd Knight or if there is something that the Fighter brings to the table. I tried reading up the manuals but it seems like Fighter is just multi fodder.

 

[octavius]

A Dwarf Fighter has the potentially highest HP of all classes and thus can do most damage when wielding a Dragonlance. But that's very marginal.
For multi-classing Elves Ranger is a better choice, so that kind of leaves a Dwarf Fighter/Thief, but I'd much rather have a Kender as a Thief.
Personally I only include a Fighter (Dwarf) due to my play style of having all races and classes represented if possible, instead of power gaming.

 

[Hobo Elf]

A Dwarf Fighter has the potentially highest HP of all classes and thus can do most damage when wielding a Dragonlance. But that's very marginal.
For multi-classing Elves Ranger is a better choice, so that kind of leaves a Dwarf Fighter/Thief, but I'd much rather have a Kender as a Thief.
Personally I only include a Fighter (Dwarf) due to my play style of having all races and classes represented if possible, instead of power gaming.

This is kind of where I am at. My other obvious choices were Fighter/Mage or Fighter/Cleric, but it feels slightly cheesy to have so many multiclassed characters. I was just curious if a Fighter brings anything unique to the table or not. I'll probably just pick a fighter type character I want just for fun. I just didn't want to pick anything that might become obsolete.

 

[DavidBVal]

Okay, since some of you guys seem to be starting the Krynn series, I think I'll give it a go as well.

Reading the manual/journal has been pretty fun, Dragonlance brings so many memories!

I rolled the following party. I don't want to be too overpowered so I won't edit the stats or HP:

2x Human Knight
1x Human Red Mage
1x Kender Cleric(Kiri-Jolith)/Thief
1x Qualinesti Fighter/White Mage
1x Qualinesti Fighter/Cleric (Majere)

By not modifying the characters, I ended up with no 18/00 characters and some 15-16 CON scores, plus some chars with relatively low hp.

Let's see how it goes!

 

[Cael]

A Dwarf Fighter has the potentially highest HP of all classes and thus can do most damage when wielding a Dragonlance. But that's very marginal.
For multi-classing Elves Ranger is a better choice, so that kind of leaves a Dwarf Fighter/Thief, but I'd much rather have a Kender as a Thief.
Personally I only include a Fighter (Dwarf) due to my play style of having all races and classes represented if possible, instead of power gaming.

This is kind of where I am at. My other obvious choices were Fighter/Mage or Fighter/Cleric, but it feels slightly cheesy to have so many multiclassed characters. I was just curious if a Fighter brings anything unique to the table or not. I'll probably just pick a fighter type character I want just for fun. I just didn't want to pick anything that might become obsolete.

Bear in mind there are a few things that are not documented anywhere in the manuals:
Dwarves get to wield a battle axe in one hand. All other races require two. This is actually significant in Treasures of the Savage Frontier, as the best weapons are +3 battle axes (longswords only go up to +2), IIRC. Not so much in the Krynn series as you get +4 longswords there.
Elves get to cast spells in armour. Other races cannot.
Only Kenders can wield hoopaks, and hoopaks are the only ranged weapon you can use adjacent to an enemy (of course, putting a low HP character into melee range is rather questionable in and of itself).

For the first Krynn game, you'd want at least a cleric as they are the only class with healing. Also, Krynn is very oriented towards multiclassing (due to the expanded level limits), unlike the FR games. If you want to enjoy multiclassing without cheats, Krynn is where you'd do it. Leave the single-class human-centric games to the FR series.

My standard party for a more RP experience is:
2x Human Knight
Human Cleric (replaced in the second game by Human Red Robe)
2x Elf Figher/White Robe
Elf Thief/Red Robe

If I want a challenge, I'd make a run with:
Human Knight
5x Elf Fighter/Cleric/Mage

 

[Null Null]

The hoopak has the additional advantage of being the only blunt weapon usable in a backstab--useful against Skel Warriors in Death Knights. (h/t Octavius)

 

[DavidBVal]

Is there any benefit to taking a pure single class Fighter over a Knight?

A minor one I just found after playing a bit: Knights can't sweep. Hardly relevant in the long run but there it is.

 

[Hobo Elf]

Is there any benefit to taking a pure single class Fighter over a Knight?

A minor one I just found after playing a bit: Knights can't sweep. Hardly relevant in the long run but there it is.

I finished the first floor of the first dungeon in CoN with my 2 Knights, Cleric/Ranger, Cleric/Fighter, White Mage, Red Mage party. I think I wanna redo it again and replace one of the Knights with a pure Fighter. The Knight is nice but their slow growth kind of sucks and they kept missing everything while the C/R and C/F killed everything. I now see the benefit of having a single classed Fighter as they'll just advance fast into a solid killing machine, which is something I want, and I'll let the Knight catch up later. I always find that the early levels in D&D are the toughest and most parties tend to even out toward the end, so having a smoother start is more important to me. Sweeping is a valuable skill to have as well since it might help me cut through the chaff and get to the more dangerous enemies hiding behind the back rows faster.

Anyway, having done the first floor of CoN there's a few impressions it left me:

-The dungeon design is a lot more complex now, which is nice. There are more events and things happening here.
-The world map makes overland traveling a more comfier experience. Wandering around and getting into easy random encounters wasn't that great in PoR, despite the world map not being that big.
-Towns are menu based, this is something I actually enjoy. I don't mind if towns are abstracted as pseudo dungeons in my crawlers, but I prefer them as menus.
-Sleep and Hold Person aren't so reliable anymore. Seems to be almost 50/50 if enemies resist them. I'm not against this by itself as they were really overpowered, but this leads to a slight problem in my next point.
-The encounters are harder than in PoR, but mostly because there are a few fights that throw in a couple of Clerics and Wizards who will Hold and Charm you. The only way to deal with them is to do it to them first. A few times this devolved into me just having to restart the fight a bunch of times because I lost simply due to the enemy either getting their spells off first or resisting my control attempts. Both my Mages are Human, so I'm thinking that making them into Elves might actually be more beneficial for the higher Initiative given through Elven bonus Dexterity.
-The moon alignment affecting my mages is kinda meh. It just buffs/debuffs the other mage periodically. It seems like a system that hurts the player more at the beginning of the game and later on as your characters get more levels matters a bit less. Well, the extra memorization slots will always be nice I guess.
-A lot of Cleric spells seem to be missing. No more Harm or Curse. Sucks.

 

[octavius]

- Throtl Keep is an excellent beginner dungeon.

- You'll soon enough find out that the overland map of CoK is the most boring of them all, with the possible exception of Gateway.

- Draconians have magic resistance in addition to their saving throws.

- Necklace of Missiles and Wands of Fireball used by one of your non-mage characters with highest Dex is a very nice weapon against groups of spell casters.

 

[Cael]

Is there any benefit to taking a pure single class Fighter over a Knight?

A minor one I just found after playing a bit: Knights can't sweep. Hardly relevant in the long run but there it is.

I finished the first floor of the first dungeon in CoN with my 2 Knights, Cleric/Ranger, Cleric/Fighter, White Mage, Red Mage party. I think I wanna redo it again and replace one of the Knights with a pure Fighter. The Knight is nice but their slow growth kind of sucks and they kept missing everything while the C/R and C/F killed everything. I now see the benefit of having a single classed Fighter as they'll just advance fast into a solid killing machine, which is something I want, and I'll let the Knight catch up later. I always find that the early levels in D&D are the toughest and most parties tend to even out toward the end, so having a smoother start is more important to me. Sweeping is a valuable skill to have as well since it might help me cut through the chaff and get to the more dangerous enemies hiding behind the back rows faster.

Anyway, having done the first floor of CoN there's a few impressions it left me:

-The dungeon design is a lot more complex now, which is nice. There are more events and things happening here.
-The world map makes overland traveling a more comfier experience. Wandering around and getting into easy random encounters wasn't that great in PoR, despite the world map not being that big.
-Towns are menu based, this is something I actually enjoy. I don't mind if towns are abstracted as pseudo dungeons in my crawlers, but I prefer them as menus.
-Sleep and Hold Person aren't so reliable anymore. Seems to be almost 50/50 if enemies resist them. I'm not against this by itself as they were really overpowered, but this leads to a slight problem in my next point.
-The encounters are harder than in PoR, but mostly because there are a few fights that throw in a couple of Clerics and Wizards who will Hold and Charm you. The only way to deal with them is to do it to them first. A few times this devolved into me just having to restart the fight a bunch of times because I lost simply due to the enemy either getting their spells off first or resisting my control attempts. Both my Mages are Human, so I'm thinking that making them into Elves might actually be more beneficial for the higher Initiative given through Elven bonus Dexterity.
-The moon alignment affecting my mages is kinda meh. It just buffs/debuffs the other mage periodically. It seems like a system that hurts the player more at the beginning of the game and later on as your characters get more levels matters a bit less. Well, the extra memorization slots will always be nice I guess.
-A lot of Cleric spells seem to be missing. No more Harm or Curse. Sucks.

That is a bit weird. A F/C or R/C should have a worse progression than a Knight of the Crown. In that setup, the Knights should be hitting as consistently as a F/C or R/C. Remember, though, that Knights are tanks, with an extra HD and the best AC in the game. They are designed that way.

But yes, you don't get many Cleric attack spells in the Krynn series. Clerics are there for Hold Person and as a healbot, mainly, which is why you can do without Clerics after the first game since the Fix command is a thing.

 

[DavidBVal]

Is there any benefit to taking a pure single class Fighter over a Knight?

A minor one I just found after playing a bit: Knights can't sweep. Hardly relevant in the long run but there it is.

I finished the first floor of the first dungeon in CoN with my 2 Knights, Cleric/Ranger, Cleric/Fighter, White Mage, Red Mage party. I think I wanna redo it again and replace one of the Knights with a pure Fighter. The Knight is nice but their slow growth kind of sucks and they kept missing everything while the C/R and C/F killed everything. I now see the benefit of having a single classed Fighter as they'll just advance fast into a solid killing machine, which is something I want, and I'll let the Knight catch up later. I always find that the early levels in D&D are the toughest and most parties tend to even out toward the end, so having a smoother start is more important to me. Sweeping is a valuable skill to have as well since it might help me cut through the chaff and get to the more dangerous enemies hiding behind the back rows faster.

Anyway, having done the first floor of CoN there's a few impressions it left me:

-The dungeon design is a lot more complex now, which is nice. There are more events and things happening here.
-The world map makes overland traveling a more comfier experience. Wandering around and getting into easy random encounters wasn't that great in PoR, despite the world map not being that big.
-Towns are menu based, this is something I actually enjoy. I don't mind if towns are abstracted as pseudo dungeons in my crawlers, but I prefer them as menus.
-Sleep and Hold Person aren't so reliable anymore. Seems to be almost 50/50 if enemies resist them. I'm not against this by itself as they were really overpowered, but this leads to a slight problem in my next point.
-The encounters are harder than in PoR, but mostly because there are a few fights that throw in a couple of Clerics and Wizards who will Hold and Charm you. The only way to deal with them is to do it to them first. A few times this devolved into me just having to restart the fight a bunch of times because I lost simply due to the enemy either getting their spells off first or resisting my control attempts. Both my Mages are Human, so I'm thinking that making them into Elves might actually be more beneficial for the higher Initiative given through Elven bonus Dexterity.
-The moon alignment affecting my mages is kinda meh. It just buffs/debuffs the other mage periodically. It seems like a system that hurts the player more at the beginning of the game and later on as your characters get more levels matters a bit less. Well, the extra memorization slots will always be nice I guess.
-A lot of Cleric spells seem to be missing. No more Harm or Curse. Sucks.

That is a bit weird. A F/C or R/C should have a worse progression than a Knight of the Crown. In that setup, the Knights should be hitting as consistently as a F/C or R/C. Remember, though, that Knights are tanks, with an extra HD and the best AC in the game. They are designed that way.

But yes, you don't get many Cleric attack spells in the Krynn series. Clerics are there for Hold Person and as a healbot, mainly, which is why you can do without Clerics after the first game since the Fix command is a thing.

A small self-correction: knights DO sweep after leveling up.

 

[KeighnMcDeath]

- Throtl Keep is an excellent beginner dungeon.

- You'll soon enough find out that the overland map of CoK is the most boring of them all, with the possible exception of Gateway.

- Draconians have magic resistance in addition to their saving throws.

- Necklace of Missiles and Wands of Fireball used by one of your non-mage characters with highest Dex is a very nice weapon against groups of spell casters.

Even so...i recall walking every step on those overland maps to thoroughly make sure i found everything esp all Krynn games. I'd have to revisit The Frontier games. You know, back then i was annoyed FR got fouble GB treatment and Greyhawk was ignored. I was annoyed that towards the end and a FRUA currencies became just 1 type with no lesser denominations. Meh.

 

[Hobo Elf]

That is a bit weird. A F/C or R/C should have a worse progression than a Knight of the Crown. In that setup, the Knights should be hitting as consistently as a F/C or R/C. Remember, though, that Knights are tanks, with an extra HD and the best AC in the game. They are designed that way.

But yes, you don't get many Cleric attack spells in the Krynn series. Clerics are there for Hold Person and as a healbot, mainly, which is why you can do without Clerics after the first game since the Fix command is a thing.

I noticed that while Fighters and Rangers have the more usual, gradual THAC0 progression, Knights seem to get a larger THAC0 bonus but only ever other level. That means that they'll lag behind THAC0. Later on when you have more magical gear it will be less of an issue, but at the start it does make things slightly rougher.

 

[Cael]

That is a bit weird. A F/C or R/C should have a worse progression than a Knight of the Crown. In that setup, the Knights should be hitting as consistently as a F/C or R/C. Remember, though, that Knights are tanks, with an extra HD and the best AC in the game. They are designed that way.

But yes, you don't get many Cleric attack spells in the Krynn series. Clerics are there for Hold Person and as a healbot, mainly, which is why you can do without Clerics after the first game since the Fix command is a thing.

I noticed that while Fighters and Rangers have the more usual, gradual THAC0 progression, Knights seem to get a larger THAC0 bonus but only ever other level. That means that they'll lag behind THAC0. Later on when you have more magical gear it will be less of an issue, but at the start it does make things slightly rougher.

That is not evident on my copy. My Knight and my Fighters all have the same THAC0, except when Clerics of Kiri-Jolith and elves (+1 to-hit with longswords) were involved.

 

[DavidBVal]

Question about Knights. I see no benefit in upgrading to Rose Knight in CoK at all, am I right? everything seems the same as Sword Knight up to level 8, and progression is way slower.

I just upgraded from Crown to Sword and maybe it was a mistake, since I see no benefit in doing so until you have 95,000 XP so you get to cast level 1 spells... and even that is a very doubtful advantage in a party which already has 2 clerics. Am I overlooking some other inherent advantage to upgrading the Knights to Sword and Rose here?

 

[Hobo Elf]

That is a bit weird. A F/C or R/C should have a worse progression than a Knight of the Crown. In that setup, the Knights should be hitting as consistently as a F/C or R/C. Remember, though, that Knights are tanks, with an extra HD and the best AC in the game. They are designed that way.

But yes, you don't get many Cleric attack spells in the Krynn series. Clerics are there for Hold Person and as a healbot, mainly, which is why you can do without Clerics after the first game since the Fix command is a thing.

I noticed that while Fighters and Rangers have the more usual, gradual THAC0 progression, Knights seem to get a larger THAC0 bonus but only ever other level. That means that they'll lag behind THAC0. Later on when you have more magical gear it will be less of an issue, but at the start it does make things slightly rougher.

That is not evident on my copy. My Knight and my Fighters all have the same THAC0, except when Clerics of Kiri-Jolith and elves (+1 to-hit with longswords) were involved.

My knight went from level 1 to 2 with the same THAC0 (17) and from 2 to 3 his THAC0 shot up to 15. Ranger and Fighter went through 17 > 16 > 15 > 14 with each level.

 

[Cael]

Question about Knights. I see no benefit in upgrading to Rose Knight in CoK at all, am I right? everything seems the same as Sword Knight up to level 8, and progression is way slower.

I just upgraded from Crown to Sword and maybe it was a mistake, since I see no benefit in doing so until you have 95,000 XP so you get to cast level 1 spells... and even that is a very doubtful advantage in a party which already has 2 clerics. Am I overlooking some other inherent advantage to upgrading the Knights to Sword and Rose here?

You aren't. The only advantage a Rose Knight has over Sword is that it can go beyond level 18. Sword Knights are capped at 18 (which is not mentioned anywhere in the manual, by the by).

You should only go from Crown to Sword when you get to retain the level of spellcasting (level 6 Sword, IIRC). The game auto-calculates the XP and your level when you switch orders, so you can drop levels if your current XP isn't high enough.

 

[Cael]

That is a bit weird. A F/C or R/C should have a worse progression than a Knight of the Crown. In that setup, the Knights should be hitting as consistently as a F/C or R/C. Remember, though, that Knights are tanks, with an extra HD and the best AC in the game. They are designed that way.

But yes, you don't get many Cleric attack spells in the Krynn series. Clerics are there for Hold Person and as a healbot, mainly, which is why you can do without Clerics after the first game since the Fix command is a thing.

I noticed that while Fighters and Rangers have the more usual, gradual THAC0 progression, Knights seem to get a larger THAC0 bonus but only ever other level. That means that they'll lag behind THAC0. Later on when you have more magical gear it will be less of an issue, but at the start it does make things slightly rougher.

That is not evident on my copy. My Knight and my Fighters all have the same THAC0, except when Clerics of Kiri-Jolith and elves (+1 to-hit with longswords) were involved.

My knight went from level 1 to 2 with the same THAC0 (17) and from 2 to 3 his THAC0 shot up to 15. Ranger and Fighter went through 17 > 16 > 15 > 14 with each level.

I will try to keep a look out on this when I next play the Krynn series. I just don't recall this.