Community The Age of Incline: RPG Codex's 2012-2016 GOTY Results

[Irenaeus]

Dude you are too retarded to go outside GD! Please don't embarrass your Favela.

You are too retarded to post anywhere.

Also, you are a vote fraudster.

 

[Lhynn]

lol
You're either dumb or just lying. The only "hobos" you can meet are cutthroats/muggers in the most dangerous part of the city, i.e. slums. Before you end up there you get a warning that it's a no-go zone and not even guards go there. And the encounter can be avoided even there (there are more encounters there and each of them can be avoided, which is stupid if you ask me but VD changed it some time ago due to complaints like yours, the only exception is when you piss Thieves guild off and mess with their affairs, then they send their enforcers after you and you have to fight if you go to their turf again).

Who gives a flying fuck about the context you retarded cunt, in case you didnt notice due to extreme autism, it wasnt the point of the conversation.

So you're complaining here that this game isn't like Skyrim where no matter what your build is you will be able to do everything anyway?

No you imbecile, that is not my complain. Your fanboyism is causing you to completely and utterly miss the point.

 

[Irenaeus]

Look, Underrail fanboys:

Age of Decadence is better than your game.

Acknowledge it.

 

[V_K]

Now I know that you can take the man out of a Favela but you cannot take Favela out him.

Thank you.

Yep, same here.
Tantrum-throwing Iren is the best Iren. I guess some people never grow up from their teens.

 

[toro]

Dude you are too retarded to go outside GD! Please don't embarrass your Favela.

You are too retarded to post anywhere.

Also, you are a vote fraudster.

How !?

 

[Vault Dweller]

Here is how the quest works. You start the game at the inn, the innkeeper tells you to go guard one of the guests, you can say sure or you can say I need to buy some weapons first. Then you go back, tell the innkeeper you're ready and go upstairs. After the guest is killed (that's one outcome you can't change but that's the intro basically), the innkeeper offers you to an optional quest. At this point you aren't offered another option to go and buy weapons because now it's the middle of the night and because you (the player) just did 5 min ago and nothing has changed.

I think the main problem with AoD, and this example is rather telling, is that you approach these things from narrative realism perspective rather than from gameplay perspective.

True but the alternative is to tell you that demons are coming through red portals and must be stopped now, then let you collect flowers and fight mudcrabs for the next 60 hours.

If I'm not misinterpreting your explanation (didn't play that path myself), the player is given the choice whether to buy new equipment before his first battle - i.e. at a point when he can't know whether his starting equipment is any good. Now right after that battle is over he can assess the quality of his equipment and make an informed decision whether he needs better things before starting another battle - but he can't buy it because narrative reasons. Granted, the second quest is optional and you can forgo it - buy why? Because at an earlier and completely unrelated point you made a decision that you didn't have enough information to make? It may make narrative sense, but it doesn't make any gameplay sense.

Well, look at it this way. You start the game, decide that you don't need any gear, go fight the assassin which is a tough intro fight (i.e. not filler). Odds are, you'll die once or twice and would have to consider buying a different weapon just to see if it fits your style more. If you manage to kill the assassin with the starting weapon, then you can easily face the thugs with that same weapon. So either way by the time the assassin is dead, you know how to fight and are comfortable with the weapon you have.

 

[Tito Anic]

I'm actually upper middle class and live far from Favelas.

There is no such thing in Brasil... my sweet negro man

 

[Gangrelrumbler]

Basically if a skills are useful at all times players won't hoard skill points, if they are useful only at specific instances then hoarding will be the dominant strategy.

but how can you make certain skills like persuasion, or intimidation, useful all the time?
W2 tried to do something like that, and it wasn't pretty

Yes that particular one bugged me too, even NV was unable to solve the issue. I think the best way to deal with that is to tie it somehow to the number of your companions or which companions you can recruit. Still if only one or two skills have this issue will the players still hoard skill points?

 

[Gangrelrumbler]

Now I know that you can take the man out of a Favela but you cannot take Favela out him.

Thank you.

Yep, same here.
Tantrum-throwing Iren is the best Iren. I guess some people never grow up from their teens.

Haha, happened to me too.

 

[felipepepe]

I don't mean to question the Codex's overall ratings, but I worry when I see a beat'em up like Chronicles of Mystara getting an average of "meh" as opposed to a punishing "1/5 what the fuck is this game doing on this poll". Also, there's a lot of bias towards JRPGs, I'm assuming from most of the same members. Would have been nice to have the voting divided between more traditional RPGs, Action RPGs, and JRPGs.

I guess I really expected the Codex to rate these games regarding some "RPG" parameter, but it seems like plenty of these are rated solely for the "fun" factor, particularly games like the Neptunia series (or maybe it was the boobs parameter). But cool results nonetheless.

Mystara is an awesome game that blenｄs beat'em'up with RPG very well. It's fun to search for secrets, battle iconic D&D monsters, use class & racial skills and choose / forge gear best suited for each boss battle.

Also, how do you rate games for their "RPG parameter"? Should DA:I be high for doing all the RPG stuff, while Heroine's Quest is a filthy hybrid so it should be poorly rated?

 

[V_K]

True but the alternative is to tell you that demons are coming through red portals and must be stopped now, then let you collect flowers and fight mudcrabs for the next 60 hours.

This has been addressed many times in the past. Wizardry 7 had competing parties that could beat you to quest items if you take too long. In Exile 3 (not sure about the remakes) cities would get overrun with monsters and destroyed, cutting you off services. In Challenge of the Five Realms (an otherwise very flawed game) darkness would run over locations one by one, cutting you off of them. In Arcatera (an otherwise shitty game) events would happen at certain time points irrespective of your actions (unless your actions were to prevent them from happening). Just a few examples off the top of my head.

 

[toro]

I don't mean to question the Codex's overall ratings, but I worry when I see a beat'em up like Chronicles of Mystara getting an average of "meh" as opposed to a punishing "1/5 what the fuck is this game doing on this poll". Also, there's a lot of bias towards JRPGs, I'm assuming from most of the same members. Would have been nice to have the voting divided between more traditional RPGs, Action RPGs, and JRPGs.

I guess I really expected the Codex to rate these games regarding some "RPG" parameter, but it seems like plenty of these are rated solely for the "fun" factor, particularly games like the Neptunia series (or maybe it was the boobs parameter). But cool results nonetheless.

Mystara is an awesome game that blenｄs beat'em'up with RPG very well. It's fun to search for secrets, battle iconic D&D monsters, use class & racial skills and choose / forge gear best suited for each boss battle.

Also, how do you rate games for their "RPG parameter"? Should DA:I be high for doing all the RPG stuff, while Heroine's Quest is a filthy hybrid so it should be poorly rated?

You rate each RPG based on the number of active shills. It seems it's accepted.

 

[V_K]

Also, how do you rate games for their "RPG parameter"? Should DA:I be high for doing all the RPG stuff, while Heroine's Quest is a filthy hybrid so it should be poorly rated?

HQ has more stats than DAI!

 

[Sigourn]

Mystara is an awesome game that blenｄs beat'em'up with RPG very well. It's fun to search for secrets, battle iconic D&D monsters, use class & racial skills and choose / forge gear best suited for each boss battle.

Also, how do you rate games for their "RPG parameter"? Should DA:I be high for doing all the RPG stuff, while Heroine's Quest is a filthy hybrid so it should be poorly rated?

Oh, never mind that regarding Mystara, the moment I read "arcade" and "beat'em up" alongside "side scrolling" in Wikipedia I assume it was a fairly basic Mortal Kombat-type of game, but with moar sidescrolling.

Regarding the second question: I assumed just like you would rate a game for the "best cRPGs of all time" poll. I haven't played them, but I can't begin to imagine how the Neptunia series can be as good as they make them look like in the poll, so maybe someone could explain to me.

 

[Gangrelrumbler]

Oh, never mind that regarding Mystara, the moment I read "arcade" and "beat'em up" alongside "side scrolling" in Wikipedia I assume it was a fairly basic Mortal Kombat-type of game, but with moar sidescrolling.

Regarding the second question: I assumed just like you would rate a game for the "best cRPGs of all time" poll. I haven't played them, but I can't begin to imagine how the Neptunia series can be as good as they make them look like in the poll, so maybe someone could explain to me.

Beat-em up games are not very similar to Mortal Kombat or other 2D fighting games, the best way to describe them for someone who never played them is 2D, simplier but more skill based Dynasty Warriors.

Neptunia is quite simple, either you enjoy the humour and the characters and will like the games or you don't and will hate them. Only people very into anime J-rpgs played them so they are the only people rating them, which leads to a very high rating, it's not a mystery. The big mystery of this pool everyone should be thinking about is Elminage Gothic. It's a game only for hardcore Wizardry fans and according to our hardocre Wizardry fans from the Wizardry thread it's the best Wizardry-like game ever. Yet the ratings are very low. Is Codex overrun by poseurs?

 

[gaussgunner]

This point can easily be explained. If you fail an encounter you need to do some thinking, readjust your strategy, change your equipment, try different thing etc.

you playing it like it is some fucking combat strategy game
but if you don't know how to manage character sheet/your skill points(how to use your char strentghs and weaknesses) and predict skill checks, then that means you can't into real RPGs

Once upon a time before playing it, I had the impression that AoD was the perfect RPG with C&C and good turnbased tactical combat. Nope, a lot of the fights are traps; you have to reload and make different choices to avoid them.

It's like an autistic life choices simulation. "If only I could go back 20 years and say the right thing in a few mundane conversations, I'd be a winner now..." (As opposed to not being such a dweeb, manning up, working harder, mastering relevant skills, telling assholes to go fuck themselves, and NOT avoiding violence at all costs.)

every fucking game which has skill checks has this problem
from fallout to aod
the only difference is that most other games are retardedly easy

hmmm... I think a game with skill checks should encourage you to dump points into a few skills you want to master, instead of hoarding & micromanaging.
- Don't display exact skill checks (FO3... also Bloodlines hacking & lockpicking).
- 1 point should not make the difference between success and failure.
- Provide choices for two levels of the same skill, so if your skill is marginal you can get the less attractive option.
- Different skill sets should lead to very different gameplay paths (not just avoiding some fights as in Bloodlines).
- Difficulty is a legitimate difference. No need to balance all paths. Some for noobs, some for masochists.

 

[felipepepe]

The big mystery of this pool everyone should be thinking about is Elminage Gothic. It's a game only for hardcore Wizardry fans and according to our hardocre Wizardry fans from the Wizardry thread it's the best Wizardry-like game ever. Yet the ratings are very low. Is Codex overrun by poseurs?

Well, that's the fun of the poll - seeing what's consensus and what's a very noisy minority of zealots.

Elminage had reasonably well-played, but very few people found it 5/5. Most just rated it 4/5 or 3/5, which isn't bad, but is no must-play either. Strangers in Sword City had a better reception, probably because it's much more friendly and eases players in. I personally think that E:G often confuses being hardcore with being unpolished. You're not a better old-school RPG just because you're intentionally frustrating new players.

 

[makiavelli747]

hmmm... I think a game with skill checks should encourage you to dump points into a few skills you want to master, instead of hoarding & micromanaging.
- Don't display exact skill checks (FO3... also Bloodlines hacking & lockpicking).
- 1 point should not make the difference between success and failure.
- Provide choices for two levels of the same skill, so if your skill is marginal you can get the less attractive option.
- Different skill sets should lead to very different gameplay paths (not just avoiding some fights as in Bloodlines).
- Difficulty is a legitimate difference. No need to balance all paths. Some for noobs, some for masochists.

Well, I can only agree to this. But that is just a nice theory. Remember you still need to make skills and stuff matter..

 

[Irenaeus]

Spoiler

 

[Rivmusique]

Nope, a lot of the fights are traps; you have to reload and make different choices to avoid them.

False

 

[gaussgunner]

True but the alternative is to tell you that demons are coming through red portals and must be stopped now, then let you collect flowers and fight mudcrabs for the next 60 hours.

This has been addressed many times in the past. Wizardry 7 had competing parties that could beat you to quest items if you take too long. In Exile 3 (not sure about the remakes) cities would get overrun with monsters and destroyed, cutting you off services. In Challenge of the Five Realms (an otherwise very flawed game) darkness would run over locations one by one, cutting you off of them. In Arcatera (an otherwise shitty game) events would happen at certain time points irrespective of your actions (unless your actions were to prevent them from happening). Just a few examples off the top of my head.

I remember that in W7. Time limits (or turn count limits) are an annoying mechanic. Pointless realism. I think it's fine to let you wander around until they feel like doing the main quest (or choosing between alternate mainline quests) to advance the plot. That's player agency / freedom.

 

[makiavelli747]

I remember that in W7. Time limits (or turn count limits) are an annoying mechanic. Pointless realism. I think it's fine to let you wander around until they feel like doing the main quest (or choosing between alternate mainline quests) to advance the plot. That's player agency / freedom.

Its not a freedom, freedom is when you can complete the game without solving certain quests and when you are not punished for such behavior. Thus quests should not reward a player.

 

[V_K]

I remember that in W7. Time limits (or turn count limits) are an annoying mechanic. Pointless realism. I think it's fine to let you wander around until they feel like doing the main quest (or choosing between alternate mainline quests) to advance the plot. That's player agency / freedom.

And that's precisely why I didn't list a single game with a hard time limit, only those that do some creative and interesting things with the idea.
Racing and later tracking competing parties was fun in how it mixed scripted and emergent/procedural narratives. It's a pity we only saw an echo of that concept and only in fully-procedural games.

 

[CryptRat]

It looks like people who rated Void Pyramid enjoyed it, 15 over 16 players gave it at least 3.
Personally I think it's very cool to have some indie making small free games coming with an unusual RPG (definitely not for everyone's taste) of its own instead of making another roguelike or hack&slash.
The game is compact but interesting in its approach and full of content, more or less what I'm expecting from a free game.

 

[an Administrator]

The big mystery of this pool everyone should be thinking about is Elminage Gothic. It's a game only for hardcore Wizardry fans and according to our hardocre Wizardry fans from the Wizardry thread it's the best Wizardry-like game ever. Yet the ratings are very low. Is Codex overrun by poseurs?

Because the game is so damn hard. Most Codexers who rated Witcher 3 5/5 won't get past the first dungeon in E:G.