The Eye of the Beholder Thread

[Elwro]

I think it is mandatory to use them at some point. However, don't expect to become able to use all the seemingly available options.

Also, back your save up. I think I locked myself in once using those portals

 

[Unkillable Cat]

In a desperate attempt to clear my backlog, I'm playing Eye of the Beholder for the first time and I think I can't hold my questions anymore:

1 - Exploring the level where mind flayers start mass-drugging and raping your party, I found a spellbook on a corpse. Can I somehow use it to learn new spells or are books just tools to cast the ones you already know?

2 - Is it possible to progress without using the portals that require "stone" items? I tried to ignore them at first, but I got stuck in the drow level and had to backtrack and use them to keep going down. I'm curious if that's the intended way to progress in the dungeon or if I just missed some mandatory keys.

1 - The spellbooks are just tools to cast spells. IIRC there's a Mage Scroll on that same corpse, you can possibly learn a spell from that.

2 - No. The only way to reach the final level is through a stone portal. The key is on the same level as the mind flayers, so you haven't missed out on anything (yet). That said, that's the only portal needed to beat the game - you can skip using the others, but it will make travel easier once you figure them out. The only way back is also through a stone portal, and the key for that is also on the same level as the mind flayers, but it's quite well hidden. (Before you ask - no, there is no Stone Gem in the game.)

As for the Drow levels, there is a 'marathon' of sorts in there which requires a lot of keys - most of which can be found within it, but those keys also open doors elsewhere on the Drow-levels, meaning you may have used the 'wrong' key in the wrong place. Don't worry - as long as you can find the intended key, you can then run with that to the other lock(s) if needed. You can't get soft-locked unless you're really striving for it.

The stone portals are mostly a sort of 'mass transit'-system to allow the player to move quickly about the place, and they can allow a player to mostly skip the Drow-section.

EotB1's dungeon is very open-ended in design, but can get a little confusing at times.

 

[Desiderius]

In a desperate attempt to clear my backlog, I'm playing Eye of the Beholder for the first time and I think I can't hold my questions anymore:

1 - Exploring the level where mind flayers start mass-drugging and raping your party, I found a spellbook on a corpse. Can I somehow use it to learn new spells or are books just tools to cast the ones you already know?

2 - Is it possible to progress without using the portals that require "stone" items? I tried to ignore them at first, but I got stuck in the drow level and had to backtrack and use them to keep going down. I'm curious if that's the intended way to progress in the dungeon or if I just missed some mandatory keys.

Part of the fun is finding the secret quest on each lvl and activating the portals so that you can easily move between lvls.

 

[NJClaw]

I just finished this and I have to say it holds up surprisingly well, especially considering there's no nostalgia involved on my part. I had a lot of fun exploring the dungeon, falling for obvious traps (like stepping on a plate and finding my retreat path closed off, or sidestepping to avoid a fireball and ending up falling down a hole), and finding out intuitive interactions to solve problems (starting from the very obvious and banal "throwing a stone to activate a pressure plate"). However, apart from very few moments (like deleting an entire group of kenku with my first fireball, or having to face overpowered enemies without being able to flee), combat is REALLY weird. Dancing around enemies without giving them a chance to retaliate almost felt like cheating, but the alternative would have been to rest every two fights to recover my HP and that sounds even worse.

To my surprise, this was a very short game. I fooled around a lot, looking for switches and illusionary walls, and it still took me around 15 hours to finish it. I guess drawing conclusions on a 30 years old game sounds ridiculous, but I wasn't even a thought when this came out and the only similar game I played so far was Legend of Grimrock, so this was all new to me. I will probably replay it soon with the mapping tool enabled to see how much I missed (which I guess is a lot).

 

[Desiderius]

It’s short if you’re used to it. When I first played it is was my first blobber (first Gold Box level blobber) and took me forever simply to clear first three levels. Was genuinely surprised to discover there was a fourth, let alone a twelfth.

 

[Unkillable Cat]

I just finished this and I have to say it holds up surprisingly well, especially considering there's no nostalgia involved on my part. I had a lot of fun exploring the dungeon, falling for obvious traps (like stepping on a plate and finding my retreat path closed off, or sidestepping to avoid a fireball and ending up falling down a hole), and finding out intuitive interactions to solve problems (starting from the very obvious and banal "throwing a stone to activate a pressure plate"). However, apart from very few moments (like deleting an entire group of kenku with my first fireball, or having to face overpowered enemies without being able to flee), combat is REALLY weird. Dancing around enemies without giving them a chance to retaliate almost felt like cheating, but the alternative would have been to rest every two fights to recover my HP and that sounds even worse.

To my surprise, this was a very short game. I fooled around a lot, looking for switches and illusionary walls, and it still took me around 15 hours to finish it. I guess drawing conclusions on a 30 years old game sounds ridiculous, but I wasn't even a thought when this came out and the only similar game I played so far was Legend of Grimrock, so this was all new to me. I will probably replay it soon with the mapping tool enabled to see how much I missed (which I guess is a lot).

Good to hear.

To give proper context, Eye of the Beholder was gunning for a gaming gimmick only a handful of RPGs had managed to accomplish at that point in time - immersive real-time movement. Gone were the days when only a message box told you in text form that you were facing 4 Kobolds and 2 Wargs, or that you would be battling these monsters in some abstract turn-based boardgame interface - no, Eye of the Beholder was made by people who saw Dungeon Master and thought "Look at all the money it's making! We have to try and do better!"

So when you look at the (small) viewscreen of EotB, you will know how many Kobolds you're fighting, because that's how many you'll be seeing. The game world is still a grid-based boardgame affair, but at least they're trying to hide it.

Both Dungeon Master and Eye of the Beholder contributed to the push to make games immersive and real-time. Turn-based still had its charm (and still does) but to the average Joe Gamer something that's realistic is always more fun than having to sit and wait your turn.

Finally, if you're going to have a crack at the sequel, know that it is a much more linear affair - you'll start in a central hub of sorts, and from there following 'branches' of dungeons to their end, before returning to the central hub. The branches must always be done in the same order. And there are several times when you can get both soft- and hardlocked. (But then again, EotB2 was a rushed production, c'est la vie.)

 

[Zed Duke of Banville]

To my surprise, this was a very short game. I fooled around a lot, looking for switches and illusionary walls, and it still took me around 15 hours to finish it. I guess drawing conclusions on a 30 years old game sounds ridiculous, but I wasn't even a thought when this came out and the only similar game I played so far was Legend of Grimrock, so this was all new to me. I will probably replay it soon with the mapping tool enabled to see how much I missed (which I guess is a lot).

There is an even better game, similar to Legend of Grimrock, that you could be playing, and it's even available for free (without being illegal).

 

[Nixheb]

> But then again, EotB2 was a rushed production, c'est la vie.)
Unkillable Cat is there any available source that documents this ? I've heard this several times, but never from a 'genuine source'.

 

[gamerguy]

These games would be perfect for the Switch touchscreen imo. I'd pay for them in a second.

 

[vitellus]

There is an even better game, similar to Legend of Grimrock, that you could be playing, and it's even available for free (without being illegal)

i love me a good blobber, tell me the name of said game please!

 

[gamerguy]

which one had that segment where you lose your stuff deep in that swimming section

never felt so hopelessly lost in a deep dungeon


fucking epic <3

 

[ELEXmakesMeHard]

These games would be perfect for the Switch touchscreen imo. I'd pay for them in a second.

You'd pay for... this? At least it's not console.

which one had that segment where you lose your stuff deep in that swimming section

never felt so hopelessly lost in a deep dungeon

I replayed EOB1+2 earlier this year, and have no memory of this.

 

[Unkillable Cat]

> But then again, EotB2 was a rushed production, c'est la vie.)
Unkillable Cat is there any available source that documents this ? I've heard this several times, but never from a 'genuine source'.

Nothing official sadly, but one only needs to look at the time between EotB1's release (early 1991) and EotB2's release (late 1991) and to see how long the 'errata'-document (can't remember its proper name right now) that came with the game in the box, to see they had to rush it.

I've also taken a deep dive into the game using cheats and looked into the code, and there's plenty of cut content in there.

which one had that segment where you lose your stuff deep in that swimming section

never felt so hopelessly lost in a deep dungeon

I replayed EOB1+2 earlier this year, and have no memory of this.

The underwater section is in EotB3 (Mage Guild Lvl 4), and just before that (Mage Guild Lvl 2) there's a place where every character's items are dumped on the ground, while made to fight two mobs of the game's weakest monsters.

 

[gamerguy]

I mean, it's a 30ish year old memory (jesus), but the relief of escaping that sequence was very real for me.

... unless you called the SSI 1-900 help number, you were pretty much on your own back then

 

[pjs]

> But then again, EotB2 was a rushed production, c'est la vie.)
Unkillable Cat is there any available source that documents this ? I've heard this several times, but never from a 'genuine source'.

Nothing official sadly, but one only needs to look at the time between EotB1's release (early 1991) and EotB2's release (late 1991) and to see how long the 'errata'-document (can't remember its proper name right now) that came with the game in the box, to see they had to rush it.

I've also taken a deep dive into the game using cheats and looked into the code, and there's plenty of cut content in there.

This is actually a bit surprising, because EOB2 seems to be the longest game of them all. Speedruns aren't everything, but EOB1 has been completed in 5 minutes, EOB2 in 1.5 hours and EOB3 in less than 30 minutes. Not that many actually have tried to do those, except EOB1.

 

[Zed Duke of Banville]

There is an even better game, similar to Legend of Grimrock, that you could be playing, and it's even available for free (without being illegal)

i love me a good blobber, tell me the name of said game please!

Click the second link in my signature.

 

[Trippy]

These games would be perfect for the Switch touchscreen imo. I'd pay for them in a second.

The first two are fully supported in ScummVM, and ScummVM has an easy touchscreen-supported Android version that works with them perfectly.

In other words, I bought the trilogy off of GOG and then most definitely played the first two as touchscreen games on an Android tablet through ScummVM because I am a degenerate madman.

Dunno why the third game isn't supported, though.

(Also technically all DOS games ever made are de facto 'touchscreen games' if you know how to configure Magic DosBox on any reasonably sized Android device, but that's another conversation I guess. I'm currently playing "Fantasy General" and "Clouds of Xeen" as 'touchscreen games' on my phone).

 

[octavius]

Click the second link in my signature.

But the Amiga version is the superior one. It's the only one with directional sound, isn't it?

 

[Unkillable Cat]

I mean, it's a 30ish year old memory (jesus), but the relief of escaping that sequence was very real for me.

The truly harrowing part about the underwater segment, was that in order to move around without taking considerable damage you needed the 'Water Breathing'-spell... so as long as your Mage was up and about, everything was fine.
Someone clearly thought of this, which is why 1/3rd of the underwater level has a anti-magic field in it...

This is actually a bit surprising, because EOB2 seems to be the longest game of them all. Speedruns aren't everything, but EOB1 has been completed in 5 minutes, EOB2 in 1.5 hours and EOB3 in less than 30 minutes. Not that many actually have tried to do those, except EOB1.

EotB1 can be completed that fast because of how open-ended the dungeon is, and EotB3 can be completed quickly because a part of it is optional. EotB2 is on-rails the whole time. Nothing can be skipped, and some parts cannot even be returned to, so you're soft-locked if you miss out on a few key items there.

To give you an idea of the cut/missing content:

# Cutscenes for resurrected characters. EotB1 could do this, why not the sequel? Amber is Khelben's spy in the temple, yet she has nothing to say when you bring her back from the dead?

# The fourth and fifth stone portals. There's a stone portal in the main temple which serves as a nexus point for the other portals. Another is at the bottom of the temple (the level with the gelatinous cubes) which uses the Stone Gem, and one in the Azure Tower (the level with the Frost Giants) which uses the Stone Dagger. The game files also have the Stone Holy Symbol, the Stone Necklace and the Stone Orb. If you cheat them into your inventory and use them on any of the portals, the Stone Holy Symbol will send you right to the end of the game, only one door away from Dran. If you use the other two, the stone portal-activation animation will play, but nothing else happens (except the graphics go all screwy). The Silver Tower (the test of faith-levels) doesn't have a stone portal so that can account for one of the remaining stone items, but that leaves one... where was its intended destination?

# This text is in the game files:

“You think you are the best
my master should have guessed
you dance the jester's path
are you wolf, or are you calf?”

Yet I cannot recall ever having seen it in-game. Anyone?

The first two are fully supported in ScummVM, and ScummVM has an easy touchscreen-supported Android version that works with them perfectly.

In other words, I bought the trilogy off of GOG and then most definitely played the first two as touchscreen games on an Android tablet through ScummVM because I am a degenerate madman.

Dunno why the third game isn't supported, though.

Different developers, different engines. The third game uses the AESOP-engine, which IIRC only one other game used (Dungeon Hack). That is the most likely explanation.

 

[KeighnMcDeath]

I can't recall if GoG stuffed Hack in with the EOB trilogy. It should have been imho.

Yeah, ASE is nice compared to the old dos way. EOB 1 has some interesting playtest rooms to mess with.

 

[Glop_dweller]

I once read a post by a player who claimed to have been unable to complete the game after playing EoB1 for five years.

*Funfact: The developers put a giant spider in the walls outside of the map on level 5, [presumably] so that the area would always play the spider's footstep sounds.

Funfact two: There is exactly one use (AFAIK) of a very well concealed button —not listed in the cluebook!—, on level 10. This button disables the mantis attack part of the special quest. I suspect it was there for developer testing, and forgotten about before the game shipped.

 

[KeighnMcDeath]

Ah yeah! "THAT FUCKING BUTTON!" And I already saved too after pushing it.

 

[Unkillable Cat]

I once read a post by a player who claimed to have been unable to complete the game after playing EoB1 for five years.

*Funfact: The developers put a giant spider in the walls outside of the map on level 5, [presumably] so that the area would always play the spider's footstep sounds.

It's actually two spiders, and they're inside the map, just in an inaccessible 2x2-room. There are empty shelves in that room as well.

Funfact two: There is exactly one use (AFAIK) of a very well concealed button —not listed in the cluebook!—, on level 10. This button disables the mantis attack part of the special quest. I suspect it was there for developer testing, and forgotten about before the game shipped.

This is one of the few things about EotB1 I have only recently heard of. I've yet to test it proper.

 

[Semiurge]

Didn't the original version of EOB1 have a that fun minigame in place of copyright protection where you needed to look for a correct symbol or a word from the manual? I recall that came pretty early on in the game, between levels 2 and three perhaps.

I don't remember encountering that later on with the abandonware version, GOG's release I have but haven't played yet. It must've been patched out eventually.

 

[KeighnMcDeath]

Code wheel? No, probably just book entries.

EOB
POOL
MOCAGH

Nada to the code wheel.