The Mass Effect 3/BioWare Thread

[Necroscope]

History (and shitty video game writing) has a habit of repeating itself:

Except that these are just some inconsistencies selectively picked from the story while the IT was at the time the only explanation that actually made any sense out of the totally absurd and abstract epilogue.

 

[Xor]

Except that these are just some inconsistencies selectively picked from the story

Exactly. There's no way to disprove it, though, because the people who believe it cling so tightly to those inconsistencies they refuse to consider anything that contradicts their viewpoint. It's sad, really - they're so desperate to believe the game had really good and subtle writing that they'll justify the most outlandish theories on nothing more than a few pieces of flimsy evidence and some inconsistencies, despite there being no actual evidence in or out of game that the writers intended it. It's why I gave up on this argument - there's no winning against these people, they'll always have another asspull. It's like trying to have a political conversation with a 9/11 truther.



Wait, what were we talking about again?

 

[Ninjerk]

Chemtrails, man...

 

[Lhynn]

Because overwhelming evidence points towards it. Still havent heard anything that contradicts it, and its more fitting than the DST (Drowned Sheep Theory), as the internal logic of the game supports it.

 

[Delterius]

I thought BioWare actually discarded the IT during development. Which means that, while may be a solid form of interpreting the games, it is still most likely derived from the optics of despaired fanboys during the Ending debacle. The theory was, after all, developed in order to show how the endings weren't shit instead of reinterpreting the rest of the game.

 

[Lhynn]

I thought BioWare actually discarded the IT during development. Which means that, while may be a solid form of interpreting the games, it is still most likely derived from the optics of despaired fanboys during the Ending debacle. The theory was, after all, developed in order to show how the endings weren't shit instead of reinterpreting the rest of the game.

Nope, never discarded it. What they discarded was the black energy ending, but that was a long way back, before ME3 i think, and because it got leaked.

 

[Chaotic_Heretic]

Jesus.... its that retarded and people bought the dlc?

 

[Akratus]

Because overwhelming evidence points towards it.

Still havent heard anything that contradicts it,

and its more fitting than the DST (Drowned Sheep Theory),

as the internal logic of the game supports it.

 

[Angthoron]

I thought the overwhelming evidence pointed to BioWare pushing out an enormous literary shitnugget.

But hey, it's okay, they'll retcon it to fit the fanbase theories in ME4, just like Valve has built HL2 "universe" on top of hundreds of fan theories. And then the fans will be happeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeey~ nya.

 

[Tytus]

I thought the overwhelming evidence pointed to BioWare pushing out an enormous literary shitnugget.

But hey, it's okay, they'll retcon it to fit the fanbase theories in ME4, just like Valve has built HL2 "universe" on top of hundreds of fan theories. And then the fans will be happeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeey~ nya.

If those theories won't be my theories I won't be happy. I want my Samara, Dr Chakwas, Shepard threeway mature post-game relationship.
I suspect other Bioware fans would rage about stuff like that too. They are too retarded to even have a hive-mind so any theory that contradicts their head canons will drive they insane.

 

[Chaotic_Heretic]

What does the Biowhore Lord Faggot Gaydar have to say about Indoctrination theory?

 

[Akratus]

Would have to be something along the liens of:

"We really appreciate the dedication of our amazing fans, but we can't make a definitive comment."

So nothing, really. Standard pr dribble.

 

[Tytus]

Some time ago during the thanksgiving Gayder wrote on his Twitter that if he eats some more mashed potatoes he will explode. Or some shit like that.

And I responded with - "Considering you wrote Fenris, please do".

And for some reason he started following my account and then a day later, stopped. This still is one of my proudest moments of trolling Bioware like a retard.

EDIT: Later not earlier, I'm a retard.

 

[Akratus]

Hah!

 

[Coyote]

Personally, I think it's pretty obvious that Liara was mind-controlling Shepard ever since she went all "EMBRACE ETERNITY" on his ass, manipulating him into serving the goal of galaxy-wide Asari supremacy by pointing him at their enemies, giving him visions of some made-up invaders, and feeding a god/martyr complex in which he was the only one who had the conviction to do what needed to be done, and everyone who saw through his lunacy was just blind to the real threat. There's no denying this unless you didn't play the game or weren't paying attention; I mean, it's RIGHT THERE. The plot holes and inconsistencies surrounding everything to do with the Reapers, hints throughout the series that Asari are constantly mind-raping other species and messing with their perceptions, Liara's manipulative nature as demonstrated in ME2, everything.

Still haven't heard anything that contradicts this.

 

[Tytus]

Personally, I think it's pretty obvious that Liara was mind-controlling Shepard ever since she went all "EMBRACE ETERNITY" on his ass, manipulating him into serving the goal of galaxy-wide Asari supremacy by pointing him at their enemies, giving him visions of some made-up invaders, and feeding a god/martyr complex in which he was the only one who had the conviction to do what needed to be done, and everyone who saw through his lunacy was just blind to the real threat. There's no denying this unless you didn't play the game or weren't paying attention; I mean, it's RIGHT THERE. The plot holes and inconsistencies surrounding everything to do with the Reapers, hints throughout the series that Asari are constantly mind-raping other species and messing with their perceptions, Liara's manipulative nature as demonstrated in ME2, everything.

Still haven't heard anything that contradicts this.

What about Morinth wouldn't her mind-raping and manipulation supersede Liara's mind rape? Especially that she was right beside him. The fact Shepard can resist her contradicts your theory! Ha!

 

[Coyote]

I have enhanced my previous post to make the intent clearer.

(But obviously, that's because Shepard was expecting Morinth to try and pull something, whereas he had no reason to suspect Liara at first. Plus, Morinth had to overpower two minds instead of just one, because Liara was deeply embedded in Shepard's psyche at that point. Objection overruled!)

 

[Tytus]

I have enhanced my previous post to make the intent clearer.

(But obviously, that's because Shepard was expecting Morinth to try and pull something, whereas he had no reason to suspect Liara at first. Plus, Morinth had to overpower two minds instead of just one, because Liara was deeply embedded in Shepard's psyche at that point. Objection overruled!)

Wrong! Liara was already removed from his mind. Samara was already manipulating him to kill her daughter. But I doubt she would as embed into Shepard's mind as Liara, they didn't spend as much time together and she didn't Eternity him. So if Shepard could resist Morinth without Liara in his Mind it only states that Samara was really strong ming controller but Shepard wasn't manipulated by Liara anymore!

 

[dextermorgan]

The IT bullshit is really jarring IMHO, since it clashes with portrayal of Reapers as ancient, invincible juggernauts that roflstomp known universe every once in a while. Overwhelming power renders subterfuge kinda pointless. Then again, Bioware pretty much raped the Reaper concept anyway.

 

[Spectacle]

What about the theory that the Reapers are really just a front for the Jews?

 

[DraQ]

as the internal logic of the game supports it.

Well, the game having no consistent internal logic can necessarily only support interpretations that involve protagonist having their head messed with.

 

[Necroscope]

Except that these are just some inconsistencies selectively picked from the story

Exactly. There's no way to disprove it, though, because the people who believe it cling so tightly to those inconsistencies they refuse to consider anything that contradicts their viewpoint. It's sad, really - they're so desperate to believe the game had really good and subtle writing that they'll justify the most outlandish theories on nothing more than a few pieces of flimsy evidence and some inconsistencies, despite there being no actual evidence in or out of game that the writers intended it. It's why I gave up on this argument - there's no winning against these people, they'll always have another asspull. It's like trying to have a political conversation with a 9/11 truther.

Yes, however, in case of FF8 the ending is plain and simple given the overall tone of the game as well as the in-game logic; in fact it's a textbook example of a happy ending that should leave the player doubtless as to what happened. The guy who made that video is simply overthinking it and constructing a theory for the sake of creating a theory (not to mention there's a simpler way of proving that Squall could be dead should you really want to). When it comes to Mass Effect 3 the endings were not even vague - they were just literally absurd; to the point of showing the protagonist dying and then supposedly alive, same as the squadmates who should be on Earth either dead or severely injured on the deck of the Normandy for no apparent reason. Hence I don't blame players for coming up with the IT, especially that it was well grounded, based on facts and correctly inferred, logical conclusions. Even the scene with Shepard waking up and taking a breath made sense after choosing to destroy the enemy -- which was the goal since the first game -- as a result of withstanding the indoctrination attempt. Moreover when the thing exploded Bioware become very cryptic and vague about the issue, sending various signals via twitter and other media that there's something more to it than wishful thinking. And at that point they had a perfect opportunity to render themselves good writers in the eyes of the fans as well as a perfect material for the next game.

But that ship has already sailed. After both the EC and Leviathan it's obvious that the RGB endings were intended to be the endings and various comments from the devs themselves as well as the devs diary confirmed the IT to be untrue.

I thought BioWare actually discarded the IT during development.

The idea was to make a scene in which the player loses control over indoctrinated Shepard, but never managed to implement it.

 

[Delterius]

I thought BioWare actually discarded the IT during development.

The idea was to make a scene in which the player loses control over indoctrinated Shepard, but never managed to implement it.

If true I suppose this is actually really funny. The theory rides on a gigantic presumption that BioWare was really subtle when in actuality they wouldn't have been if only they could.

 

[Necroscope]

Exactly. Walters and Hudson wouldn't be able to write their way out of a porn movie.

 

[Jick Magger]

I can understand them believing it at the time. But still believing that all of it's still valid, despite the fact that most primary evidence that it was possible having been cleaned out by the extended cut, and what remains relying on a shitton of vague assumptions. How do we know that Kai Leng was 'more indoctrinated' than Shepard? Because he's basically the only member of cerberus who hasn't become a techno-monster, and his reasons for wanting to fight Shepard are pretty clearly laid out (i.e. he's a high-functioning sociopath who likes killing people), apparently Shepard is indoctrinated because he has bad dreams and headaches, which are also, funnily enough, common symptoms for people suffering from high stress or PTSD (and whaddya know, it happened soon after Shepard witnessed the one thing s/he's been spending the past few years of their life trying to stop first-hand). It was basically the result of people taking dozens of little details scattered throughout the game and trying to build a structured theory out of it, but now that the Extended edition and the Bioware devs' knocked out half of the proof, people are desperately still trying to prop it up as a valid interpretation despite it losing most of its foundation.