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Underrail: The Incline Awakens

Eyestabber

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Don't know if this has been posted here or not, but I discovered today that opportunist is much, MUCH better than I initially imagined for a burst fire build. Suppressive fire counts as a "slow" and procs opportunist's 15% bonus. Nets will also count as "root", thus allowing you to proc the juicy 25% bonus during the entire burst. Unlike flashbangs (only the first shot will benefit from the bonus).
 
Self-Ejected

Excidium II

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Don't know if this has been posted here or not, but I discovered today that opportunist is much, MUCH better than I initially imagined for a burst fire build. Suppressive fire counts as a "slow" and procs opportunist's 15% bonus. Nets will also count as "root", thus allowing you to proc the juicy 25% bonus during the entire burst. Unlike flashbangs (only the first shot will benefit from the bonus).
Yeah, it's p. nice. Permanent 15% bonus with some 25% now and then with nets and taser. Also that last bit clears something I was confused about incapacitate + opportunist and abilities with multiple hits.
 

Eyestabber

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How is SMG compared to AR?

It all boils down to a single question: can your SMG break the Damage Threshold*? Because SMGs have theoretically higher DPT than ARs, but they run at the risk of being shutdown by DT. Of course, there are many other factors to consider, like the Expertise feat (that benefits SMGs much more than ARs), concentrated fire (AR exclusive), full auto (better synergy with AR than SMG), Spec Ops (ubber strong SMG exclusive feat) etc.

So my answer is this: since SMGs require high dexterity, they have better synergy with throwing/traps/lockpick while ARs have a higher STR requirement, which favors heavy armor, sniper rifles and the Juggernaut feat. In terms of damage, ARs are more guaranteed to break the DT, but high caliber SMGs (8.6 Steel Cat) aren't much behind. In terms of upgrades, the AR has a better selection that includes the same scopes as the sniper rifle. ARs also arguably benefit more from the Rapid Reloader than SMGs since their base AP cost is higher.

*: every bullet must deal more than DT/(1-DR) in order to trigger DR instead of DT. Since DR is percentage it doesn't matter if you're dealing 200 damage with four 50 damage bullets OR a single 200 dmg bullet. Against DT it does matter because the game subtracts the DT from every shot, so you're essentially facing 4 times the enemy's DT.
 

Blaine

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Also the core city merchants and layout, you can blame it on me. Didnt think it trough, as i always try to design the hubs as real and logical possible, so from a "architecture" viewpoint it makes sense, but from a gameplay aspect that was really bad design, need to look into it later and see if there can be done something about it.

You did exactly the right thing. Don't listen to these stupid assholes. They've been conditioned to play console action RPGs with trash-tier world-building.
 

Ellef

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Are the Deep Caverns full of high DT enemies? I'm using smg so far and shredding absolutely everything, more than my AR ever did.
 

Ellef

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How is SMG compared to AR?

It all boils down to a single question: can your SMG break the Damage Threshold*? Because SMGs have theoretically higher DPT than ARs, but they run at the risk of being shutdown by DT. Of course, there are many other factors to consider, like the Expertise feat (that benefits SMGs much more than ARs), concentrated fire (AR exclusive), full auto (better synergy with AR than SMG), Spec Ops (ubber strong SMG exclusive feat) etc.

So my answer is this: since SMGs require high dexterity, they have better synergy with throwing/traps/lockpick while ARs have a higher STR requirement, which favors heavy armor, sniper rifles and the Juggernaut feat. In terms of damage, ARs are more guaranteed to break the DT, but high caliber SMGs (8.6 Steel Cat) aren't much behind. In terms of upgrades, the AR has a better selection that includes the same scopes as the sniper rifle. ARs also arguably benefit more from the Rapid Reloader than SMGs since their base AP cost is higher.

*: every bullet must deal more than DT/(1-DR) in order to trigger DR instead of DT. Since DR is percentage it doesn't matter if you're dealing 200 damage with four 50 damage bullets OR a single 200 dmg bullet. Against DT it does matter because the game subtracts the DT from every shot, so you're essentially facing 4 times the enemy's DT.

Are the Deep Caverns full of high DT enemies? I'm using smg so far and shredding absolutely everything, more than my AR ever did.
 

bati

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Sprint. Rush face or going back behind corner after rushing face.

How is SMG compared to AR?

Between stealth (I always sneak up within one tile of target) and hit & run I've never really felt the need for sprint. It would be highly situational in my build, but very useful to have when I could utilize it.

I can't give you any concrete numbers because I didn't play my AR guy to high levels (stopped at 14) but with a 7.62 smart rapid jaguar I can kill a plasma sentry with one standard ammo burst (I was bursting Bladelings with a 5mm because why the fuck not. Much to my surprise it worked really well :lol:). At 13 dex I get 4 bursts per turn (12 ap per burst). I'm not sure if it will go any lower at 14, I ate some dex food but it didn't change anything. I suspect I could get it to 5 bursts per turn at 16 dex but I wanted those two stat points elsewhere.

Even a 5mm with significantly lower damage potential had no issues at all with killing armored targets up to this point (Balor for example died in 1 turn to a 5mm smg), as long as you're using smart goggles + smart module on your gun you're good. The range is not an issue at all, I can reliably hit enemies half a screen away with semi auto, for burst I prefer to be no more than 3 tiles away from the target, the accuracy is very hit & miss :lol:. If I can't be bothered to slot an EMP I can always rely on a single burst to take down enemy shields. All in all, absurd damage potential. I can kill 4-5 enemies per turn with the smg alone and I always have the option of opening the fight with a grenade. As I mentioned before, despite the lack of mechanics synergy between stealth and smgs/grenades they just work so damn well together that I wouldn't want to play this build without stealth. I don't even remember the last time I took any damage or turned on my shield.

tldr - SMGs are overpowered as fuck in pre-DC content. I'll provide some more feedback once I actually make my way there. I plan to craft an 8.6mm Smart Steelcat before I make the trip, got a 115q frame and a 122q Smart module standing by. Last attachment will depend on the AP consumption, if I can squeeze in another burst with rapid reloader than that's going to be the obvious option, otherwise I'll probably go with a muzzle brake.
 

Blackmill

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Also the core city merchants and layout, you can blame it on me. Didnt think it trough, as i always try to design the hubs as real and logical possible, so from a "architecture" viewpoint it makes sense, but from a gameplay aspect that was really bad design, need to look into it later and see if there can be done something about it.

I have to ask, how difficult would it be to make some of the more traveled red transitions in Core City blue ones? I'm not playing on a gaming laptop so those transitions take anywhere from 20 to 40 seconds, which adds up when you transition several dozen times throughout a playthrough.
 

Blaine

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I have to ask, how difficult would it be to make some of the more traveled red transitions in Core City blue ones? I'm not playing on a gaming laptop so those transitions take anywhere from 20 to 40 seconds, which adds up when you transition several dozen times throughout a playthrough.

20-40 seconds? What ARE you playing on? On my non-gaming Thinkpad T450s, red transitions take 3-4 seconds, about the same as my desktop.

That's with autosave on transition turned on.
 

Lhynn

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Transition times get higher the more transitions you go tru, theres probably some memory leak problem or something. Usually when it gets bad the best thing you can do is exit the game and enter again, seems to fix them for a while. Transition times can range from less than a second to more than a minute, its ridonkulous.
 

Beastro

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Transition times get higher the more transitions you go tru, theres probably some memory leak problem or something. Usually when it gets bad the best thing you can do is exit the game and enter again, seems to fix them for a while. Transition times can range from less than a second to more than a minute, its ridonkulous.

I get some really weird stuttering if I play for a good while that isn't solved by a simple game restart, I need to restart my entire comp to clear it up.
 

ArchAngel

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I just made myself some Infused armor and tabi boots. now my lvl 22 character has over 220 evasion and dodge :D
 

oneself

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Does PSI point regeneration ever get better or I have to rely on PSI boosters to fight bigger battles?
Isn't it based on Int + WP?
5 + (int+wp)/2
Later you can spam psi boosters like a madman, plus good psi cost reduction crafted gear helps.

I remember in beta(a week or so before release) PSI point wasn't nearly as much of a problem as it is now. Right now if the fight lasts anything more than 3 turns I need boosters. I sometime needs to corner myself for 4 turns using force field just to stall for PSI regeneration and cooldowns.


Maybe my bar is set too high. My first build was SMG/throwing/trapping.
 

Blaine

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Just got done fishing in the Core City sewers, here are my results (DEX 4):

  • 35 minutes
  • 107 bites
  • 13 fish (9 Slackjaw, 3 Yellow Pufferfish, 1 Demon Squid)
  • 12.1% success rate
  • average 19.6 seconds between bites
  • average 2 minutes, 41 seconds to make a successful catch
  • sometimes 1, even up to 2 minutes between bites
  • worst stretch: 5 minutes, 7 bites, 0 catches

Verdict: Simplistic, miserable, boring, tedious bullshit. Fix success rate, DEX notwithstanding, or remove this trash from the game. I hope those are the only three fish you can catch in the sewers.
 

Beastro

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Honestly fuck fishing. I've never done it because its MMO timesink rubbish.

At least it's simple as hell, but then that makes me wonder why it's even in if that's the case. It's no where near like Torghlights which was a bit more involving and usefull.

The annoyance I find from it needing to click on the stick itself, and when you miss dancing around, same annoying thing that happens in combat when I misclick and make my guy walk to my target.

Sometimes I wish there was a zoom function in this game.
 

Blackmill

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I have to ask, how difficult would it be to make some of the more traveled red transitions in Core City blue ones? I'm not playing on a gaming laptop so those transitions take anywhere from 20 to 40 seconds, which adds up when you transition several dozen times throughout a playthrough.

20-40 seconds? What ARE you playing on? On my non-gaming Thinkpad T450s, red transitions take 3-4 seconds, about the same as my desktop.

That's with autosave on transition turned on.

I use a Lenovo laptop (bought with no intention of playing on it). I actually have a pretty good gaming desktop too. My initial plan was to do work on my laptop and game on my desktop, but using a laptop is so much more comfortable, so I end up playing on it. I haven't even used my desktop in nearly two years. I'll try disabling autosave on transitions since 3-4 second transitions would make the gameplay significantly better.

Edit: Turning off autosaves reduced transition to 6-8 seconds. I can't believe I didn't do this earlier.
 
Last edited:

Inf0mercial

Augur
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Jan 28, 2014
Messages
264
I think my biggest hatred in this game is trying to engage combat with someone behind a wall when it is in front of you from your perspective, they don't stand out and its fucking rage inducing at times to spend 20 seconds trying to get my fucking mouse on the target, mostly happens in side tunnels with rat hounds.
 

Beastro

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I think my biggest hatred in this game is trying to engage combat with someone behind a wall when it is in front of you from your perspective, they don't stand out and its fucking rage inducing at times to spend 20 seconds trying to get my fucking mouse on the target, mostly happens in side tunnels with rat hounds.

For that reason I hold down the highlight button (remapped to Q, tab brings up inventory).

I also note that with highlight held down you can clock on targets in places you normally otherwise wouldn't, same goes for lockers and shit behind walls.
 

Nines

Learned
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Nov 16, 2015
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Tabi boots created from middle-high quality black cloth give you around 130 fabric scraps. It means three advanced repair kits, which cost 2700 against 1000 for black cloth. Serious business.


average 19.6 seconds between bites
:what:

Try better fishing spots, like this for example (on the road to Junkyard, requires Perception). Also, from my experience, the game asks you to "get the fuck out" at some point, when you catch ~10 fishes, by increasing time between bites. I don't think grind is the best approach here.

Transition times get higher the more transitions you go tru, theres probably some memory leak problem or something.
There is, actually, but one was fixed in 1.0.0.6 I think, so the game is much more stable now. Although I think there are others.
 

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