Underrail: The Incline Awakens

[ItsChon]

I don't understand people who talking about Protectorate as absolute evil and betrayal of people who hired you in expedition to pirates is wholesome. I know that life of pirate is romanticized, but think twice before calling Protectorate evil after joining to sea version of Ironheads that threatens all cities connected to the water way. And "professor betrayed Bio Corp so he is bad" - fucking idiotic, because all evidence in fucking Underrail suggests that Biocorp sucks at ruling and anybody who supported them is simply mad.
I do think that my decision to give Todd to Expedition was mistake though, because it turned out that I overestimated proffessor's influence on matter and other retards at University managed to ruin everything.

The protectorate is shit because they are on track to be the exact same thing that Old Biocorp was before they were overthrown. That's not even taking into account that they're authoritarian assholes who have no qualms with manipulating and killing innocents to push their own agenda.

Plus, even if I was to ignore all that, I play the game as a SGS loyalist, and weakening the Protectorate directly aids SGS. I pretty much always side with the Eels to give SGS a foothold in Junkyard and help the Free Drones to get the Protectorate out of South Underrail. Also, helping the Pirates weakens the Eels which further strenghtens SGS. Also, it is made clear that the pirates don't kill anyone if they cooperate and give them all their shit.

 

[Blaine]

Although I generally side with the Free Drones and massacre Protectorate forces whenever I can get away with it undetected, I've decided to remain loyal to the Aegis Expedition for one simple reason: My motivations are in line with theirs. It's appropriate, because that makes me a true mercenary.

Yeah, I wanna loot those fucking ruins of all their mold-encrusted valuables, and I don't give a flying fuck at a rolling doughnut how many grasshoppers, crabs, snakes, spiders, and pseudo-Scandinavian illiterate savages I have to massacre in order to get them.

This is the post-apocalypse, motherfuckers. I don't give a squeaky fart in a windstorm about respecting some white spear-chuckers' sacred sites and snake gods.

 

[ItsChon]

Although I generally side with the Free Drones and massacre Protectorate forces whenever I can get away with it undetected, I've decided to remain loyal to the Aegis Expedition for one simple reason: My motivations are in line with theirs. It's appropriate, because that makes me a true mercenary.

Yeah, I wanna loot those fucking ruins of all their mold-encrusted valuables, and I don't give a flying fuck at a rolling doughnut how many grasshoppers, crabs, snakes, spiders, and pseudo-Scandinavian illiterate savages I have to massacre in order to get them.

This is the post-apocalypse, motherfuckers. I don't give a squeaky fart in a windstorm about respecting some white spear-chuckers' sacred sites and snake gods.

You can loot all the ruins of their mold-encrusted valuables without the Expedition though?

Edit And I'd argue that you can keep more of the loot, as you're not beholden to the Expedition to report your findings.

 

[Blaine]

You can loot all the ruins of their mold-encrusted valuables without the Expedition though?

Edit And I'd argue that you can keep more of the loot, as you're not beholden to the Expedition to report your findings.

I expected that response.

It's the merchants, my dude. I'm not going to kill off two factions' worth of merchants. You need somewhere to sell the loot, after all. Also, they pay you thousands of charons every time you perform some minor task that they're too incompetent to handle without the help of some random hobo from South Underrail.

Also, the pirates are bullshit because there doesn't appear to be any actual piracy going on anywhere unless you join them. It's literally just random Jet Skiers everywhere and nothing else. This DLC is in utterly dire need of dynamic and ongoing random encounters.

 

[lukaszek]

deterministic system > RNG

 

[ItsChon]

It's the merchants, my dude. I'm not going to kill off two factions' worth of merchants. You need somewhere to sell the loot, after all. Also, they pay you thousands of charons every time you perform some minor task that they're too incompetent to handle without the help of some random hobo from South Underrail.

That's fair enough. Losing Ladelman and Marcus does suck.

Also, the pirates are bullshit because there doesn't appear to be any actual piracy going on anywhere unless you join them. It's literally just random Jet Skiers everywhere and nothing else. This DLC is in utterly dire need of dynamic and ongoing random encounters.

There's no Piracy because it's explained that Aegis have locked the Pirates into the Black Sea due to their control over the Jaws, and the Pirates are avoding hostilities with them until the Professor situation. I made a truce with the Pirates so IDK if there are random encounters with them if you aggro them, but if there isn't than I agree that would help things.

 

[Blaine]

There's no Piracy because it's explained that Aegis have locked the Pirates into the Black Sea due to their control over the Jaws, and the Pirates are avoding hostilities with them until the Professor situation. I made a truce with the Pirates so IDK if there are random encounters with them if you aggro them, but if there isn't than I agree that would help things.

Oh, I'm aware that an in-universe explanation was concocted to explain why you can't witness any actual piracy going on anywhere, but in-universe explanations can be concocted to explain away absolutely anything.

In other words, in-universe explanations are worse than useless when used to defend deleterious features or lack of features (in games), poor plot structure (in books and movies), etc. They're useful only for coherency, continuity, and consistency.

 

[ItsChon]

There's no Piracy because it's explained that Aegis have locked the Pirates into the Black Sea due to their control over the Jaws, and the Pirates are avoding hostilities with them until the Professor situation. I made a truce with the Pirates so IDK if there are random encounters with them if you aggro them, but if there isn't than I agree that would help things.

Oh, I'm aware that an in-universe explanation was concocted to explain why you can't witness any actual piracy going on anywhere, but in-universe explanations can be concocted to explain away absolutely anything.

In other words, in-universe explanations are worse than useless when used to defend deleterious features or lack of features (in games), poor plot structure (in books and movies), etc. They're useful only for coherency, continuity, and consistency.

We were talking about IC reasons behind joining factions so I assumed that's what you meant when you mentioned Piracy.

 

[lukaszek]

deterministic system > RNG

 

[ItsChon]

Well I've beat the game with 2 characters and taken another to DC since the expansion came out, all on hard. I think I'm about Underrailed out again. It was a fun probably near 100+ (probably closer to 200) since the expansion came out, but I think I'm done. The Expansion was a net positive and I was definitely satisfied with it, especially with the Spears and Temporal Manipulation. Shotguns were nice but weren't my cup of tea, and I didn't try Machete yet as it seems to play similarily to Knives/Unarmed and that's not my cup of tea. Excited for what's up next.

And I found a new favorite build, Spartan Hoplite. Thanks to Blaine pretty much actually.

 

[SenisterDenister]

This is the post-apocalypse, motherfuckers. I don't give a squeaky fart in a windstorm about respecting some white spear-chuckers' sacred sites and snake gods.

I don't know if I would consider Underrail as post-apocalyptic. Yes it takes place after some kind of cataclysm but it's so far past it I think it would almost qualify as part of the Dying Earth genre, especially from things you learn during the Expedition and Deep Caverns. The event that drove mankind underground is so inconsequential to the setting everyone just takes it at face value that the world is a fuck and they're stuck down there and just try to live day-to-day in this brave new underworld. Also, the natives deserve the genocide you're going to inevitably commit. They really do. Kill them, Johnny, kill them all.

 

[lukaszek]

deterministic system > RNG

 

[Parabalus]

not happy with evasion. Even with amazing boost from evasive maneuvers natives accuracy with nets is 50%. Evading shots from plasma turrets is rare occurrence too. For reference I easily get 200-300 boost from maneuvers. I play on hard.
Only nice thing is how little damage naga aoe attack does due to reduction.

Should have gone for high int instead... although I didnt realize that you can easilly craft rusting acid traps when I made my choice.

I thought people knew that evasion can't reduce by itself an attack's precision below 40% https://www.underrail.com/wiki/index.php?title=Precision#Skill
This seems to be designed so that light levels and perception (cave ear poison) remain relevant as factors, but it's probably too brutal of a cap.

The cap is pretty hard to reach given the absurd skill values of enemies, they can have 400-500+ attack.



Dodge is useable solely because of uncanny.

I like the idea of new enemies and new ai stuff but 50% hp is stupidly bloated but even then i could do it, with some patience time and abuse of doors and corners its the 25% sell value that got to me it was too much it does not hurt so much as it delays everything combined with the new enemy types and it just blocks off entire sections of content until you chip sway at a bunch of easier things then backtrack to do them, the sad thing is i know if i made an AR tin can i could mulch most things without all that but i played that so i was looking for a change.

The sell value nerfs are the worst part about DOMINATING. Mercantile is pretty much mandatory.

I have never rage quit quite so hard as when i finally dragged my heavy melee guy to silent isle and found 3 psi beetle goliaths, i actually deleted the saves lol, kind of regret that but i was angry and tired.

The Coretech questline has 6 Goliathuses, in a small area so you can't cheese as much, and you don't even have Broderick to help .

 

[BING XI LAO]

I love that I must be 75% of the way through the game and I still have no idea what went wrong on the surface. A worse written game would've been insecure about it and shoved it in your face.

 

[Rinslin Merwind]

The protectorate is shit because they are on track to be the exact same thing that Old Biocorp was before they were overthrown. That's not even taking into account that they're authoritarian assholes who have no qualms with manipulating and killing innocents to push their own agenda.

Plus, even if I was to ignore all that, I play the game as a SGS loyalist, and weakening the Protectorate directly aids SGS. I pretty much always side with the Eels to give SGS a foothold in Junkyard and help the Free Drones to get the Protectorate out of South Underrail. Also, helping the Pirates weakens the Eels which further strenghtens SGS. Also, it is made clear that the pirates don't kill anyone if they cooperate and give them all their shit.

> helping pirates weakens the Eels which further strengthens SGS
Weakening YOUR OWN FUCKING ALLIES does NOT strengthens your position, at least not when your small station surrounded by monsters, bandits and other pirates (which does not have agreement with you, btw).
> Also, it is made clear that the pirates don't kill anyone if they cooperate and give them all their shit
Yeah, and "cooperate" apparently means give all money, resources and services to pirates in hopes that they don't change their decision or new captain will arise, who does not give a fuck about your agreement. Fuck, did you ever thought that your "alliance" is temporary, until they manage repair derelict ship (or reverse engineering, if full repair is not possible) and go plunder ALL settlements because nobody has enough firepower to stop them?

The protectorate is shit because they are on track to be the exact same thing that Old Biocorp was before they were overthrown

I want to remind you that Biocorp was MONARCHY and logs of derelict ship was really funny to read, about "Emperor of Biocorp" and shit. Authoritarian regime and monarchy does have different traits, so technically Protectorate isn't Old Biocorp.

That's not even taking into account that they're authoritarian assholes who have no qualms with manipulating and killing innocents to push their own agenda.

What about terrorist attacks committed by Free Drones in North Underrail? If I remember, Anastasia in Fort Apogee was victim one of such attack. Hell, what about kidnapping the train, that supposed to help Rail Crossing, because image of Protectorate helping other stations does not suit Free Drones agenda? Hell, I don't deny that Protectorate isn't magical rainbow land and shit, but it does not mean that bunch of retards should kill and endanger civilians that supposed to be freed by their actions against Protectorate.

Look, I understand that some people love explosions and "revolutionary spirit", but I don't think people who sides with terrorist fanatics and extortionary murderers, rapists and robbers (Underrail pirates definitely not about high moral values) have any moral ground to call Protectorate as absolute evil.
I always trying to get an ending when SGS joins Protectorate, but retain maximum privileges and freedoms, because there a slim chance to reform Protectorate to more democratic state from inside, including disbanding CAU and removing corrupt elements by way of arrest or assassination. Free Drones will losing supporters and members, because there will be less and less reasons to fight against United Nations and sooner or later only handful of fanatics will remain. Only to be executed in same place with Lunatics, Iron Heads and other bandits.
Call me optimistic, but this is better than create a possibility of whole SGS being slaughtered in war (like Omega was),killed by plague, eaten by monsters, harassed by bandits and nowhere to call for reinforcements or at least ammo or medicine.

 

[Parabalus]

The Protectorate did nothing wrong.

 

[Blaine]

The sell value nerfs are the worst part about DOMINATING. Mercantile is pretty much mandatory.

That's because zero thought was put into them. See how arbitrary the values are: 50% and 25%. I bet long nights were spent meticulously balancing these difficulty modes.

Mind you, I'm of the general opinion that a lot of developer effort SHOULDN'T be spent on gradated difficulty levels. One is the ideal. Normal is actually completely fine for Underrail, unless you've played through it several times or more and know everything there is to know.

Personally, I'd blow through every combat on Hard almost as easily as I do on Normal, and I'll never in my life touch Dominating, so I continue to play on Normal. If it ever becomes possible to switch off the selling price nerf and the "EMP your whole inventory" nonsense, I'd happily switch to Hard.

I have never rage quit quite so hard as when i finally dragged my heavy melee guy to silent isle and found 3 psi beetle goliaths, i actually deleted the saves lol, kind of regret that but i was angry and tired.

Such thoughtful encounter design.

 

[Parabalus]

The sell value nerfs are the worst part about DOMINATING. Mercantile is pretty much mandatory.

That's because zero thought was put into them. See how arbitrary the values are: 50% and 25%. I bet long nights were spent meticulously balancing these difficulty modes.

Mind you, I'm of the general opinion that a lot of developer effort SHOULDN'T be spent on gradated difficulty levels. One is the ideal. Normal is actually completely fine for Underrail, unless you've played through it several times or more and know everything there is to know.

I have never rage quit quite so hard as when i finally dragged my heavy melee guy to silent isle and found 3 psi beetle goliaths, i actually deleted the saves lol, kind of regret that but i was angry and tired.

Such thoughtful encounter design.

Normal is way too easy, even for first time play. Especially for a Codxer.

The goliathuses are a nice addition, that's the best part about DOMINATING - high-level (DC) mobs in early areas, it really spices things up. Only thing really lacking are the deep worms.

 

[Black Angel]

The sell value nerfs are the worst part about DOMINATING. Mercantile is pretty much mandatory.

That's because zero thought was put into them. See how arbitrary the values are: 50% and 25%. I bet long nights were spent meticulously balancing these difficulty modes.

Mind you, I'm of the general opinion that a lot of developer effort SHOULDN'T be spent on gradated difficulty levels. One is the ideal. Normal is actually completely fine for Underrail, unless you've played through it several times or more and know everything there is to know.

I have never rage quit quite so hard as when i finally dragged my heavy melee guy to silent isle and found 3 psi beetle goliaths, i actually deleted the saves lol, kind of regret that but i was angry and tired.

Such thoughtful encounter design.

Normal is way too easy, even for first time play. Especially for a Codxer.

I disagree. But what do I know, I wasn't a Codexer when I first played Underrail, which also coincided as my first cRPG ever.

 

[Goromorg]

> helping pirates weakens the Eels which further strengthens SGS
Weakening YOUR OWN FUCKING ALLIES does NOT strengthens your position, at least not when your small station surrounded by monsters, bandits and other pirates (which does not have agreement with you, btw).

If you side with pirates you also weaken Protectorate presence on sea. And Eels are not much better than pirates and are only good as temporary allies.

What about terrorist attacks committed by Free Drones in North Underrail? If I remember, Anastasia in Fort Apogee was victim one of such attack. Hell, what about kidnapping the train, that supposed to help Rail Crossing, because image of Protectorate helping other stations does not suit Free Drones agenda? Hell, I don't deny that Protectorate isn't magical rainbow land and shit, but it does not mean that bunch of retards should kill and endanger civilians that supposed to be freed by their actions against Protectorate.

Desperate times call for desperate measures

I always trying to get an ending when SGS joins Protectorate, but retain maximum privileges and freedoms, because there a slim chance to reform Protectorate to more democratic state from inside, including disbanding CAU and removing corrupt elements by way of arrest or assassination.

Free Drones will be glad to help Protectorate with "reforming"

 

[Parabalus]

The sell value nerfs are the worst part about DOMINATING. Mercantile is pretty much mandatory.

That's because zero thought was put into them. See how arbitrary the values are: 50% and 25%. I bet long nights were spent meticulously balancing these difficulty modes.

Mind you, I'm of the general opinion that a lot of developer effort SHOULDN'T be spent on gradated difficulty levels. One is the ideal. Normal is actually completely fine for Underrail, unless you've played through it several times or more and know everything there is to know.

I have never rage quit quite so hard as when i finally dragged my heavy melee guy to silent isle and found 3 psi beetle goliaths, i actually deleted the saves lol, kind of regret that but i was angry and tired.

Such thoughtful encounter design.

Normal is way too easy, even for first time play. Especially for a Codxer.

I disagree. But what do I know, I wasn't a Codexer when I first played Underrail, which also coincided as my first cRPG ever.

That's a pretty damning statement about how easy Normal is.

You might have also gotten unlucky on Underrail's build power roulette. Crossbows .

 

[Black Angel]

The sell value nerfs are the worst part about DOMINATING. Mercantile is pretty much mandatory.

That's because zero thought was put into them. See how arbitrary the values are: 50% and 25%. I bet long nights were spent meticulously balancing these difficulty modes.

Mind you, I'm of the general opinion that a lot of developer effort SHOULDN'T be spent on gradated difficulty levels. One is the ideal. Normal is actually completely fine for Underrail, unless you've played through it several times or more and know everything there is to know.

I have never rage quit quite so hard as when i finally dragged my heavy melee guy to silent isle and found 3 psi beetle goliaths, i actually deleted the saves lol, kind of regret that but i was angry and tired.

Such thoughtful encounter design.

Normal is way too easy, even for first time play. Especially for a Codxer.

I disagree. But what do I know, I wasn't a Codexer when I first played Underrail, which also coincided as my first cRPG ever.

That's a pretty damning statement about how easy Normal is.

Not really. I still feel like Normal is.... well, normal, for a game like Underrail. And I agree with Blaine, games only really need one difficulty, which is fixed across the board for all players. No need to waste time deciding what is 'easy', 'normal', 'hard', etc etc.

You might have also gotten unlucky on Underrail's build power roulette. Crossbows .

I gotten even worst luck on that. I tried to do literally everything, with the exception of Melee and Pickpocket.

 

[Blaine]

Normal is way too easy, even for first time play. Especially for a Codxer.

It isn't, though. You're suffering from the combination of an inability to see the game from a novice's perspective (a common phenomenon in all of life, once one leaves novicehood behind) and the endemic Codexian urge to brag about playing on the hardest or near-hardest difficulty setting, no matter the game.

Hard is perfect for veterans, except for those two dumb and annoying features. DOMINATING is for challenge purposes only, not unlike speedrunning.

I disagree. But what do I know, I wasn't a Codexer when I first played Underrail, which also coincided as my first cRPG ever.

That's a pretty damning statement about how easy Normal is.

That's where you're wrong, kiddo. It's actually much easier for people who haven't been tainted and conditioned by consolized RPGs and walking simulators to "get into" inclined cRPGs for the first time. I know quite a few such people personally.

 

[Beggar]

I'm not even sure if you can call Underrail an incline. Still, the true spirit of RPGs are long gone from this world. Maybe it is catchy, but at the same time it's boring and uninteresting

 

[BING XI LAO]

I love that I must be 75% of the way through the game and I still have no idea what went wrong on the surface. A worse written game would've been insecure about it and shoved it in your face.

I just got to a conversation with the Expedition's Professor where he mentions, in passing, that

Spoiler

''the surface was becoming less habitable, and the supercorporations were planning projects to preserve humanity''. So, maybe it was pollution, or climate change, or the sun changing its intensity; it wasn't a sudden war apparently.

But that's all he says. (Don't spoiler this lore for me please, if there's more to be found later on in the game)

Then he spends the next paragraph explaining what the word ''horizon'' originally meant, since of course everyone in the game lives in caves their entire lives and now the word is just used as a synonym with 'limit'. Immersion rating = /