Warhammer Warhammer 40,000: Rogue Trader Pre-Release Thread [GAME RELEASED, GO TO NEW THREAD]

[skaraher]

Imperial doctrine and the reality of what happens often differ.

Rogue Traders are allowed to do whatever they want.

Well as it is shown in Eisenhorn/Ravenor saga, when they're operating outside the boundaries of imperial jurisdiction, they're generally treated as common pirates and heretics by representants of Imperal law. But it's more of a might makes right situation. Your Inquisitorial credentials or Rogue Trader Letter of change aren't worth very much if you don't have the strength to back it.

Novels aren't exactly rulebooks and always subjective takes on the setting, they don't set how the setting works though, not even really good ones

Well what do you have as a lore source then ? Rogue trader aren't covered as more than a footnote in post 2nd-ed rulebooks, and the TTRPG heavily draws from the universe established by Abnett novels.

Also, extract from Eisenhorn were used as blurbs in certains Codex. (Eye of Terror I think)

 

[Storyfag]

Imperial doctrine and the reality of what happens often differ.

Rogue Traders are allowed to do whatever they want.

Well as it is shown in Eisenhorn/Ravenor saga, when they're operating outside the boundaries of imperial jurisdiction, they're generally treated as common pirates and heretics by representants of Imperal law. But it's more of a might makes right situation. Your Inquisitorial credentials or Rogue Trader Letter of change aren't worth very much if you don't have the strength to back it.

Novels aren't exactly rulebooks and always subjective takes on the setting, they don't set how the setting works though, not even really good ones

Rulebooks, as the name implies, primarily contain the rules for the tabletop wargamee. Whatever snippets of lore are found in them, are always subjective takes on the setting, they don't set how the setting works though, not even really good ones.

 

[Grauken]

Imperial doctrine and the reality of what happens often differ.

Rogue Traders are allowed to do whatever they want.

Well as it is shown in Eisenhorn/Ravenor saga, when they're operating outside the boundaries of imperial jurisdiction, they're generally treated as common pirates and heretics by representants of Imperal law. But it's more of a might makes right situation. Your Inquisitorial credentials or Rogue Trader Letter of change aren't worth very much if you don't have the strength to back it.

Novels aren't exactly rulebooks and always subjective takes on the setting, they don't set how the setting works though, not even really good ones

Rulebooks, as the name implies, primarily contain the rules for the tabletop wargamee. Whatever snippets of lore are found in them, are always subjective takes on the setting, they don't set how the setting works though, not even really good ones.

Not my experience with P&P RPG sourcebooks though it may be different in Warhammer

If its true though then Owlcat can just make up their own lore

 

[Storyfag]

Imperial doctrine and the reality of what happens often differ.

Rogue Traders are allowed to do whatever they want.

Well as it is shown in Eisenhorn/Ravenor saga, when they're operating outside the boundaries of imperial jurisdiction, they're generally treated as common pirates and heretics by representants of Imperal law. But it's more of a might makes right situation. Your Inquisitorial credentials or Rogue Trader Letter of change aren't worth very much if you don't have the strength to back it.

Novels aren't exactly rulebooks and always subjective takes on the setting, they don't set how the setting works though, not even really good ones

Rulebooks, as the name implies, primarily contain the rules for the tabletop wargamee. Whatever snippets of lore are found in them, are always subjective takes on the setting, they don't set how the setting works though, not even really good ones.

Not my experience with P&P RPG sourcebooks though it may be different in Warhammer

If its true though then Owlcat can just make up their own lore

Well, to be completely fair, the Warhammer 40K PnP rulebooks do contain specific descriptions of (parts of) the setting. It's just that in the case of Warhammer 40k (and Fantasy, for that matter), "rulebook" is usually understood to mean the army rule book for the tabletop wargame. Still, the material in the PnP rulebooks is by no means exhaustive, being limited in the case of 40k to one Imperial Sector (out of about a thousand). With scale such as this in mind, it is fair to assume that the aforementioned novels (which, by the way, predate the PnP game by quite a few years), are an equally good source of information how a part of the Imperium works.

 

[Aarwolf]

Eldar ranger? They put a stinking xeno as a joinable companion? Even worse, a non ork xeno as a joinable companion? RPGs are really truly dead.

It gets better: that xeno fucks you and your retinue (and herself as well), selling you to the dark eldar.

Well, at least they are true to role, but why would anyone accept it in their group in first place?

Dunno, shot her on spot.

 

[Alex]

This game is called Rogue Trader. Clearly they should use this as the lore source:

 

[Parsimonious cook]

In fact they do. Its just a slightly different book.

 

[Alex]

In fact they do. Its just a slightly different book.

View attachment 40644

Bah, that one doesn't even have programmable robots.

 

[Jaedar]

Your Inquisitorial credentials or Rogue Trader Letter of change aren't worth very much if you don't have the strength to back it.

This is the key to understanding Imperial law (almost like it's fascist civilization or something).

 

[Riddler]

I listened to the main theme and felt like I recognised it and then it struck me that it sounds a lot like some kind of remix of older Arcana songs like:

 

[skaraher]

Your Inquisitorial credentials or Rogue Trader Letter of change aren't worth very much if you don't have the strength to back it.

This is the key to understanding Imperial law (almost like it's fascist civilization or something).

And it was the case of the historical Roman Inquisition in medieval times. Inquisitors were supposed to answer directly to the Pope and his college of cardinals, and in matter of rooting out heresy, their authority theoretically superseded those of bishops and secular lords. Their code of law allowed them to use the local forces to apply death penalty or life sentence with a bare minimum of proofs (In fact, a grand total of 2 public witness was considered evidence enough to convict a suspect). They could try, convict and execute anybody, from the lowliest peasant to a king. In theory.

In practice, their clout extended to whatever forces and auxiliaries they managed to garner by their own means, and the alliances built with local lords. The Vatican authority and support was often a distant and virtual thing.

 

[Tyranicon]

True power in the Imperium (and 40k at large) is measured by sheer violence and its application. Whoever has the largest military force/requisitional ability/leet assassins, is the most powerful.

This is why any organization of merit in the Imperium either has its own armed forces, could requisition it, or is just downright dangerous in some way. Even the bureaucracy. Maybe especially the bureaucracy.

 

[ERYFKRAD]

True power in the Imperium (and 40k at large) is measured by sheer violence and its application. Whoever has the largest military force/requisitional ability/leet assassins, is the most powerful.

This is why any organization of merit in the Imperium either has its own armed forces, could requisition it, or is just downright dangerous in some way. Even the bureaucracy. Maybe especially the bureaucracy.

Adeptus Accountes

 

[Storyfag]

True power in the Imperium (and 40k at large) is measured by sheer violence and its application. Whoever has the largest military force/requisitional ability/leet assassins, is the most powerful.

This is why any organization of merit in the Imperium either has its own armed forces, could requisition it, or is just downright dangerous in some way. Even the bureaucracy. Maybe especially the bureaucracy.

Adeptus Accountes

The Imperial Guard do fall under the Departamento Munitorum of the Adeptus Administratum...

 

[Irxy]

Yeah I don’t get the inclusion of romance in a 40K RPG. It’s 100% out of place.

They may be 100% out of place in a wargame, but RPG exist specifically to explore the setting beyond the combat.

 

[Irxy]

The problem with romance in RPGs is that is it really hard to pull off, because you need writing that'll attract the player to the NPC.

I suppose many players do associate their PC with themselves to an extent and basically roleplay a fantasy version of themselves, but come on, roleplay is more than that.
The NPC does not need to be attractive to the player, but provide interesting roleplay options for the varied PCs the player might want to play.
Not inherently different from any other type of content the game provides for the sake of choices & customization.

 

[Irxy]

I can fill 60 paragraphs with my thoughts on this alone, but I'll keep it to mostly two sentences.

• Writing romances for simps is super easy.
• Writing a faceted romance for an intelligent human person is the height of craft.

Most games shouldn't have romances because 99% of the time it's cringe.

While I agree that romances are often mediocre at best, that's like saying games should omit <any random mechanic or plot device> just because it sometimes or even often turns up bad.
Guess what, combat is also shit in most RPGs. Most of them have bad writing in general, bad dialogs, bad characters, bad mechanics and stat systems, bad itemization etc.
Some things turn up bad more often than others, base building for example. Does it mean it should also be forgotten for all times, instead of trying to find out new and fun ways of implementation?
I personally disagree.
There are 2 main problems with romances in general that I see:

• Romances are often an afterthought, as if the writers were told to make them by a marketing guy but were not really interested nor inspired; in such cases it is obviously better to not make any. Just like any plot device, a romance option should not be something obligatory - if the writer has interesting ideas about a character and wants to explore it, in this and only this case he should.
• Everyone copies the original Bioware formula both mechanically and conceptually to the letter, which is boring and limiting. The romance I liked most in Dragon Age Origins, for example, is the one with queen Anora - because it is not even a romance, but a political marriage and thus new and interesting and fits the story and lore great. The writers should really look beyond making a simple dating sim, and the most trivial one at that.

The couple romances I checked in Pathfinder WotR were not terrible, at least the writers were clearly not doing them just for the sake of a checkbox; I'm curious how they handle them in Warhammer and if they'll be able to evolve their previous attempts.

 

[Grauken]

The romance section in the character introduction took me aback as well. It feels out of place.

Owlcat Audience

This thread will be highly entertaining on release

 

[Aarwolf]

This is why any organization of merit in the Imperium either has its own armed forces, could requisition it,

Ingame Heinrix literally states that he has to requisit your forces (ship, retinue and so forth) to do his quest. And no, you're not in a position to say "no". Of course, you can try to kill him outright, but it means troubles.

 

[janior]

will this also be ruined by some management mini-game and quests with timers?

 

[Prince(ss)]

>Can't marry and get dicked down by the gigachad viking werewolf space marine.
>No longer interested in the romance options.

 

[Dishonoredbr]

It wouldn't be a Owlcat RPG without a MiniGame that you download a mod to remove.

 

[Grauken]

It wouldn't be a Owlcat RPG without a MiniGame that you download a mod to remove.

My headcanon is that someone high up there loves those things and forces the team to implement them against better wisdom and player feedback

 

[Infinitron]

Owlcat was founded by former strategy game developers from Nival (creators of Heroes of Might & Magic 5 among other titles). So yes, they do like that stuff.

 

[volklore]

I liked kingdom shit in kingmaker. If only because it was tied to the rest restriction.
Crusade mode can suck it though.