KickStarter Solasta: Crown of the Magister Thread - now with Palace of Ice sequel DLC

[Yosharian]

The strongest spells in the game, the ones that completely break most encounters, are non-Evocation spells.

Please. Name the "encounter breaking spells". Haste and Stoneskin was among my favorite spells for low level games and both are worthless on 5E. On mid levels, disintegrate no longer OHKills anything who fails a save. Finger of Death too, just 7d8+30 damage. Feeblemind which was the worst caster nightmare din't got nerfed but now is a 8th tier spell instead of 5th. Wail of the Banshee which was considered the strongest necromancy spell ever got completely removed.

Hypnotic Pattern? Leomund's Tiny Hut? Fear? Simulacrum? Conjure Animals? Fly? Counterspell? Polymorph? Animate Objects? Suggestion? Wish? Banishment? Phantasmal Force? Healing Spirit? Spirit Guardians? Find Familiar? Reverse Gravity? Misty Step? Shield? Invisibility? Web? Any of the Image spells? Arcane Eye?? Otto's Irresistible Dance? True Seeing? Plane Shift? Teleport? Illusory Dragon? Maze?

You are out of your element, Donnie.

Edit: removed a few spells that were evocation

 

[Thac0]

Mind Twist

All of those spells roughly exist in the tabletop in the same form and at the same power level, sometimes detail rules function a bit differently. Mind Twist is fully homebrew tho.

Stoneskin

Stoneskin is actually not that good in 5e tho. It is fairly expensive, there is no way to circumvent the material cost, it only halves nonmagical nonelemental damage, it is concentration which you could also hold on a Polymorph or another actually devastating control spell. For self defense Mirror Image is the better spell in this edition.

 

[NJClaw]

Divination and Necromancy are bottom of the barrell, that is true.

Divination is insane, it's just not a combat-focused school. Clairvoyance, Arcane Eye, Divination, Locate Creature, and Scrying are literally campaign-changers. They're almost impossible to implement in this type of videogame though, but one could argue the quick load is actually a Divination spell, and isn't the quick load the strongest spell of them all?

Stoneskin is actually not that good in 5e tho. It is fairly expensive, there is no way to circumvent the material cost, it only halves nonmagical nonelemental damage, it is concentration which you could also hold on a Polymorph or another actually devastating control spell. For self defense Mirror Image is the better spell in this edition.

It's expensive in an edition where, after the warrior bought his plate armor, the only combat-related purpose of money is to pay for the Wizard's scrolls and components. That's not at all like being expensive in an edition where money is a fundamental aspect for the power level of a character. If you take Polymorph into consideration then Stoneskin's use cases become so narrow that there's almost no reason to memorize it, but comparing it to a notoriously broken spell isn't fair.

Mirror Image is a better self-defense spell, but Stoneskin isn't a self-defense spell. 75% of the monsters in this edition are big HP pools that deal non-magical melee damage in big chunks. Stoneskin is a good way to face those monsters whenever the Wizard can stay out of melee range: its reward isn't as impressive as a control spell, but its risk isn't as high either, since it requires neither a save nor an attack roll.

Whenever you can encounter a monster whose CR is a lot higher than what the party can reasonably face, Stoneskin is a lifesaver because it makes the difference between surviving an attack (and being able to attack during your turn) or spending the entire encounter dying.

 

[Anonona]

Counterspell

Forgot that one too. It can actually cancel shit like the veil of darkness of the vampire bosses. You can pretty much disable a spell caster with this one and focus kill it before a single spell can go off. Also gives a bit of a tactical consideration, as it requires you to have your reaction the turn you want to use it, so you can force the enemy spell caster to shield itself to make sure your wizard can cast freely, and sometimes is better for your wizard to get hit if the damage isn't too big instead of shielding.

 

[Larianshill]

One thing I didn't like is, you can't counterspell a counterspell in Solasta. It's a 100% intended interaction in DnD.

 

[Cryomancer]

and the only good one left in Animate Dead is not in the game.

I disagree that animate dead is that good. I mean, it only animates skeletons and zombies, the lowest tier of undead. It can be great at lv 5, but a CR 1 skeleton at lv 15 will not be that helpful. Doesn't matter how many you bring, they will be disposed off in a single AoE.

Talking more about necromancy, Pathfinder 1E brough a lot of cool necromancy spells. Death Clutch for eg. And the Create Greater Undead which allowed you to animate even dead elephants. Obviously, it would require too much work to be adapted into a video game. On Pathfinder Kingmaker/Wrath, you can only animate living armor and death knights with a amazing halberd. Even on PF2E which nerfed casters hard, allow you to summon more types of undead : https://2e.aonprd.com/Spells.aspx?ID=666

You can get shadows and other "mid tier" undead relative early on. But necromancy is up to DM approval. I love necromancy in video games, but in table top, I prefer to be the guy who casts stoneskin on the fighter(3E) and haste on the party than the guy who tries to throw big numbers on the enemy cuz is more a group activity. The exception to that rule is when everyone in my party is playing as a caster, then I pick necromancy and use my undead army to tank(often treating all the blob as a single monster mechanic wise to not spend hours in a single turn). CRPG's are most solo activities, TT mostly group activities. That is a huge difference.

disabling becomes the dominant strategy.

Yep. Note that I've played on normal difficulty. 5E already has too much hp for my taste. I even considered doubling the damage received and putting 50% of enemy hp, but din't did it. Maybe playing on the highest difficulty, I would have used more CC spells. Anyway, when I played KoTC1, my first suggested feat to pick as a Wizard was spell focus ENCHANTMENT.

Funnily enough, from the offical 5e Wizards subclasses that Solasta can't use legally because they are 5.1

They can homebrew their subclasses which are IMO better than the base ones, right?

As for green moon wizard green mage, they should have added shapeshift spells to him.

 

[Yosharian]

I will admit that I hadn't realised Forcecage and Wall of Force were Evocation spells, I assumed they were Conjuration. So I revised my initial statement slightly. Still, these two do not deal damage and they are pretty much encounter-ending spells, and all of the spells I mentioned are S-tier even if they don't all end encounters by themselves.

 

[Thac0]

I disagree that animate dead is that good. I mean, it only animates skeletons and zombies, the lowest tier of undead. It can be great at lv 5, but a CR 1 skeleton at lv 15 will not be that helpful. Doesn't matter how many you bring, they will be disposed off in a single AoE.

There is a level 6 version that gives you higher CR units.
https://roll20.net/compendium/dnd5e/Create Undead#content

But pretty much all official 5e adventures are lvl 1-12, and combat breaks apart after level 10 anyway, so Necromancers in 5e walk around with a splatoon of skeleton archers following them.

They can homebrew their subclasses which are IMO better than the base ones, right?

Probably arguable, but I say no. Some are fun like Greenmage and Mountaineer, many are straight up inferior and worse designed than the official subclasses they are trying to copy like the Spellblade being a discount Eldritch Knight.

 

[smaug]

Can someone summarize this game, good combat + mundane story/world + low lvl cap / slow progression?

-Good combat
-Skill checks for extra loot and information
-Boring story and quests, cardboard characters
-No quests aside from kill quests
-Pretty much no exploration

Basically it's a modern gold box game. Worth playing because of the combat.

Did they decide to dump exploration then? It's a dungeon is it not? Damn.

 

[V_K]

Yeah Necromancy got the short end of the stick. Almost all Necro spells are not worth taking anymore, and the only good one left in Animate Dead is not in the game.

Inflict Wounds tho.

 

[Reinhardt]

The best wiz for sure,ERYFKRAD would like it.

 

[HoboForEternity]

why the fuck the monastery area killed my framerate?? like it's almost unplayable i have GTX 1080

 

[Larianshill]

Inflict Wounds tho.

I dislike any spell that can fail, and do nothing.

 

[Jedi Master Radek]

I dislike those things too, and yes they did.

My poor wizard. Not only I made him a lolmaster, but also this.

 

[Lacrymas]

Inflict Wounds also requires you to be in melee range, which is not ideal. Even for melee Clerics, there are better ways to use your limited slots. I've never liked Inflict Wounds in any D&D-based game ever. Oblivion domain could've made Inflict Wounds a ranged spell.

 

[fantadomat]

Inflict Wounds also requires you to be in melee range, which is not ideal. Even for melee Clerics, there are better ways to use your limited slots. I've never liked Inflict Wounds in any D&D-based game ever. Oblivion domain could've made Inflict Wounds a ranged spell.

kingmaker did do a good twist on them,with the undead chick.

 

[Cryomancer]

Inflict Wounds also requires you to be in melee range, which is not ideal. Even for melee Clerics, there are better ways to use your limited slots. I've never liked Inflict Wounds in any D&D-based game ever. Oblivion domain could've made Inflict Wounds a ranged spell.

This spells with melee touch attack are generally the "high risk, high reward" type of spell. Like Eldritch Glaive on 3.5E and HARM for clerics. Talking about WLK, is Pact of the Blade decent? I don't expect a Eldritch Glaive 3.5E warlock.

 

[jackofshadows]

- Haste. Despite requiring concentration, is fantastic. Target your front liner and enjoy how they decimate enemies. Specially when you give it to a fully rested Paladin. Bosses go down in just a few turns.

Too weak. It's ok when you got it but not later on.

- Banishment targets CHA. Monster have for the most part shitty CHA saves. Do the math. Just target the most dangerous one and stop worrying about any issue. Requires concentration, but if you take the feat that gives you advantage in concentration checks, you can pretty much keep the enemy gone for the whole combat.

Yes it's reliable unlike most of the other control spells but competition on 4 lvl is tight so... disabling just one enemy with concentration slot? Meh. It would be S-tier if it could banish elementals for good but for some unknown to me reason that's not happening.

- Greater invisibilty. Making your caster untargetable and with advantage in all his attacks is great, specially for evokers despite needing concentration.

Total garbage, a waste (in Solasta's environment). In most cases it's possible to keep wizard safe and even to have advantage thanks to stealth. Well, unless we're talking some bizarre setups like 4 wizards with it.

Mind Twist seems promising but not the tentacles, +3 enemy saves speaking (haven't tried them yet). For some reason you didn't include the most powerful non-evocation spell, the banal boring shit conjure minor elementals which is definitely worth its concentration slot unlike many others.

Overall, I don't think control spells are that powerful here, especially on Cata. It rather refers to one's preferred playstyle. On the other hand, even with 'bloat' a simple fireball can deal considerable amounts of damage and quite reliably. It just might be boring to use for people who play dnd and dnd-based games for fucking years, I get it.

why the fuck the monastery area killed my framerate?? like it's almost unplayable i have GTX 1080

The water, apparently. Also had framerate disaster there.

 

[Lacrymas]

I'd just remove direct damage spells in general tbh, it just makes building Wizards and Sorcerers incredibly boring and predictable.

 

[Thac0]

Inflict Wounds tho.

Inflict Wounds also requires you to be in melee range, which is not ideal. Even for melee Clerics, there are better ways to use your limited slots. I've never liked Inflict Wounds in any D&D-based game ever. Oblivion domain could've made Inflict Wounds a ranged spell.

I was lukewarm on Inflict Wounds in the pnp, but Solasta made me love the spell. It is not really worth casting in the early game, where your limited spellslots are better used as Spiritual Weapons, Guiding Bolts and Healing Words. But that changes as soon at level 5. If you hold concentration on Spirit Guardians, have a Spiritual Weapon up, have run out off spellslots for Fireballs or Lightning Bolts and are decked out with high AC due to proper armor and shield, you want to be in melee range with your enemies. But using your action for a normal melee strike is a waste without extra attack, even with some of the cool magical maces. So Inflict Wounds becomes your new default melee attack. Hits much harder, accuracy scales off WIS instead off STR or Dex and crits are devastating.
Also with Solasta having less good spells than tabletop in general the opportunity cost for bringing it to the fight is lower.

 

[Thal]

Can someone summarize this game, good combat + mundane story/world + low lvl cap / slow progression?

-Good combat
-Skill checks for extra loot and information
-Boring story and quests, cardboard characters
-No quests aside from kill quests
-Pretty much no exploration

Basically it's a modern gold box game. Worth playing because of the combat.

Did they decide to dump exploration then? It's a dungeon is it not? Damn.

Being able to highlight stuff inside dungeons, including objects you can interract with, removes the need to use your brains to get ahead. And since pixel hunting doesn't work well with 3d environments, most are going to use that option. There are, however, some small optional areas with loot. There's also an overland map, but you don't have to find the locations, as they will be revealed to you when you progress in the plot.

 

[Cryomancer]

I'd just remove direct damage spells in general tbh, it just makes building Wizards and Sorcerers incredibly boring and predictable.

What do you think about Lamentations of the Flame princess magery? Is a retroclone? Sure, but has differences. Clerics needs to be lawful and magic users, chaotic. There are no flashy spells and spells are far more dangerous. A summon monster 1 going rogue can destroy an entire village.

----

edit : Anyone has news about sorc dlc? I an curious about how metamagic works in 5e. Only read a bit about it.

 

[Strange Fellow]

Yep, definitely should've done the volcano first. That was real easy.

 

[The_Mask]

kingmaker did do a good twist on them,with the undead chick.

So you can remember entire libraries of information about D&D, but can't remember Jaethal?

For shame, Fanta. For shame.

 

[Jedi Master Radek]

Divination is insane, it's just not a combat-focused school. Clairvoyance, Arcane Eye, Divination, Locate Creature, and Scrying are literally campaign-changers. They're almost impossible to implement in this type of videogame though, but one could argue the quick load is actually a Divination spell, and isn't the quick load the strongest spell of them all?

That's the art of adaptation. A computer RPG that includes divination spells should create some spells from scratch that would preserve the intention but work well mechanically in video game format, like for example a spell that lets you foresee movies enemies make, so you get a bonus to AC and saving throws against them. Or a spell that lets you position your party before a fight.