Cain on Games - Tim Cain's new YouTube channel

[Habichtswalder]

The idea itself has some potential but needs a lot of tweaking to work.
I like games that assign you a new character if you die - like Crusader Kings. I also like games that make it possible to play everybody in the world (the concept behind Watch Dogs: Legion was actually great but executed very badly).
But the way Tim describes the idea...well, it's not really fun. You basically need to die on purpose to become stronger. That doesn't sound fun. Also the entire mechanic that you are always the same soul but in a different body is weird because there is no need to roleplay as a new character, you're just looking different. That would be a waste of said potential.

I think his idea could work in a sandbox-like setting. If there's a fully simulated, living fantasy world and you do some quests with your character, try to become stronger...but then you die eventually and continue to play as someone else. New character, new background, new objectives. But the world itself just goes on. That would be kinda interesting. A simulated world but everytime you die, your role and perspective changes. Maybe you were a bandit and objective was to become rich, but your next character is a hero and his objective is to save the princess. A totally different perspective but in the same world.

Btw actually many of the cons that Tim points out are actually non-issues. Why would he worry about Save game-corruption and losing your entire progress? That problem is not tied to his idea but universal. He could just offer different savegame-slots. Sure, there could be savescummers...but who cares? They are clearly not the audience for a game like this.

 

[koyota]

A simulated world but everytime you die, your role and perspective changes. Maybe you were a bandit and objective was to become rich, but your next character is a hero and his objective is to save the princess. A totally different perspective but in the same world.

Weird West actually is fairly-well done as a very rough concept for this.


What I think would really be a dream game is seeing that concept done in a Morrowind-Style open world.
Power-Creep really kills a lot of the open-world games for me, but if you could adventure through the same open-world in multiple viewpoints, would allow a focus more on role-playing and less on becoming a jack-of-all trades power god.

Demon Lord Reincarnation Romanus Surt described a similar open-world idea:

Each quest is small in scope, which means you can play the game for a couple of hours, reach a logical conclusion, put it aside, then come back a few weeks later and continue your journey. The goal is to experiment with longevity while respecting the players' time.

Think library section full of short stories where you can pick one, have a burst of enjoyment, then come back for more, whenever you like.

 

[Habichtswalder]

A simulated world but everytime you die, your role and perspective changes. Maybe you were a bandit and objective was to become rich, but your next character is a hero and his objective is to save the princess. A totally different perspective but in the same world.

Weird West actually is fairly-well done as a very rough concept for this.


What I think would really be a dream game is seeing that concept done in a Morrowind-Style open world.
Power-Creep really kills a lot of the open-world games for me, but if you could adventure through the same open-world in multiple viewpoints, would allow a focus more on role-playing and less on becoming a jack-of-all trades power god.

Demon Lord Reincarnation Romanus Surt described a similar open-world idea:

Each quest is small in scope, which means you can play the game for a couple of hours, reach a logical conclusion, put it aside, then come back a few weeks later and continue your journey. The goal is to experiment with longevity while respecting the players' time.

Think library section full of short stories where you can pick one, have a burst of enjoyment, then come back for more, whenever you like.

Wasn't aware of the Weird West concept. Thanks for the suggestion (even though I don't like the scenario).

I'd agree with your idea that said concept would be great in a Open World. I also think it could pay off financially. It's a shame no one tried a similar concept yet. I believe there is stuff like Medieval Dynasty where you continue to play as your own son after your character dies but that's not a real RPG with quests (as far as I know). You also keep playing the same family so it's not really a new perspective /short story.

 

[Jacov]

 

[Saint_Proverbius]

It's interesting that they pick out that one model of a vault dweller in the original Fallout and say it looks like the character from the TV show. Now tell me, how many fat people do you see in that screenshot in that video's thumbnail?

 

[PunchYouInTheFace]

people

It's not "people". It's abstract idea of "people".

When the game tells you how Gizmo farts' smells do you think you can smell it?

Anyway, not sure what we are currently complaining about. Just feels like talking about the false comparison.

 

[Alienman]

Works with an art director he trusts since he doesn't know art and is color-blind.

And then we have the Outer Worlds.

 

[Butter]

Works with an art director he trusts since he doesn't know art and is color-blind.

And then we have the Outer Worlds.

You just summoned ROGUEY you fool.

 

[Saint_Proverbius]

Anyway, not sure what we are currently complaining about. Just feels like talking about the false comparison.

The point of that thumbnail is to show that they made Lucy look like a vault dweller sprite from the original game. Then you look at everyone else they cast to be a vault dweller in Vault 33, and you realize that almost none of the rest of them look like the vault dweller sprites from Fallout. It comes off more of a coincidence than something they actively attempted to do. One out of several dozens looks like a sprite from the original game.

 

[__scribbles__]

I talk about the pros and cons of being a contractor, as opposed to an employee, while doing game development work.

 

[Roguey]

Tim confirming that he doesn't have much influence on the direction of The Outer Worlds 2. It's all on Adler (and his bosses).

 

[Jacov]

Tim confirming that he doesn't have much influence on the direction of The Outer Worlds 2. It's all on Adler (and his bosses).

Redeemed. My favorite RPG developer once again!

 

[Wasteland]

Tim confirming that he doesn't have much influence on the direction of The Outer Worlds 2. It's all on Adler (and his bosses).

Redeemed. My favorite RPG developer once again!

Modern gaming in a nutshell: the best thing you can say about a developer is what he wasn't involved in.

 

[PunchYouInTheFace]

Is that actually roleplaying though? Seems more like some kind of challenge mode.

It is.

You're supposed to invent your character's character, not building a character.

RPG should focuses on delivering RPG experience not +1 bonus optimizing build perks simulator.

 

[PunchYouInTheFace]

It's all on Adler (and his bosses).

Carrie, Adler and Benecke. Everyone is stepping up to the bigger role.

 

[Infinitron]

I talk about tropes that I like to use, or more specifically, how I like to use them.

 

[Roguey]

Fallout easter eggs in other games


Since he doesn't include it in the list, apparently Tim has never played Weird West.

Understandable given that the combat style likely isn't his thing and you can't make your own characters.

 

[Infinitron]

I go into detail about the "horizontal slice" stage of game development, and how it can be used to make estimates for main and side quest lengths and locations.

 

[Roguey]

Tim takes the opposite approach Larian does (at least as far as the D:OS series goes) where they make doing every sidequest mandatory so you meet the level requirements of the main quest.

 

[Infinitron]

I talk about using game mechanics to support and reinforce the stories you are telling in your games.

 

[__scribbles__]

I talk about how games should be thought of in terms of player actions and not as just scenes (as in movies) or lines (as in books).

 

[BlackAdderBG]

I discovered one of my new favorite channels on YouTube, and I had to share it.

Channel:
https://www.youtube.com/@GamesOnHardMode

Not leveling in any other skill except the one you want is making the game easier, because of the level scaling. larping is defiantly not haw you roleplay

 

[Infinitron]

I discuss Shopping Cart Theory, and how this simple philosophical test can inform how you create motivations for NPCs in your games or how you reward players for quests.

 

[Roguey]

Tim doesn't bring up the people who put the carts back in a lazy haphazard way, creating a real snarl that makes it both difficult to put your own cart in and an utter mess for the employee to sort out later.

 

[Infinitron]

I talk about my favorite chocolate bar and my favorite brands of chocolate.