Cain on Games - Tim Cain's new YouTube channel

[Infinitron]

I talk about how to edit your game's story, both how to look for problems and how to suggest solutions.

 

[Infinitron]

Tim Cain is reading your Outer Worlds posts:

Please enjoy Salty Tim and his take on modern capitalism.

 

[Roguey]

Dummies think he was paid to like the tv show.

It wasn't money, it was attention, the experience, rubbing elbows with film/tv people.

Tim wonders if he should have been a bad boss because it's assumed that he was personally responsible for all of the problems in their games as an owner and the precious employees never did anything wrong (the attitude Chris Avellone has towards Obsidian ).

His take is that companies respond to customer behavior.

 

[BlackheartXIII]

The bereavement fares scamming phenomenon reminds me of The New Yorker's Patricia Marks article on the emotional support animal certification scam. https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2014/10/20/pets-allowed

 

[Sweeper]

The more I listen to Tim Cain talk, the less I like him.
But also, judging by some of the comments, I'm pretty sure Tim is going to end up in a loony bin eventually cause he apparently can't help himself and has to read them all.

 

[Monk]

"Original Fallout co-creator Tim Cain says 'critique of capitalism was never the point' of the games and if anything they're about how 'war is inevitable given basic human nature'"

"Critique of capitalism was never the point of Fallout." How can you tell? Because "the game went out of its way to mention that other countries like China were also behaving terribly." Which is very true, of course. In the original isometric Fallouts that Cain worked as a lead on, the US was a horrifying dystopia: A chauvinist, capitalist hellscape that imposed its will on the world and shot anyone who disagreed, but it wasn't unique. Fallout's China—which never dropped the 'smash the old world and forge the new world' ideology of the Mao Zedong Thought era—was also plenty violent. In fact, in Cain's original vision it was China who dropped the bomb first.

 

[NecroLord]

Who the fuck said the original Fallout was a critique on Capitalism other than Kotaku and IGN retards?

 

[mindx2]

Who the fuck said the original Fallout was a critique on Capitalism other than Kotaku and IGN retards?

I was thinking the same thing. Like "What?!" Never once since playing it from its release did I ever think this. I thought it was pretty spot on with how the end of the world survivors would behave and interact. Brutal with might=right and a barter system attached in the more organized "civilized" areas.

 

[Roguey]

Who the fuck said the original Fallout was a critique on Capitalism other than Kotaku and IGN retards?

"Media literacy" crew (people who believe every work of fiction was written with the intent to support their left-wing political views)

 

[NecroLord]

Who the fuck said the original Fallout was a critique on Capitalism other than Kotaku and IGN retards?

I was thinking the same thing. Like "What?!" Never once since playing it from its release did I ever think this. I thought it was pretty spot on with how the end of the world survivors would behave and interact. Brutal with might=right and a barter system attached in the more organized "civilized" areas.

War.
War never changes.
That's Fallout.
Humanity will always be the same.
Drop fucking nukes on it and bathe it in radiation and it will still be the same.
Same human pettiness, greed, brutality...

 

[Butter]

Who the fuck said the original Fallout was a critique on Capitalism other than Kotaku and IGN retards?

That article got linked on Reddit a few times and they had to immediately shut it down because people were losing their shit.

 

[SlightlyRadioactive]

Who the fuck said the original Fallout was a critique on Capitalism other than Kotaku and IGN retards?

The TV series showrunners, I guess. That's what happens when the original creators of an IP are not even consulted when a new adaptation is made.

 

[Infinitron]

I give an update about one of my toys, detailing what I have done and what I plan to do, so you can see a toy evolve into a game.

 

[Kamaz]

I am surprised there was less of an "outrage" here over the "cancellation" of Tim Cain because of his refusal to repent capitalism.

 

[Artyoan]

Might wait to see if he apologizes and says all other interpretations are just as valid as his own.

 

[Melcar]

Goddamn, it's just a game. Holy shit, these people are insufferable.

 

[Alienman]

How did Fallout 3 lean into it more, like one is saying? I can't remember, except the anti-commie robot, but the brotherhood did not create him. Even if he would be, I don't see how it would be a nod towards capitalism bad, mmkay.

 

[rojay]

I didn't play much Fallout 3, and I wasn't paying attention when my son played on my account but I had the impression it was some sort of anti-capitalist, anti-fascist rabbit hole, where the designers were using 1950s tropes but really referencing the 1980s Reagan-era Patriotism vibe in order to mock US Exceptionalism. I could be totally off on that, though, and I don't care enough to research it. God spare us from the fucktards on both ends of that spectrum.

 

[processdaemon]

I am surprised there was less of an "outrage" here over the "cancellation" of Tim Cain because of his refusal to repent capitalism.

In my opinion it's only a cancellation if it actually impacts the person, if it's just bitching and it dies down it's just whiny hysterics doing their thing and not really worth thinking about. I remember Boyarsky going out of his way to say that The Outer Worlds wasn't trying to say all capitalism is bad and seeing some people complain about that too, but it never went anywhere and I'd be surprised if this does either provided that Tim doesn't fan the fires with endless apologies or explanations.

 

[Infinitron]

There's no outrage against Tim Cain here, just some coping.

 

[Kamaz]

Player 2 has joined the game:

 

[Butter]

"Fallout was always a critique of capitalism."

> Here's Chris Avellone and Tim Cain both saying that's wrong.

"The great thing about art is that all interpretations are valid."

 

[processdaemon]

It seems like a lot of the drama is people who clearly don't know anything about the games or their creators and are just directionlessly mad about everything.

Favourite example so far:

 

[Roguey]

Might wait to see if he apologizes and says all other interpretations are just as valid as his own.

He included that as part of his initial comment, that he doesn't mind if people personally interpret Fallout as anti-capitalist. The man who wants to be liked by everyone.

 

[Elttharion]

Its pretty funny. When MCA said the same thing redditors were seething and saying things like 'Well this is just Avellone, he only worked on the sequels, he has no way of knowing what the original creators intended, the real person behind Fallout is Tim Cain anyway, etc, etc'. Now Tim said the same thing and their new argument is 'Well a lot of people worked on the games so its possible some of them added those themes without him noticing'.

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