From Software Elden Ring - From Software's new game with writing by GRRM

[somerandomdude]

Malenia's difficulty is overrated, once you figure out that all of her attacks can be avoided by sprinting backwards, or to the side, you don't even need to roll once to beat her. All her big attacks are hugely telegraphed.

The only thing that might give you a problem is the clones attack in phase 2, sometimes she might just rise up and do the clones attack when you're attacking her, especially after whiffing that sword slam move for a big opening. She's got way more openings at mid range, stuff like reduvia blood blade skill can destroy her, there's lots of openings to spam this in phase 1 and 2.

 

[mediocrepoet]

Malenia's difficulty is overrated, once you figure out that all of her attacks can be avoided by sprinting backwards, or to the side

From's games' difficulty is overrated, once you figure out that you can avoid everything by sprinting backwards or to the side and kiting with magic and shit.

 

[somerandomdude]

From's games' difficulty is overrated, once you figure out that you can avoid everything by sprinting backwards or to the side and kiting with magic and shit.

A lot of bosses will track you and hit you if you try that. You can't do that on Maliketh for example. Full sprint to the side, his projectiles still tracked me.

One of the first things I tried on a new boss was to see if I could strafe, backpedal, or run to the side to dodge a move instead of rolling, or find a deadzone in a combo attack. Surprisingly, there's very little such openings in this game. Huge telegraphed thrust attack, and I run to the side to avoid it? Nope, perfect tracking, got stuffed, you gotta be literally point blank in order to side step a thrust in this game, if you're even 3ft away from their face they track you.

 

[mediocrepoet]

From's games' difficulty is overrated, once you figure out that you can avoid everything by sprinting backwards or to the side and kiting with magic and shit.

A lot of bosses will track you and hit you if you try that. You can't do that on Maliketh for example. Full sprint to the side, his projectiles still tracked me.

Yeah, it's weird that his room is full of pillars. I wonder what you could use those for. I guess we'll never know.

 

[somerandomdude]

Yeah, it's weird that his room is full of pillars. I wonder what you could use those for. I guess we'll never know.

You can't avoid everything by kiting and using the terrain. That worked in earlier installments in the series, like Demon's Souls, DS1, but DS2, 3, and this game, they gradually improved the tracking on mob attacks to mitigate the effectiveness of strafing and backpedaling, because in games like Demon's Souls you literally could avoid everything without rolling.

 

[Bloodeyes]

A gripe about my greatsword: I hate the R1. I miss anything that's shorter than me and standing to my right, or anything standing downhill from me. Also, the R2 is just a slower R1. I wish it had the standard greatsword moves. This can be compensated for. I'm just doing jump attacks and L2s every time I attack and not using my standard attacks at all. It's not a deal breaker, in fact I'm leaning into it. I'm using the claw talisman and will be getting the raptor's black feathers when I get up top. I feel a bit like a one trick pony, just jump attacking everything. But it works and it actually seems faster than my R1.

 

[mediocrepoet]

Yeah, it's weird that his room is full of pillars. I wonder what you could use those for. I guess we'll never know.

You can't avoid everything by kiting and using the terrain. That worked in earlier installments in the series, like Demon's Souls, DS1, but DS2, 3, and this game, they gradually improved the tracking on mob attacks to mitigate the effectiveness of strafing and backpedaling, because in games like Demon's Souls you literally could avoid everything without rolling.

You're aware there's a horse in this one, right? And far more environmental obstacles. There's a jump button too. I wonder if it could be used to go places the AI can't and bring back Morrowind memories? etc.

The same reductive BS you posted could be used against the entire series.

 

[Lambach]

I'm kinda disappointed with offensive Incantations so far, tbf. Even with appropriate Talismans, a +21 Seal and 42 Faith, the damage is rather pitiful on most of them, specially compared to FP cost. Those capable of pulling off solid damage are either very difficult to line up correctly or get dodged by tougher enemies quite easily. The only one that saved my ass on more than a few occasions is Black Flame, since it's fairly cheap and has a damage bonus that is a percentage of its target's max HP, so it's ideal for staying safe and melting those slower Bosses with a billion HP. Black Flame Ritual is also kinda nice, but to use it effectively, I have to be in melee range, so what's the point? If I'm going up that close, I'll just switch back to dual Katanas and slice the fucker up.

Granted, I still don't have most of those Incantations that I see people consider to be the most powerful ones, so maybe those will work better.

 

[mediocrepoet]

I'm kinda disappointed with offensive Incantations so far, tbf. Even with appropriate Talismans, a +21 Seal and 42 Faith, the damage is rather pitiful on most of them, specially compared to FP cost. Those capable of pulling off solid damage are either very difficult to line up correctly or get dodged by tougher enemies quite easily. The only one that saved my ass on more than a few occasions is Black Flame, since it's fairly cheap and has a damage bonus that is a percentage of its target's max HP, so it's ideal for staying safe and melting those slower Bosses with a billion HP. Black Flame Ritual is also kinda nice, but to use it effectively, I have to be in melee range, so what's the point? If I'm going up that close, I'll just switch back to dual Katanas and slice the fucker up.

Granted, I still don't have most of those Incantations that I see people consider to be the most powerful ones, so maybe those will work better.

Black Flame Ritual can be fun because it's quick and like an aoe combustion. But generally incantations suit sort of specific situations a bit more than sorceries and in exchange, they pick up a ton of utility. Sorceries tend to cast more quickly and have more long range options, but are more of a one trick pony since most sorceries amount to various types of hyperbeams and projectiles.

 

[somerandomdude]

You're aware there's a horse in this one, right? And far more environmental obstacles. There's a jump button too. I wonder if it could be used to go places the AI can't and bring back Morrowind memories? etc.

The same reductive BS you posted could be used against the entire series.

Totally forgot to bring my horse for all these non-overworld fights. Thanks for the tip!

 

[Dhaze]

Yeah, it's weird that his room is full of pillars. I wonder what you could use those for. I guess we'll never know.

You can't avoid everything by kiting and using the terrain. That worked in earlier installments in the series, like Demon's Souls, DS1, but DS2, 3, and this game, they gradually improved the tracking on mob attacks to mitigate the effectiveness of strafing and backpedaling, because in games like Demon's Souls you literally could avoid everything without rolling.

It's still doable in DS2 and DS3. I've beaten the Ivory King and Friede by just running away or moving a bit to the side; and these two are quite aggressive bosses in their respective games, so I'm guessing it's doable against pretty much any boss or enemy, really. Though it proved about as unfun as can be.

 

[somerandomdude]

It's still doable in DS2 and DS3. I've beaten the Ivory King and Friede by just running away or moving a bit to the side; and these two are quite aggressive bosses in their respective games, so I'm guessing it's doable against pretty much any boss or enemy, really. Though it proved about as unfun as can be.

The first time I played DS2, one of the first surprises was "wow, they actually buffed the tracking in this one?" when I couldn't side step a thrust attack from one of those knight enemies from 10ft away like I could in the previous 2 games. I don't have a problem with them buffing the tracking.

There's plenty of bosses in this who will track you with projectiles or with gap closers and hit you while you're sprinting away or to the side. I was surprised when it actually worked against Malenia, wasn't expecting that it would.

 

[Haplo]

A gripe about my greatsword: I hate the R1. I miss anything that's shorter than me and standing to my right, or anything standing downhill from me. Also, the R2 is just a slower R1. I wish it had the standard greatsword moves. This can be compensated for. I'm just doing jump attacks and L2s every time I attack and not using my standard attacks at all. It's not a deal breaker, in fact I'm leaning into it. I'm using the claw talisman and will be getting the raptor's black feathers when I get up top. I feel a bit like a one trick pony, just jump attacking everything. But it works and it actually seems faster than my R1.

R1 isn't that bad overall. Sucks against low frame enemies, though. R2.. well..

Get yourself a Watchdog's Greatsword

 

[Bloodeyes]

I'm kinda disappointed with offensive Incantations so far, tbf. Even with appropriate Talismans, a +21 Seal and 42 Faith, the damage is rather pitiful on most of them, specially compared to FP cost. Those capable of pulling off solid damage are either very difficult to line up correctly or get dodged by tougher enemies quite easily. The only one that saved my ass on more than a few occasions is Black Flame, since it's fairly cheap and has a damage bonus that is a percentage of its target's max HP, so it's ideal for staying safe and melting those slower Bosses with a billion HP. Black Flame Ritual is also kinda nice, but to use it effectively, I have to be in melee range, so what's the point? If I'm going up that close, I'll just switch back to dual Katanas and slice the fucker up.

Granted, I still don't have most of those Incantations that I see people consider to be the most powerful ones, so maybe those will work better.

I've only played faith casters. I did try a glintstone guy to level 31 briefly but it was too easy to be fun so I canned him and went back to faith. Your offensive casting is definitely too slow for most fights so as a faith caster you are primarily a melee user in combat. You do have some nice benefits to this though. Versatility. Your magic is weaker than glintstone in combat but it does everything. Healing, buffing and offensive casting. Glintstone only does combat, but it does it very well.

A good setup that helps with the slowness is to use two holy seals, one left hand, one right hand. This is especially good if you're using a hybrid build like STR/FTH or ARC/DEX/FTH (which would be phenomenal for a katana user like yourself). Left hand seal is just for blade buffs and heals (one shotting revenants is a big benefit) and right hand is for offensive casting. Both of these are secondary armaments, primary is weapon and shield. This way you can let off your slower casts in between enemy attacks then block with your shield.

You have a tool for every job as a faith caster. Undead, revenants, scarlet rot, death blight need not worry you. Anything too dickish to fight can get rotten breath. Frenzied burst is basically a rifle. Get that. It's not for in combat but it's great for sniping. The flame of frenzy is good for staggering dragons if you ride around the back of them on your horse. There are some melee spells but they aren't as good IMO as just using weapon arts. You have to take damage to use them and they don't do more damage than your weapons. Fighter/caster is better for faith than pure caster unless you're playing co-op or something.

You really are a do everything character. Sure your offensive casting is too slow for most fights, absolutely. I prefer that myself because it makes the game more exciting having to get in there and melee most things. Also, there is lightening spear. Not great damage but the non-charged version is quick enough to use in a fight, especially if you use the above setup.

 

[somerandomdude]

Yeah, it's weird that his room is full of pillars. I wonder what you could use those for. I guess we'll never know.

You can't avoid everything by kiting and using the terrain. That worked in earlier installments in the series, like Demon's Souls, DS1, but DS2, 3, and this game, they gradually improved the tracking on mob attacks to mitigate the effectiveness of strafing and backpedaling, because in games like Demon's Souls you literally could avoid everything without rolling.

It's still doable in DS2 and DS3. I've beaten the Ivory King and Friede by just running away or moving a bit to the side; and these two are quite aggressive bosses in their respective games, so I'm guessing it's doable against pretty much any boss or enemy, really. Though it proved about as unfun as can be.

Did you get hit, or was it a flawless victory?

 

[Dhaze]

With Ivory King I got hit. I don't remember which, but one of his attacks (his lunging slash, maybe?) had a weird hitbox that extended to the side in disaccord with the visuals, and I could simply not avoid hit consistently.

Friede was flawless. Last thing I ever did in DS3; it took too many attempts over too many hours and I had had enough at last.

 

[mediocrepoet]

With Ivory King I got hit. I don't remember which, but one of his attacks (his lunging slash, maybe?) had a weird hitbox that extended to the side in disaccord with the visuals, and I could simply not avoid hit consistently.

DS2 had some really fucky hitboxes, I think the worst in the entire series.

 

[somerandomdude]

DS2 had some really fucky hitboxes, I think the worst in the entire series.

Someone called the whaaaaambulance, and the prognosis is in:

 

[Dhaze]

With Ivory King I got hit. I don't remember which, but one of his attacks (his lunging slash, maybe?) had a weird hitbox that extended to the side in disaccord with the visuals, and I could simply not avoid hit consistently.

DS2 had some really fucky hitboxes, I think the worst in the entire series.

No, all DS games—DS2 neither more nor less than another—have really fucky hitboxes. But because of DS2's bad initial reception and what could only be described as a certain mob mentality, the hitbox problem was blown out of proportion with examples being circlejerked around; and to this day it remains a sort of meme.

For one, the infamous Pursuer's stab-grab was in nearly every salty thread during the first few weeks of the game's life. And it was incessantly compared to the equally infamous .gif of a fight versus a Black Knight in the Kiln Of The First Flame.

But it's really easy to turn the tables around since the Dancer has the exact same problem, because grabs' hitboxes are overall pretty bad in the series, with the player often being teleported into the grab. And she has straight up horrible hitboxes. Meanwhile, look how tight they can be in Dark Souls 2. Look at that. I mean, come on, look. But in Dark Souls 1, they can look like this.

– The Titanite Demon's stab hitbox, which extends way to the side.
– The Pontiff Sulyvahn's stab hitbox.
– Though admitedly of a different nature, do you remember that one hanging corspe in DS3?
– The Four Kings' stab.
– When Giant Crabs smash, their right claw can invisibly quintuple in girth.
– Ceaseless Discharge's slam (with a very fitting thread title) has been much talked about.
– Fighting the Greataxe-wielding undeads on the stairs was not recommended.
– Who could forget the Nameless King's slam?
– The forward-charging rampage of the Gaping Dragon (like the Four Kings, not fixed in the remaster, because why would they bother?).
– The Soul Of Cinder's running spear charge, and pretty much every hitbox with his spear, in fact.
– Father Ariandel's furious smashy-smashy.
– And may we never forget the absolutely unforgivable lingering hitbox during the fight against Ornstein and Smough, for it truly is terrible (in short: where Smough was attacking when Ornstein died, well, that spot remained an active hitbox for the whole fight).
– Also, hitable boxes should be mentionned.

Of course there's many more. And let's not even venture into the territory of enemy attacks that go through walls; the spear-wielding Silver Knights in Anor Londo and the big Serpent-Men with chained axes in Archdragon Peak (who can hit you about 4 or 5 meters behind a wall) are arguably the worst offenders.

No, really, DS2 is and will likely forever remain the black sheep people like to beat on. But in the entire series, many hitboxes are gorgeous while an equal number are horrendous—and they're pretty evenly spread out amongst the titles.

I've uninstalled Elden Ring, but I'll possibly play it again if some interesting DLC comes out. And I look forward to being grabbed by Astel's arms while I'm behind him.

/e: fixed broken link.

 

[mediocrepoet]

No, really, DS2 is and will likely forever remain the black sheep people like to beat on. But in the entire series, many hitboxes are gorgeous while an equal number are horrendous—and they're pretty evenly spread out amongst the titles.

Eh, I've said numerous times that DS2 is my favourite among the Soulsborne games. But I still think it had the worst feeling hitboxes. It's also the game I have the most hours in, though Elden Ring will likely surpass it sometime this calendar year.

Still though, you make a decent point. I would say that most of Elden Ring's hitboxes are pretty tight though. A few of the grabs notwithstanding.

 

[Dhaze]

Eh, I've said numerous times that DS2 is my favourite among the Soulsborne games.

There are dozens of us. Dozens!

If it wasn't clear, I wasn't aiming "People like to beat on DS2" at you, by the way; it's just a general commentary on how that game is perceived and treated at large. The whole 'B Team' argument that was incessantly churned on various forums reeked of petty meanness, and it's my impression the game never completely recovered.

Dropping down into the orange-red chaos roiling beneath Eleum Loyce, accompanied by those glorious knights who then fight their burned equals before sacrificing themselves to seal the gates; that will forever remain one of my greatest gaming memories. Fantastic game, chock-full of fantastic ideas unfortunately mangled by developmental hell.

Still though, you make a decent point. I would say that most of Elden Ring's hitboxes are pretty tight though. A few of the grabs notwithstanding.

Yeah, I think the hitboxes have actually gotten a bit better this time around. But methinks grabs will forever remain shitty in FromSoft's games—after all even in Sekiro the Ogre's grab is completely bonkers.

 

[Vibalist]

I'm kinda disappointed with offensive Incantations so far, tbf. Even with appropriate Talismans, a +21 Seal and 42 Faith, the damage is rather pitiful on most of them, specially compared to FP cost. Those capable of pulling off solid damage are either very difficult to line up correctly or get dodged by tougher enemies quite easily. The only one that saved my ass on more than a few occasions is Black Flame, since it's fairly cheap and has a damage bonus that is a percentage of its target's max HP, so it's ideal for staying safe and melting those slower Bosses with a billion HP. Black Flame Ritual is also kinda nice, but to use it effectively, I have to be in melee range, so what's the point? If I'm going up that close, I'll just switch back to dual Katanas and slice the fucker up.

Granted, I still don't have most of those Incantations that I see people consider to be the most powerful ones, so maybe those will work better.

I assume you have lightning spear? That spell carried me throughout my entire playthrough.

 

[Lambach]

I assume you have lightning spear? That spell carried me throughout my entire playthrough.

I tried it against Astel, the version in the Consecrated Snowfields. 500 damage fully charged if it's a headshot, ~300 IIRC if it's not. And I rarely had the luxury of charging it fully, so those numbers are even lower. Dude has over 18k HP, would've taken forever. I ultimately beat him with Black Flame, the percentage-based bonus damage seemed much more efficient.

 

[Lyric Suite]

Got a break from work just so i could post this lmao:



My parry-fu skills are weak as shit but i think i got the first phase down. Second one is giving me problems though. Don't mind the clusterfuck in the second phase i didn't expect her to do that attack first thing, confused the shit out of me.

And confusion is what the second phase is like because everything she does looks the fucking same. Every time she jumps in the air i have no idea what she is gonna do.

Guess i have to keep hammering until my brain gets used to it but man, this bitch is something. In one try she canceled her combos and jumped in the air and the swings of the Great Stars are so slow i had no time to do shit about it how the fuck is that legal lol.

 

[Lyric Suite]

Clarification on the parry thing: she has that attack where she does two fast swings i can't parry if my life depends on it. I guess my reflexes are just too slow, that's why i'm trying to keep my distance a bit so i can roll out of it and parry the other attacks that are easier.

Second phase is more of a problem because she is aggressive as hell and i wish i could parry her point blank the way NJClaw does but i'm no where near that level.

Also, notice how i didn't perform a critical attack at the end? Because for some fucked up reason she can survive it, even if her health is near zero i had to default with regular attacks. This game is wierd as shit sometimes.