From Software Elden Ring - From Software's new game with writing by GRRM

[Lyric Suite]

One question, are there larval tears in SotE? If so, how many, give and take?

There are, and I know from running around myself that there are at least 3 and supposedly 9 in the game as a whole according this dude.

Which is one thing that is legit retarded. The expansion encourages you to try different builds so why tf are there finite larval tears? You should be able to farm them.

Absolutely. Plus I blew all my tears during my 200+ hours NG run and if I discover now I need to change my build for the DLC I'm fucked. Either doomed to aimlessly run around with an unsuitable build, hoping to randomly find a tear, or just peruse the walkthrough like a little bitch.

Further proof that the Codex has gone full retard.

Infinite respec would obliterate any illusion of there being any choice in character building. It would discourage creating new characters and would remove the strategic element of making hard choices.

This is true for all RPGs. Just because Elden Ring happens to be larger than most doesn't mean your choices shouldn't matter all of a sudden, and 200+ hours or not it would feel pretty stupid if all you had to do is make one character and just rebuild that one ad infinitum. Come on now, i'd expect this kind of arguments form retarded normies, not Codexers.

 

[Ravielsk]

100% true. The final boss will light your screen up like a fireball for a good 3 seconds straight and there's no way to see where some of the attacks will land. You basically have to hope you're not standing in a pool of get fucked the moment the screen clears. And the best bit? Has zero recovery animation. Long start up but no recovery. He can immediately go into a full combo when he's done. And I know this because part of my strategy was to rush that attack down and hope I had room to survive after my 2 hits.

You forgot that is also tanks framerate by a good 50%. I went from stable 60fps to a 30-35fps just from that one screen wipe alone. Even if the fight itself was not a amalgamation of all the bad habits From picked up over the years this fuck up would be enough to sour it wholly. I cannot even imagine how much it must suck for people on weaker GPUs.

 

[Ravielsk]

Infinite respec would obliterate any illusion of there being any choice in character building.

If its an illusion there is no point in maintaining it. If there are real choice in your character build then infinite respec would not change anything about it. If anything it would strengthen those choices by letting the players seen just how much their choices affect their experience.

The only situation where respecing is bad is if you are trying to hide the fact that there are no real choices, that the whole RPG element is just smoke and mirrors.

 

[abija]

From were doing this before streaming really took off. They have always released poorly optimized games with stupid balancing then toned everything down and gave you extra souls after. It's pretty standard.

No they didn't. They took months even for bug fixes that weren't absolutely critical and balance changes took longer. Elden Ring was nerfed in 2 weeks and now we're down to less than 1 week...

Asmodan and others like him might be irrelevant for normal people but suits literally lose their shit when he posts negatively about a game. It's instant all hands on deck damage control mode.

 

[Damned Registrations]

Character builds have honestly kinda always been shit in Souls games. You're basically either a miracle caster, spell caster, or fighter. Unless you're doing some autistic shit to hit the poise breakpoint for the pvp meta weapon or something, it doesn't matter what your exact stats are. You pump life, pump a damage stat, and you're good to go. Everything else is fashion, which is why all the equipment has no identity and everything can be every element whenever you want. Honestly wish they never came up with the whole elemental infusion system, would have made finding a lightning spear or whatever actually cool and something worth building around.

 

[Hell Swarm]

100% true. The final boss will light your screen up like a fireball for a good 3 seconds straight and there's no way to see where some of the attacks will land. You basically have to hope you're not standing in a pool of get fucked the moment the screen clears. And the best bit? Has zero recovery animation. Long start up but no recovery. He can immediately go into a full combo when he's done. And I know this because part of my strategy was to rush that attack down and hope I had room to survive after my 2 hits.

You forgot that is also tanks framerate by a good 50%. I went from stable 60fps to a 30-35fps just from that one screen wipe alone. Even if the fight itself was not a amalgamation of all the bad habits From picked up over the years this fuck up would be enough to sour it wholly. I cannot even imagine how much it must suck for people on weaker GPUs.

Steam deck will drop to 15 FPS during the final fight. It's crazy the game is labeled Gold still. 15 FPS dodging move spam is not a good idea.

Infinite respec would obliterate any illusion of there being any choice in character building.

If its an illusion there is no point in maintaining it. If there are real choice in your character build then infinite respec would not change anything about it. If anything it would strengthen those choices by letting the players seen just how much their choices affect their experience.

The only situation where respecing is bad is if you are trying to hide the fact that there are no real choices, that the whole RPG element is just smoke and mirrors.

They have made it so your decisions don't matter. It used to be you did your build and that was that. A choice you made as the player. Now you have 30 respects so there isn't a choice any more. Same way you can't fight NPCs any more. As soon as you enter a hub you're locked out of your attack buttons. From have done everything they can to nerf the players ability to be punished for bad decision making and From were refreshing because they did stuff like Yurt and Lautrec which did punish the player for not paying attention.

 

[H. P. Lovecraft's Cat]

From were doing this before streaming really took off. They have always released poorly optimized games with stupid balancing then toned everything down and gave you extra souls after. It's pretty standard.

No they didn't. They took months even for bug fixes that weren't absolutely critical and balance changes took longer. Elden Ring was nerfed in 2 weeks and now we're down to less than 1 week...

Asmodan and others like him might be irrelevant for normal people but suits literally lose their shit when he posts negatively about a game. It's instant all hands on deck damage control mode.

Asmon said the DLC is a 10/10 and blamed his own mental problems for him sucking.

 

[Hell Swarm]

All the streamers are raving how amazing it is because they all got review copies 3 days early. They don't want to anger Bandai Namco so it's a perfect game. Same way all the negative reviews are "review bombing" and not legit players who think this DLC is beyond breaking point.

 

[cvv]

i'd expect this kind of arguments form retarded normies, not Codexers.

And I'd expect more thought put into yours. What illusion of choice? What are you talking about? Why would our build choices be an illusion and why would they not matter? Maybe it's late but I can't even...

Builds are clearly real. They matter. They would matter if you have 2 larvas, 20 larvas or farmable larvas. You're bored or struggling? Bam, two larvas in 10 minutes of farming, you can try a couple of new builds. Who's hurt, what's ruined, where's the tragedy? Eh...

 

[Lyric Suite]

It's got to be nearly impossible to beat some of these bosses without doing it.

Queue some nolife streamer finishing a SL1 no-damage run, naked, without the blessings, armed with a modded-in broken laddle from DS2.

They always do. But what those videos don't show is they spent 6 months grinding that run to pull it off.

They are already doing it now.

 

[Hell Swarm]

i'd expect this kind of arguments form retarded normies, not Codexers.

And I'd expect more thought put into yours. What illusion of choice? What are you talking about? Why would our build choices be an illusion and why would they not matter? Maybe it's late but I can't even...

Builds are clearly real. They matter. They would matter if you have 2 larvas, 20 larvas or farmable larvas. You're bored or struggling? Bam, two larvas in 10 minutes of farming, you can try a couple of new builds. Who's hurt, what's ruined, where's the tragedy? Eh...

You lose your choices mattering. If you spec into a colossal weapon build and you run into a boss that struggles against respecing to fast bleed build that decimates it makes any build decisions invalid. There's no pros or cons, there's simply respecting to burst the bosses down. You're never made to adapt your build and play style to overcome a counter to it. You just keep countering what they do by doing the exact solution.

 

[cvv]

If you spec into a colossal weapon build and you run into a boss that struggles against respecing to fast bleed build that decimates it makes any build decisions invalid.

Ok I see now but not sure I agree. It wouldn't be completely frictionless, you would have to farm for a bit and run to Renalla and do all that dance.

Btw you can change your build on the fly in DD2, AFAIK there's no friction at all, and I haven't seen many people being bothered by that. Maybe it'd be a much smaller problem that ya'll think

 

[Ravielsk]

From have done everything they can to nerf the players ability to be punished for bad decision making and From were refreshing because they did stuff like Yurt and Lautrec which did punish the player for not paying attention.

More like they keep writing themselves "get out of jail free" cards. This DLC is kind of the epitome of that particular attitude where they clearly built the DLC around for a very particular playstyle and nothing else. My hybrid spellsword character for example is completely cooked in the DLC because I never prioritized status build up. A perfectly valid choice in the base game but a utter fucking mistake for the DLC when bosses like Radhan have around 100K HP. He also two shots me even with 18 blessings, after the recent patch mind you, and regularly tanks my framerate... but I guess that is perfectly OK when I can just respec into a greatshield build and poke him to death.

Same with Mimic tear and other cheese strategies. It feels like they are here to cover up the fact that from does not want to mess around with balance so they just threw them in to have an excuse for why the boss is allowed to suck ass.

 

[Silva]

So, any stuff related to Godskins / blackflame / Gloom-Eyed Queen?

Or at least stuff that would fit such a build: death incantations, talismans, weapons, etc?

 

[Hell Swarm]

If you spec into a colossal weapon build and you run into a boss that struggles against respecing to fast bleed build that decimates it makes any build decisions invalid.

Ok I see now but not sure I agree. It wouldn't be completely frictionless, you would have to farm for a bit and run to Renalla and do all that dance.

Btw you can change your build on the fly in DD2, AFAIK there's no friction at all, and I haven't seen many people being bothered by that. Maybe it'd be a much smaller problem that ya'll think

Maybe it's a problem we've been talking about since Dark souls 3? Maybe people who value player choice and being punished for making bad mistakes aren't happy at From's current approach to babying their players? Bosses are insane but we can't trust the player not to kill a tranny in their hub area.

 

[H. P. Lovecraft's Cat]

Btw you can change your build on the fly in DD2, AFAIK there's no friction at all, and I haven't seen many people being bothered by that. Maybe it'd be a much smaller problem that ya'll think

It hurt the replayability of Dragon's Dogma 2, but only because the game becomes piss easy after a certain point and they don't let you have more than one character. That was such a stupid decision. Elden Ring doesn't have either of those problems.

 

[Mortmal]

You can always comet azur your way to victory in Elden ring, it's always going to work but that's not what people are complaining about.

I am afraid not. Comet Azur had its range nerfed badly. It will work on some of the easier bosses, on overworld drakes and dragons, for example, but not on the ultra-aggressive and fast-moving DLC bosses. I have seen melee builds doing considerably more damage than this. My sorcery build is easy mode for clearing PvE content, but it doesn’t shine at all on bosses.

 

[Damned Registrations]

Comet Azur was overrated as hell anyways. It was that Meteorite of Astel that was really busted, at least against large bosses. And for smaller bosses there's always night comet. Comet Azur is a meme that needs like 12 pieces to setup and hardly ever works.

 

[Hell Swarm]

You can always comet azur your way to victory in Elden ring, it's always going to work but that's not what people are complaining about.

I am afraid not. Comet Azur had its range nerfed badly. It will work on some of the easier bosses, on overworld drakes and dragons, for example, but not on the ultra-aggressive and fast-moving DLC bosses. I have seen melee builds doing considerably more damage than this. My sorcery build is easy mode for clearing PvE content, but it doesn’t shine at all on bosses.

Doesn't matter when you have Mimic tear casting it from one side and you the other.

Reflecting back on my time with the DLC I'm really disappointed in From baiting and switching a change in style. You meet the Lion and you get all these different elemental attacks and it seems like weather or elemental focus might matter. It's the first boss so you expect it to set the tone of the whole DLC and give you your first lessons in what to expect.. And then that doesn't appear any where else. The lion soldiers in late game have a similar but toned down theme and the second time you run into a Lion but now it has support (Fuck From for reusing bosses in a DLC this expensive). We're tracking down a master of mind fuck and possibly illusions and that never comes into play. Pretty much the only roll over from the Lion is AOE spam becomes pretty common for the main story bosses.

Last boss spoilers

It's pretty fucking gay the entire DLC is centered around a backpack. A backpack who has 1 single attack and is other wise barely an entity in the entire fight. I was hoping for a fight where he's trying to charm you and using unique magic. Like Quindolin in Dark souls 1. But no, he's a backpack who adds Holy element to a guy which clashes entirely with the lore of the backpack up until that point. Sure he's becoming a God or whatever but if your gimmick is charming people you should have some effects that play upon that.

 

[Crayll]

So, any stuff related to Godskins / blackflame / Gloom-Eyed Queen?

Or at least stuff that would fit such a build: death incantations, talismans, weapons, etc?

Surprisingly nothing blackflame related at all as far as I know.
There is one lore tidbit that could be a Gloam Eyed Queen hint, but that's all.

Last boss spoilers

It's pretty fucking gay the entire DLC is centered around a backpack. A backpack who has 1 single attack and is other wise barely an entity in the entire fight. I was hoping for a fight where he's trying to charm you and using unique magic. Like Quindolin in Dark souls 1. But no, he's a backpack who adds Holy element to a guy which clashes entirely with the lore of the backpack up until that point. Sure he's becoming a God or whatever but if your gimmick is charming people you should have some effects that play upon that.

last boss spoilers

Technically he does have a charm attack, if you eat the grab twice he charms you into insta-death.

 

[Lyre Mors]

Ok I see now but not sure I agree. It wouldn't be completely frictionless, you would have to farm for a bit and run to Renalla and do all that dance.

Respecing should be available, but it should be more sparingly so. You should have to live with your build choices to some degree, because that's what gives your choices weight. I think this is a concept any fan of RPGs can understand.

As it stands now, Elden Ring gives you too many opportunities to respec in a single run. With the Larval Tears found through normal exploration (ie I never use a guide) from the base game coupled with what I've found in the DLC, I have 11 total at my disposal currently. In my opinion, that's too many opportunities to completely rebuild your character and still feel like the choices you've made matter. And I know I'm going to find quite a few more before I'm done (about 20 hours into Shadow of the Erdtree right now).

EDIT: In modern Fromsoft games I usually set out with the self-imposed rule of sticking with my build until at least the end of the main campaign, but I can understand why others might want the option to respec. For the size of Elden Ring, maybe 4-6 respec opportunities through a single run seems reasonable to me. It provides the option, but the limit makes it so you can't haphazardly fiddle around with it.

 

[Silva]

There is one lore tidbit that could be a Gloam Eyed Queen hint, but that's all.

Which is..?

 

[Hell Swarm]

So, any stuff related to Godskins / blackflame / Gloom-Eyed Queen?

Or at least stuff that would fit such a build: death incantations, talismans, weapons, etc?

Surprisingly nothing blackflame related at all as far as I know.
There is one lore tidbit that could be a Gloam Eyed Queen hint, but that's all.

Last boss spoilers

It's pretty fucking gay the entire DLC is centered around a backpack. A backpack who has 1 single attack and is other wise barely an entity in the entire fight. I was hoping for a fight where he's trying to charm you and using unique magic. Like Quindolin in Dark souls 1. But no, he's a backpack who adds Holy element to a guy which clashes entirely with the lore of the backpack up until that point. Sure he's becoming a God or whatever but if your gimmick is charming people you should have some effects that play upon that.

last boss spoilers

Technically he does have a charm attack, if you eat the grab twice he charms you into insta-death.

I know about that. You can heal it off with an item and use the item during the grab so it doesn't really exist.

Being able to freely respect also lets From make lazy boss designs. If I can respec into a different build they know players can always respect to meet any challenge. They no longer have to balance stuff to five heals and every weapon should be viable

 

[abija]

Asmon said the DLC is a 10/10 and blamed his own mental problems for him sucking.

When "I'm Done with Elden Ring DLC. I Quit." clickbait title hit youtube there were meetings between people that have no clue about gaming that decided to pressure From. That's how shit like this happens.

 

[Lyric Suite]

i'd expect this kind of arguments form retarded normies, not Codexers.

And I'd expect more thought put into yours. What illusion of choice? What are you talking about? Why would our build choices be an illusion and why would they not matter? Maybe it's late but I can't even...

Builds are clearly real. They matter. They would matter if you have 2 larvas, 20 larvas or farmable larvas. You're bored or struggling? Bam, two larvas in 10 minutes of farming, you can try a couple of new builds. Who's hurt, what's ruined, where's the tragedy? Eh...

Illusion was the wrong word. Limited respec makes the choice matter. Infinite respec makes choices pointless. Why even bother crafting a build or weighting your next step. Also, why bother making new characters. Why even have different classes in the game with different build possibilites.

Who's hurt? The player gets hurt because now the game is suddenly less meaningful. To have to explain this in an RPG forum of all places is kinda of bizzare.

Let's not also forget there's limited resources to fully upgrade weapons too. While the difference between a +24 or +25 weapon isn't anything major, that too requires an hard choice.

If you want to try out different builds, just make a new character. I can't imagine anything more boring than just playing the same character indefinitely, just going through NG+ and then NG++ etc until you got so many levels there's not even gonna be a point respecing since your stats are all maxed out anyway.