From Software Elden Ring - From Software's new game with writing by GRRM

[Lyric Suite]

Yes, what could be more meaningful than a sword you don't have the stats for, will never equip and serves no function even as junk?

Every single one of those supposed pieces of "junk" has dozens of possible future builds filed in my brain. Whenever i find a new weapon in a FromSoft game i have to stash it quickly because it could be the beginning of a new love i may not afford.

Loot in Diablo-likes it's literally just refuse. Whenever i play a game with that system i feel dirty, like i just stepped into a seedy gambling parlor. It's incredibly immersion breaking and it is only one step away from loot boxes and micro-transactions.

 

[Lyric Suite]

Ok now i know i'm talking to a mental defective.

This loses its sting when you said the same thing after I agreed with you on a previous post.

I can't take anybody seriously after a comment like that.

 

[cvv]

Loot in Diablo-likes it's literally just refuse. Whenever i play a game with that system i feel dirty

Didn't want to jump in this debate which tilts more and more to retardation but what I can say is this - before you talk expansively about Nioh loot being exactly like Diablo you should at least play the game.

 

[Silverfish]

Every single one of those supposed pieces of "junk" has dozens of possible future builds filed in my brain. Whenever i find a new weapon in a FromSoft game i have to stash it quickly because it could be the beginning of a new love i may not afford.

Well naturally, who wouldn't come up with dozens of builds for the light crossbow?

Loot in Diablo-likes it's literally just refuse. Whenever i play a game with that system i feel dirty, like i just stepped into a seedy gambling parlor. It's incredibly immersion breaking and it is only one step away from loot boxes and micro-transactions.

I can totally see the similarity between free and paid items in a game.

I can't take anybody seriously after a comment like that.

It's cool. I haven't taken you seriously for a while now.

 

[abija]

Didn't want to jump in this debate which tilts more and more to retardation but what I can say is this - before you talk expansively about Nioh loot being exactly like Diablo you should at least play the game.

So which are the significant differences between loot in D3 and Nioh? Maybe I was sleeping when playing Nioh and didn't notice them. Sure team ninja doesn't design for 2yr olds so the system is actually populated instead of being kept to a minimum. It also takes a LOT longer to get to the item hunting part so probably most people don't get to it. But it sure looks like same system to me.

I don't even have a problem with that type of loot system (I thought it fit the game) but it me made mostly ignore loot in Nioh since I had the feeling it only really matters in later stages and I didn't feel like spending the time to get there after finishing the games. So what did I miss that made it meaningful in that first run?

 

[cvv]

Didn't want to jump in this debate which tilts more and more to retardation but what I can say is this - before you talk expansively about Nioh loot being exactly like Diablo you should at least play the game.

So which are the significant differences between loot in D3 and Nioh? Maybe I was sleeping when playing Nioh

I'm not saying both systems are totally different, they're clearly close, it's more about how both influence (taint) the gameplay. In Nioh you can craft, reforge, soul match, inherit effects etc. The result is the whole thing is way less grindy and the gameplay much more enjoyable, which is what we're talking about here.

In other words, diablo after a while starts to feel like brainless gambling machine but in Nioh the loot system doesn't interfere with the game being a proper, hardcore, rich action-RPG even after dozens of hours. That's why I said you have to PLAY the game first to understand the difference.

 

[Haplo]

Didn't want to jump in this debate which tilts more and more to retardation but what I can say is this - before you talk expansively about Nioh loot being exactly like Diablo you should at least play the game.

So which are the significant differences between loot in D3 and Nioh? Maybe I was sleeping when playing Nioh and didn't notice them. Sure team ninja doesn't design for 2yr olds so the system is actually populated instead of being kept to a minimum. It also takes a LOT longer to get to the item hunting part so probably most people don't get to it. But it sure looks like same system to me.

I don't even have a problem with that type of loot system but it me made mostly ignore loot in Nioh since I had the feeling it only really matters in later stages and I didn't feel like spending the time to get there after finishing the games. So what did I miss that made it meaningful in that first run?

Well, there's actually different design philosphy there.
Soulslikes are: find a weapon, learn its moveset, adapt your gamestyle to the new weapon if you like it (and it fits your build... or maybe you can change the build nowadays).
There is (usually) only 1 off each weapon with its moveset. You keep investing in the weapons you like with upgrading mats to improve their stats.

Nioh is very different. You choose a weapon and abilities you'd like to focus on and have that weapon from the start and generally stick with it (although you can switch, if you want to), improving your mastery in it, learning its new abilities troughout the game.
And you find better versions of that weapon type troughout the game. Plus you get to choose from a plethora of pet spirits, which will enchance your combat abilities and offer extra powers (which are also tailored to specific playstyles and even weapons). Plus you gather equipment "sets", which bestow various powerful bonuses, some of which fit your playstyle well.

Edit: The question concerned D3 and Nioh
Well, I'll leave this here anyway.


Perhaps the biggest difference from Diablo is how customizable everything is in Nioh. You can train Ninjutsu, Onmyo magic alongside your main arm, you can even invest in ranged combat. And you can fine tune your equipment and spirit pet to perfectly support your build.
A Barbarian won't be using magic and ranged weaponry in Diablo.

 

[abija]

In Nioh you can craft, reforge, soul match, inherit effects etc. The result is the whole thing is way less grindy and the gameplay much more enjoyable, which is what we're talking about here.

Just like in D3?

In other words, diablo after a while starts to feel like brainless gambling machine but in Nioh the loot system doesn't interfere with the game being a proper, hardcore, rich action-RPG even after dozens of hours. That's why I said you have to PLAY the game first to understand the difference.

Did you get in Nioh to the item hunting part, when you look for specific things? Dooes the loot even really matter til then other than adding a tiny bit of spice to the action gameplay?

 

[HumanTotemPole]

Perfume bottles and a decent shield break PvE outside bosses. Enemies not able to deal with the AoE or the lingering hitbox other than by poising through it. With a modicum of timing and positioning easy to chip down anything. Very low commit on the attack animations as well and a built in feint. Feels like they need an ammo limit.

 

[ERYFKRAD]

A Barbarian won't be using magic and ranged weaponry in Diablo

Or anywhere else.

 

[Lyric Suite]

Loot in Diablo-likes it's literally just refuse. Whenever i play a game with that system i feel dirty

Didn't want to jump in this debate which tilts more and more to retardation but what I can say is this - before you talk expansively about Nioh loot being exactly like Diablo you should at least play the game.

I did.

No difference in the loot system that i can see other than the fact Nioh was actually worse. At least Diablo does have unique weapons.

 

[Lyric Suite]

Didn't want to jump in this debate which tilts more and more to retardation but what I can say is this - before you talk expansively about Nioh loot being exactly like Diablo you should at least play the game.

So which are the significant differences between loot in D3 and Nioh? Maybe I was sleeping when playing Nioh and didn't notice them. Sure team ninja doesn't design for 2yr olds so the system is actually populated instead of being kept to a minimum. It also takes a LOT longer to get to the item hunting part so probably most people don't get to it. But it sure looks like same system to me.

I don't even have a problem with that type of loot system but it me made mostly ignore loot in Nioh since I had the feeling it only really matters in later stages and I didn't feel like spending the time to get there after finishing the games. So what did I miss that made it meaningful in that first run?

Well, there's actually different design philosphy there.
Soulslikes are: find a weapon, learn its moveset, adapt your gamestyle to the new weapon if you like it (and it fits your build... or maybe you can change the build nowadays).
There is (usually) only 1 off each weapon with its moveset. You keep investing in the weapons you like with upgrading mats to improve their stats.

Nioh is very different. You choose a weapon and abilities you'd like to focus on and have that weapon from the start and generally stick with it (although you can switch, if you want to), improving your mastery in it, learning its new abilities troughout the game.
And you find better versions of that weapon type troughout the game. Plus you get to choose from a plethora of pet spirits, which will enchance your combat abilities and offer extra powers (which are also tailored to specific playstyles and even weapons). Plus you gather equipment "sets", which bestow various powerful bonuses, some of which fit your playstyle well.

Edit: The question concerned D3 and Nioh
Well, I'll leave this here anyway.


Perhaps the biggest difference from Diablo is how customizable everything is in Nioh. You can train Ninjutsu, Onmyo magic alongside your main arm, you can even invest in ranged combat. And you can fine tune your equipment and spirit pet to perfectly support your build.
A Barbarian won't be using magic and ranged weaponry in Diablo.

The skill system and the loot system are two different things.

Also, i'm not a fan of the kind of "fine tuning" that goes on those games too. I just don't like lottery aspect, and i don't like to scrounge for extra percentages on stats i don't even know what they do half the time. Even in Diablo, i used to do Diablo/Baal runs to find unique gear. I have no taste for all this nonsense about grinding to get the resources for rerolling on your items so you can get that extra 1% on your suffixes or prefixes to me it just feels like a system designed to dupe people even more, and i think Diablo 4 is a case in point in that respect given the number of suffixes and stats is ludicrously and unnecessarily high. It's intentionally made so you have to grind EVEN more. Look at this fucking shit for the love of God:

https://blizzardwatch.com/2023/07/21/diablo-4-titles-complete-list/

I don't care if 90% of the weapons you find are going to be stashed away never to be used. That is true even in D&D. Hell, i used to get excited when i found bard shit in the Infinite Engine games even if i had no bards in my party. Just the fact that stuff was there enriched the game for me, and also enriched the world. I mean didn't Lord of the Rings inspire this loot shit in RPGs? Did Frodo worry about suffixes when he picked up Sting?

Games for me are supposed to be experiences, not surrogates for gambling.

And then there's the added fact loot in FromSoft games are a vehilcle for story telling. Even if you don't use the item you still need it to figure out the plot.

 

[Lyric Suite]

Didn't want to jump in this debate which tilts more and more to retardation but what I can say is this - before you talk expansively about Nioh loot being exactly like Diablo you should at least play the game.

So which are the significant differences between loot in D3 and Nioh? Maybe I was sleeping when playing Nioh

I'm not saying both systems are totally different, they're clearly close, it's more about how both influence (taint) the gameplay. In Nioh you can craft, reforge, soul match, inherit effects etc. The result is the whole thing is way less grindy and the gameplay much more enjoyable, which is what we're talking about here.

In other words, diablo after a while starts to feel like brainless gambling machine but in Nioh the loot system doesn't interfere with the game being a proper, hardcore, rich action-RPG even after dozens of hours. That's why I said you have to PLAY the game first to understand the difference.

Loot system is one thing, Nioh as a game is another. Even if you argue the system integrates better in Nioh than it does in Diablo, when looked at in isolation it shares all the same issues. When i played the game i just used that option to vendor all the loot in bulk so i didn't even have to look at it. Best loot was Warrior of the West set and Odachi anyway. Why? It's all the revenants wore, and the revenants had the best loot. There wasn't even a carrot on that stick.

 

[Lyric Suite]

Well naturally, who wouldn't come up with dozens of builds for the light crossbow?

Yeah well, imagine light crossbow except now you have to grind and gamble to maximize minute percentages on its basic stats. And because of that, you don't have to deal with having to shove the light crossbow in the stash. You have to deal with millions of them, to be sifted through a myriad of other shit you don't need or want. That is the Diablo system for you.

 

[Haplo]

Didn't want to jump in this debate which tilts more and more to retardation but what I can say is this - before you talk expansively about Nioh loot being exactly like Diablo you should at least play the game.

So which are the significant differences between loot in D3 and Nioh? Maybe I was sleeping when playing Nioh

I'm not saying both systems are totally different, they're clearly close, it's more about how both influence (taint) the gameplay. In Nioh you can craft, reforge, soul match, inherit effects etc. The result is the whole thing is way less grindy and the gameplay much more enjoyable, which is what we're talking about here.

In other words, diablo after a while starts to feel like brainless gambling machine but in Nioh the loot system doesn't interfere with the game being a proper, hardcore, rich action-RPG even after dozens of hours. That's why I said you have to PLAY the game first to understand the difference.

Loot system is one thing, Nioh as a game is another. Even if you argue the system integrates better in Nioh than it does in Diablo, when looked at in isolation it shares all the same issues. When i played the game i just used that option to vendor all the loot in bulk so i didn't even have to look at it. Best loot was Warrior of the West set and Odachi anyway. Why? It's all the revenants wore, and the revenants had the best loot. There wasn't even a carrot on that stick.

You have a point. Revenants kind of break the system and were a mistake IMO - at least getting their gear. That said, you COULD avoid this trap by using a less popular weapon that is not FOTM / last released weapon.

Also Warrior of the West might be a great early game set that most people wear, but later the set bonuses are much more nuanced and tailored towards specific playstyles. So users of different weapons will often use migrate towards different sets.

 

[Stoned Ape]

DD2 has a lower number of enemy types than Elden Ring, but each type of enemy has more unique behaviour patterns and does interesting stuff. You can cause goblins to fight among each other by dodging their attacks so they hit each other, feed raw meat to wolves to make them lose agro, knock cyclopes down so they grab ledges and you can run over them like a bridge, you can climb on a griffin and have it fly you back to it's nest, all sorts of stuff. Each enemy type is far more engaging to encounter than any base mob in ER and they have far more character and charm. They're generally less challenging to beat unless you play like an idiot, and the encounter density is probably a bit on the high side, though.

None of that would matter to someone like Hell Swarm. He would argue that it's "lazy" that the game has so few enemies (some of which, from what i understand, were even brought back from the orignal game). But he doesn't, because his shtick is to shit on FromSoft because he thinks he is being counterculture.

I would also point out that while it's true that in ER all your interaction with the enemies revolves around combat (nature of the game), the design of the enemies themselves aren't exactly easy. The way enemies fight and move in a FromSoft game is considerably more elaborated than in a lot of other games. It would have been easy to just pad the number of bosses by saving time in coming up with complex attack patterns and elaborated animations. Have them swipe at the player with a couple of generic moves and you could have scores of "unique" enemies to fill up those caves and catacombs. The result of course is that people would have bitched all those "unique" bosses were stupid and simplistic, much like they usually are in most other games.

You can argue that this doesn't change the fact it's a bit underwhelming that sometimes you just get to fight the same boss multiple times, but it matters if the argument is that FromSoft has grown "lazy". You can't just focus on the number of bosses themselves, without taking into account the amount of time it must have gone to in designing them. The way each boss must not only be visually striking in a FromSoft game but also present a unique challenge to the player is a standard most other games don't even bother following, and even with that ER has much higher enemy variety than a lot of other games all of which have much more simplistic and basic designs for their creatures.

The majority of the enemy types are brought back from DD2, there are only a few completely new enemies. However, those 'old' enemies have new models, animations, and behaviour so it's not as if they were just recycled.

I agree, the focus of ER is fighting and exploration (which I personally enjoy), overcoming challenging boss battles alone, with online coop (not actually tried that myself TBH), or through NPCs summoned from golden signs. The focus of DD2 is going on adventures with a party of AI buddies who interact with each other. They are very different games with completely different design objectives.

The DD2 world is more simulated so a band of monsters might attack a merchant and his guards as you're travelling along an old footpath, if you save him you might get a reward. A griffin might swoop down to kill an oxen for food while you're wandering past, do you hope it doesn't notice you and try to run away or attack it in case it draws out more monsters from the area and they all dogpile you? While you're fighting a group of goblins an ogre might be disturbed and crash through the trees and grab your mage (ogres prefer to prey on women) then throw her off a cliff.

The world feels its alive and things are going on without your direct intervention. The challenge is generally dealing with unexpected stuff that another player might not encounter. Fast travel is limited and requires carrying items, weight limits are strict and it's much better to travel light so you might give your heavy tent and quick travel items to one of your party to carry, but if something happens to them you'll have to make it back to civilization without being able to easily escape or rest.

For example I was exploring a new section of a map with my party and crossed a rope bridge while fighting a group of bandits. I made it across with my warrior companion but my mage and archer were still on the bridge when the bandits cut the ropes and the bridge fell into a river, taking my ranged companions with it. I killed the bandits, but my mage was carrying the fast travel gear so I was pretty much stuck on the far side of a gorge as night was falling with no clear way back out, limited healing, and no clue where the nearest campsite was so I couldn't pass time to morning in an area with no real lighting which was filled with unknown enemies.

TL;DR I enjoy both games, but they have very little in common. The only duped boss that annoyed me in ER was Godefroy. Cloning a demigod just seems a bit stupid and broke my immersion.

 

[Lyric Suite]

For the record, this is not about ER versus DD2, Nioh or even Skyrim. I'm just pointing out there are things people hang on obstinately about ER that are given a pass in many other games without the slightest throught. There is always a danger when a company reaches a certain standard and then drops off from it for any reason, which is probably what is happening here in to a certain degree, but you cannot have double standards when making a direct comparison between their games and that of others. "Dark Souls set an higher standard so i'm going to use this metric to judge ER and another to judge those others games that never set that kind of high bar, therefore, ER is total shit and pales compared to those".

Even with the recycled bosses, ER still has an extremely high count in terms of enemy variety if compared to a majority of games out there. You can't just brush that off as if it didn't matter then call them "lazy" because the game isn't as curated as past Souls games used to be (on account of it being five times their size no less, as if that didn't matter either).

 

[Hell Swarm]

Lyrics having an autistic melt down today and still never responds to actual criticism and debates it. Just tries to character assassinate and shout "yea but what about X game!" as if he has any fucking clue about this genre when he admits he doesn't play games outside of From ones.

No, i'm not buying that argument. It's noticable only because you are comparing it to a game that exclipses Bethesda's slop to such a degree they don't even belong to same reality, namely, Dark Souls.

But in itself the dungeons in ER are infinitely more interesting than anything that as ever been in a Bethesda game since Shiblivion. Show me anything in Skyrim that was even remotely as clever as the Sainted Hero's Grave.

I don't like Bethesda games but I understand their side content can be NPC quest lines, loot, a puzzle dungeon, a combat dungeon, a single boss to fight or it could be an interesting underground town or whatever. I cannot think of a single Elden ring anything that isn't 'whack the enemy until it dies'. There's no puzzles beyond using gestures in the right place or a spell to reveal some lore. The catacombs you defend so religiously aren't puzzles, they're combat you have to run away from. Resident evil did puzzles better 20 years ago.

None of that would matter to someone like Hell Swarm. He would argue that it's "lazy" that the game has so few enemies (some of which, from what i understand, were even brought back from the orignal game). But he doesn't, because his shtick is to shit on FromSoft because he thinks he is being counterculture.

More character assassination I see. Really upset I'm willing to shit on a game series I love as it goes into deep decline and you can't handle it lol. Less enemies isn't a problem if you use those enemies in interesting ways. Elden ring goes "put 30 stone miners in a room, that'll get 'em!" or "Here's a soldier and a dog, they will never see that coming!" The combat system sucks for multiple enemies unless you have a big AOE to burst everything does, which are super common in ER. From design sucks for making multiple opponent fights and Elden ring never puts interesting enemies together because the system can't handle it and the player base will whine about Dark souls 2 again.

Elden ring DLC's most innovative and difficult trap is putting a dog behind a wall just enough you can't lock onto it until it jumps out of the boxes. There's no way to see the dog or lock onto the dog before it pounces you. Is this the same brilliance as Demon's souls and Dark souls? No, it is not. It's a badly designed and out of date lock on system being abused for a cheap ambush the player cannot reasonably prepare for or see coming. Frankly it's insulting to compare Nu From to Old From.

I would also point out that while it's true that in ER all your interaction with the enemies revolves around combat (nature of the game), the design of the enemies themselves aren't exactly easy. The way enemies fight and move in a FromSoft game is considerably more elaborated than in a lot of other games.

This is absolutely and undeniably false. Devil May cry 3 eclipses Elden ring in terms of enemy movement and options, if we get deeper into games like Bayonetta we're not on the same planet any more. Even Nier Automata which is an open world game with very few enemies (and a game I really enjoyed) finds ways to make those enemies do unique things or spam so many ranged attacks you're forced to play bullet hell for a few seconds. You don't even need complex enemies to make good and enjoyable combat. But From have the unique problem where their combat design was designed for roughly flat areas and 1 v 1ing mobs. And the biggest threat in Elden ring is rolling into a bumpy bit of terrain and getting smashed by a copy and pasted boss you already know how to beat. I played a few hours coop last night and the only deaths experienced were rolling into terrain and getting hit. You could say player error but the issue is how there is so little depth to the games.

When the video guy says Bosses don't explain things he's correct.

They don't have to, because the idea is that you have to figure out that shit on your own. Normies just want their dumbed down slop be honest.

From have never expected you to figure shit out on your own. If you went back and played Dark souls 1 you would notice many of the early mobs set you up for game mechanics early on. The game starts with a tutorial on plunging attacking Asylum demon and then the next obvious boss to run into has the exact same mechanic for it and it's barely used again in the game. There's so many tutorials in From games no different to Nintendo games. The difference is Nintendo don't copy and paste Sekiro content into boodborn... eh Dark so.. eh Elden ring and then expect the player to engage with it in a meaningful way and balance parts of the game around it. It is simply bad game design and you will never accept it because Souls games are an autistic obsession for you and you hate the genre except for these games because they're better made and less abusable.

Nioh is very different. You choose a weapon and abilities you'd like to focus on and have that weapon from the start and generally stick with it (although you can switch, if you want to), improving your mastery in it, learning its new abilities troughout the game.
And you find better versions of that weapon type troughout the game. Plus you get to choose from a plethora of pet spirits, which will enchance your combat abilities and offer extra powers (which are also tailored to specific playstyles and even weapons). Plus you gather equipment "sets", which bestow various powerful bonuses, some of which fit your playstyle well.

This is traditional loot systems in action RPGs. It's pretty standard for games to have loot systems where you find the same weapon but better. And Elden ring has the exact same thing where you can find many weapons which just upgrade from the previous one. A simple example of scaling on catalysts/talsimans/pyro gloves. And a lot of them are random enemy drops as well. 2% enemy drop rates sure as better than From do it right guys? Elden Ring uses a Diablo like loot system for the majority of it's gameplay.

For the record, this is not about ER versus DD2, Nioh or even Skyrim. I'm just pointing out there are things people hang on obstinately about ER that are given a pass in many other games without the slightest throught.

No, we're not giving those games a pass actually. I went to the DD thread and tried to get into it but I couldn't enjoy the combat or exploration. I shit on it worse than Elden ring. Right now I'm trying to get into Lords of the Fallen and I think it dumps way too many game mechanics on you with poor explanations. I also don't like when it takes from From and uses stuff worse. Vanguard was a cool way to end a tutorial. Being expected to die at the end of the tutorial is not cool or interesting when so many games have repeated it. In a genre about exploration and tough but fair challenges almost every single game in the last 5 years has forgotten major elements of what made the first 2 souls games work and replaced them with making the game faster or other genres mechanics that water the experience down (ER).

Now lyric has his post to ignore, I'll say I've been enjoying coop Elden ring but even in seemless coop the open world drags the game hard. In 4 hours of gameplay we went from the Academy to Atlus and then quit. The majority of that was running around to pick up loot for builds or having to go into identical mines to farm upgrade material. Having to ride 5 minutes to a mine, do a 5 minute dungeon to fight a crystaline and then do the same thing again shortly after but it was 2 of them was not quality game experience. It says a lot about these games where adding an extra player doesn't make the game more fun where it wouldn't be in other games. A dull game can be made more interesting with another player but there's nothing to enhance when you're both on Torrent running past 99% of the enemies in the game to do the same tunnel dungeon. It's just kind of sad and pathetic.

I do like throwing black flame pyromancies around though. It would have been nice to see them be something more unique though. It's such a big deal in the lore and yet it's fireball with a different shader or it's combustion with a different shader. If From want to do unique elemental types with the same style that's great but they should feel unique. Black flame could have used the spiral stuff or been like the homing fireballs in the DLC. Something that makes it unique except it applies a small poison effect after it hits.

 

[Multidirectional]

Did you get in Nioh to the item hunting part, when you look for specific things?

I never needed to farm for any equipment in Nioh 2 and I took 3 characters all the way up to highest difficulty by now. Started Underworld with my third, and probably final, character just yesterday. Did first 6 Underworld bosses with a bonus from only 1/4 Kodamas, because I like rushing to higher levels. And my equipment is far from perfectly optimized plus I ignore the damage stats for weapons as I've been switching them every NG cycle without doing a single respec along the way. Game works perfectly fine by just using shit that drops while progressing to higher levels, without having to stop and farm anywhere. I don't waste time on Revenants either, unless they have a Scroll. The only farming I ever attempted to do was trying to get a secret weapon skill drop for switchglaive, but gave up after close to 20 attempts. I will never be attempting that again as it's not like I actually need those secret skills to have fun. Pretty sure that people who whine about having to grind and minmax equipment are just autists doing it to themselves.

 

[abija]

No, we're not giving those games a pass actually. I went to the DD thread and tried to get into it but I couldn't enjoy the combat or exploration. I shit on it worse than Elden ring.

I am not surprised you shit on DD. It's the exact same asinine behavior you display here. Let me guess those devs were lazy too?

It's apparently too hard for you to accept that different devs focus on different aspects of their games and depending on scope it can end up in detriment to others. Instead of focusing on what a game does great, you focus on whatever random stuff you don't agree with or, even worse, comparing them with totally different games you happened to like.

 

[Hell Swarm]

No, we're not giving those games a pass actually. I went to the DD thread and tried to get into it but I couldn't enjoy the combat or exploration. I shit on it worse than Elden ring.

I am not surprised you shit on DD. It's the exact same asinine behavior you display here. Let me guess those devs were lazy too?

It's apparently too hard for you to accept that different devs focus on different aspects of their games and depending on scope it can end up in detriment to others. Instead of focusing on what a game does great, you focus on whatever random stuff you don't agree with or, even worse, comparing them with totally different games you happened to like.

I don't think Capcom were lazy with DD. I thought the game was annoying with it's constant NPC chatter on loop and I didn't find the combat or open world engaging. I wouldn't call them lazy because Capcom's action adventure titles aren't really lazy. Some of their stuff needs updating and fixing but that's not the same as reusing enemies the way From do.

Old From : The tutorial boss teaches you the plunging attack and you can later use this for a big advantage against Taurus demon. If you can get him to jump back and fall off the bridge your first real boss can kill themselves allowing the player to outsmart the AI in an interesting way. Environmental awareness is essential for novice players who need an advantage.

Nu From : The tutorial boss is a generic mob you will meet right outside the tutorial door a minutes ride up the road where you maybe fighting a mob of them plus big shield users supporting them. It teaches you nothing and has no purpose having a health bar. The reward for beating it is a gesture no one uses. Once you leave the tutorial you will run into a mid game boss (or is it post game now there's 2 in the DLC?) you're not expected to defeat yet and if you follow the guide marker you will run into THE LAST BOSS IN THE ORIGINAL DESIGN FOR THE GAME. He will do long combo strings with a lot of movement but there's invisible walls protecting him from falling off (but not you). If you try to heal at range he will throw 2 daggers at you immediately and he will hold his attacks wasting your time in a mechanic almost no other boss has. You're not expected to beat him yet and you can't outsmart him to get an easy kill. Then he will be reused in a mid game area later for absolutely no reason and get a phase 2 being the boss between mid game and end game.

If you can't see how one is an adventure game with high damage but high reward for smart play and the other is a horse beaten so bad even the glue has dried I don't know what to tell you.


Another video the From drones won't watch pointing out many of the same issues and going more in depth than I am willing to write myself. I give him credit I never even thought of knocking Margitt off because I wanted to beat him myself. But he raised the point and it's an excellent example of what From lost since Dark souls 2.

 

[Vic]

bro your post on page #755 of this thread doesn't fit on one screen, touch some grass

 

[Hell Swarm]

bro your post on page #755 of this thread doesn't fit on one screen, touch some grass

Run out of Starfield copy and paste content to do Vic? Maybe go back to telling everyone in Shoutbox how you want to have sex with your younger self because you're such a loser 'now'.

Mimic tear breaking because it doesn't know how to handle enemies under Eternal sleep. Seems From told it not to attack enemies put to sleep and it freaks out because it's AI is all about spamming.

 

[Lyric Suite]

^ That's how you know people are retarded. If the mimic wakes up the bear how is the player supposed to get a critical hit?

Sleep is not intended to kill the bears anyway, so the AI is working correctly in terms of the lore. In the original game, sleep is supposed to be used on the bears as a way for you to just leave them there and move on. The game tells you to do this by virtue of having so many of them laying around sleeping already, and there's usually no reason to kill most of them, as they drop nothing and can take forever to go down.

They actually hammer this point very early on when the trap in Patches chest sends you straight to a whole group of bears, at a point in the game where the player isn't powerful enough to handle a single of one of them let alone a whole group. Clearly, the idea is that you are to avoid them.

Lastly, sleep againsts the bears actually requires care. If you hit them again while the sleep animation is happening, you'll actually wake them up. The idea is that you put them to sleep once, with care if possible, and then move on. Chaining sleep of them is actually tricky to do unless you learn to count how many hits you require for each stage of their resistance going up. As soon as you hear the noise, you need to stop hitting them. This is not the case with other enemies.

 

[Lyric Suite]

Watched half of his Margit rant.

Skill issue. The footage he shows doesn't even corroborate his point. He says Margit doesn't stop moving and he had no chance to hit him and had to wait forever for the endless combos to finish. Meanwhile in the footage he gets an opportunity to hit him after every sequence.

[EDIT] I had to go fish out my old ass fight with him, where are those endless combos that never stop again?



He is also weak to, wouldn't you know, parry lol:



HE NEVER STOPS MOVING BRO SHIT DESIGN

Meanwhile you get a chance to hit him after every short string of attacks he does.