From Software Elden Ring - From Software's new game with writing by GRRM

[Hell Swarm]

This doesn't just apply to weapons and ashes. Why would anyone ever use the light spell or the torch when you can literally get a lantern within 1-2 hours of typical gameplay? FROM added 3 separate torch items, and all of them are completely useless.

I will defend the torches but it's very niche.

Sentinel torch reveals invisible enemies so it's good for 1 boss and getting into the haligtree. It's really useful exactly once.
Beast repelling torch does what it says on the tin and I found it useful once in the DLC to scare off wolves because I was looking for a pick up there and couldn't be bothered to fight or rush past.

But you're right the latern is just better.

 

[Odoryuk]

There's nothing more frustrating than completing a dungeon, only to be rewarded with a mostly useless summon.

You get to know about the enemy you can summon a little more, sometimes it's the only way to learn a specific enemy's name, and that's enough. The same principle when you're finding a spell while playing a Quality build - you won't use it, but it has information about the world that you will learn

 

[Hell Swarm]

There's nothing more frustrating than completing a dungeon, only to be rewarded with a mostly useless summon.

You get to know about the enemy you can summon a little more, sometimes it's the only way to learn a specific enemy's name, and that's enough. The same principle when you're finding a spell while playing a Quality build - you won't use it, but it has information about the world that you will learn

Please tell me this is a joke. Is a fucking NAME now a dungeon reward?

 

[Lyric Suite]

Lyric, you've made it abundantly obvious that you like the game.

It's less that i like the game and more that i absolute despise bad arguments. It's like my bane. If Hell Swarm was arguing like this about a game i hate, like say anything by Bethesda, i'd be up there defending that too.

 

[Odoryuk]

Is a fucking NAME now a dungeon reward?

A NAME and a DESCRIPTION

 

[Hell Swarm]

Is a fucking NAME now a dungeon reward?

A NAME and a DESCRIPTION

What kind of an autistic LOSER looks at a companion summon and goes "Gee, I'm sure glad that's useless but now I know it's got Shitsnaffer the tomb wizard and it likes to finger it's arsehole"? Seriously..

Lyric, you've made it abundantly obvious that you like the game.

It's less that i like the game and more that i absolute despise bad arguments. It's like my bane. If Hell Swarm was arguing like this about a game i hate, like say anything by Bethesda, i'd be up there defending that too.

You literally do nothing but make bad arguments Lyric. You never have an argument, you never have a point. You shit up the thread and never engage with a single discussion honestly. You just want to argue to defend From games because your ego is tied to breaking them. I've done multiple play throughs while you autistically find ways to break bosses because you're not good enough to do it properly. Then you bitch at YOUR SUPERIORS because they can judge the game fairly while you can't.

 

[Lyric Suite]

I've paid a lot more closer attention to enviormental story telling because of the little let's play i'm doing and i was surprised at how coherent it actually is once you pay attention to it. If i ever get to replay the base game i'd have to play closer attention of what you find and where. I see a lot of those "useless" drops were probably put there just for lore purposes. Whether that's seen as "worthless" is relative. There are games where finding out more about the story IS the reward you are looking for.

 

[abija]

There's no point collecting all the grave wax when we're only going to be using the Mimic Tear and 1-2 other summons for the whole game.

Just because you did that, doesn't mean everyone did that. It's a pretty big distinction.

What kind of an autistic LOSER looks at a companion summon and goes "Gee, I'm sure glad that's useless but now I know it's got Shitsnaffer the tomb wizard and it likes to finger it's arsehole"? Seriously.

If you can't accept descriptions in From games have value, why are you even playing them?

 

[HeatEXTEND]

This has always been the case, if you're playing without a shield you're playing on optional hard mode.

Here we go again; Bullshit except for late-game shields, before that 2-handing a DPS/stun weapon or powerstancing and destroying bosses is much easier than "playing fair". Lategame shields do feel like ez mode but before that it's just complicating the stamina management game for.....absolutely no reason, you could be destroying those bosses. DPS/Poisebreakers are ez mode, proper knights are hard-mode, for 80% of the game.
And with the new Sekiro tear (completely bonkers OP, but fun )....yeah.

 

[Lyric Suite]

You literally do nothing but make bad arguments Lyric. You never have an argument, you never have a point. You shit up the thread and never engage with a single discussion honestly.

Now he is moved onto accusing others of what he is doing.

 

[abija]

Make false claims, seethe that others have fun the wrong way, try to bully, play victim, accuse others of what you just did, rinse and repeat.

 

[HeatEXTEND]

I never said no spirit ashes. They're very clearly intended in Elden Ring.

Everyone can play the game however the fuck they want, it's a singleplayer game, but using ashes vs not using them are pretty much two different games, their use intended or not.

 

[Odoryuk]

What kind of an autistic LOSER looks at a companion summon and goes "Gee, I'm sure glad that's useless

Weren't you the one who stated that only losers need summons, the ones that are useful?..

 

[Lyric Suite]

Ashes could have been more interesting if their use was more varied. There are some that do have passive or latent benefit to the player that goes beyond their combat usefulness, but even those most of the time get involved into the combat, which is what "ruins" bosses because it changes the dynamic completely, presumably in your favor, often against you (boss movesets are tuned for a single target the second their attention moves between you and the summon and back to you it results into a complete mess at times).

In the open world, i found ashes to be quite ok. They can help you clear the boring stuff faster which isn't bad. If you weren't spending the FP on ashes you'd be spending it on spells to clear out hordes of mooks so what difference is there (builds that don't use spells might get even more milage out of this). Whenever i'm farming i always use ashes because why wouldn't you. If you count spells and weapon arts, ashes in themselves aren't really that problematic it's only against bosses that they become a problem because of how they can confuse the AI.

Outside of the niche uses i just mentioned, i never used them because of course i want to do everything "fair and square" but i don't mind the attempt at trying something "new", even if it could have been done better.

Elden Ring actually sort of shares something with Dark Souls 2 in how both games tried to do a lot of new things, but sometimes it felt they didn't think everything through. So on one hand you have the added novelty factor, on the other you can't help scratch your head and wonder what they were thinking.

BTW, speaking of Dark Souls 2 and things "intended" by the developers, i'm reminded how everybody absolutely hated those extra areas in each of the DLCs (Frigid Outskirts in particular) that were CLEARLY intended for co-op but everybody did them solo anyway (and then bitched about them endlessly). Sure, maybe forced co-op shouldn't be a thing in those games, but still, they wanted to do something, why not do it their way? I did all those areas solo myself but i didn't complaint since i knew what i was getting into. Those areas is what gave me the idea the double and tripple bosses in Elden Ring were sort of intended to be fought with spirit ashes. I did them all solo, but the way people complained about them (to the point FromSoft felt compelled to nerf the AI, a HUGE mistake in my opinion). If you found them so irritating, why not do it the intended way?

 

[Hell Swarm]

If you can't accept descriptions in From games have value, why are you even playing them?

you play games for the item descriptions? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH! What a fucking loser.

 

[Odoryuk]

you play games for the item descriptions? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH! What a fucking loser.

The text information you get from equipment and other things is important for getting the right vibes. If you totally ignore the narrative and aesthetic work that FromSoftware does in their games, then you are, my dear Hell Swarm, a fool!

 

[Hell Swarm]

The deep lore of post-it notes and absolutely no story as to why you have to murder every creature in the world. A tale truly worthy of toilet paper.

 

[Silverfish]

And he's too fucking stupid to even see the second half of a single line of text so claims there is no point.

He just didn't see it yet. I've noticed an occasional tick he has where he'll respond to a single post over multiple of his own. Just wait a day or so and you'll get a response to the second half.

Don't ever use triangle. 2 handing your weapon is cheating.

You guys use weapons? For shame.

What I find funniest is that Lyric responds to a post making literal points with a reason for why they ruin the game and aren't legit.

Summons don't "ruin" the game. If you don't use them, their existence won't affect you in any way whatsoever.

Having trouble keeping track?

There's that great Arti video of a stone armoured fat roller walking up to arti and hitting him over and over when he was one of the hardest bosses ever. It's not even a close fight, he can't touch the guy doing it.

Even a lot of challenge runners go full Havel's for the Four Kings. DS1 poise is God-tier.

That's not what you are arguing, don't try to change the goalpost now. The argument is literally that rolling is a bad game mechanic. Except it isn't.

How can I change the goalpost when this is my first post in relation to stamina / rolling / i-frames? I never argued that these are bad mechanics, just that they're better suited for shorter games like Demon's and Dark 1 due to their simplicity.

Aside for this being something you pulled out of your ass again (can't be stretched for hundred of hours? Says who?)

Not can't. Shouldn't.

one of your main complaint about Elden Ring is that you are given a myriad of options to trivalize content.

You're confusing me with Hell Swarm again. My stance from the get-go, and in fact even in response to the video you posted that HS found lacking, is that you should use everything at your disposal and that melting bosses with overpowered builds is what constitutes getting good. My souls philosophy, summarized (timestamped at 22:50):

You guys are trying so hard to find things to complaint about in Elden Ring that you have now moved onto denigrating everything FromSoft has ever done

"You guys." I've brought up previous entries of the series as a positive comparison to ER. You're fucking struggling to keep up. Hate to see it.

 

[Hell Swarm]

Zanzibart... forgive me

I ask you forgive me, dearest Nanaya

Which is the DEEP lore of a souls game and which is a joke?

 

[Odoryuk]

Zanzibart... forgive me

I ask you forgive me, dearest Nanaya

Which is the DEEP lore of a souls game and which is a joke?

Zanzibart was a pretty lame joke coined by a person who wrote for Borderlands.

Midra asked Nanaya to forgive him, because he was enduring the Frenzied Flame for a long time, because she asked (or cursed him) to, and in that fight he finally gives in and lets it finally overtake him as a person.

If you don't see difference in the vibes, then, frankly, I'm not surprised you've been complaining about FromSoftware over so many pages now

 

[Hell Swarm]

Vibes is not an argument. The borderlands writer was dead on the nose and you can't see it. Throw in 2 post it notes and a single line of dialog and vatti, ziostorm and zulli the witch will make 10 videos on it each. It's fucking retarded. The abyss woods was empty and boring, reusing content so also lazy. Then you go into a pretty bland dungeon reusing assets and enemies from another part of the DLC and.. well that's basically it. Phase 1 of the boss was cool, phase 2 was another spam fest as most the DLC is.

Wooooooo spooky yellow eyed rats and bloodborne enemies! In a completely empty woods. Peak vibes.

 

[Odoryuk]

The borderlands writer was dead on the nose and you can't see it.

His whole argument was that the writing is so obtuse to the point that there's nothing in there, just random words, which is not true.

Throw in 2 post it notes and a single line of dialog and vatti, ziostorm and zulli the witch will make 10 videos on it each. It's fucking retarded.

It works and you don't need Vaati to get anything, the whole story is buried within Midra's mansion and it's one of my most favorite locations in ER.

Vibes is not an argument.

In entertainment, vibes is all that matters

 

[Hell Swarm]

His whole argument was that the writing is so obtuse to the point that there's nothing in there, just random words, which is not true.

His argument was that there was no point putting effort into writing good dialog any more because a post-it note (nanaya's torch) and a single line of dialog is enough to make 7 hour essays on youtube. And he's completely correct. From did exactly what he said they did and I can find multiple discussions on Nanaya who isn't a character and what we read may as well be random words.

In entertainment, vibes is all that matters

You're a drug addict or a child. Wait til you discover lava lamps and electronic music. You will never touch another souls game again.

Sunsets are also great vibe creators if you don't want to spend 80 hours going to an empty level.

If you want to play a game that's actually creepy and all built on 'vibe'. I recommend trying No players online. It does what From failed miserably at with the woods. It lacks item descriptions, so it may not be for you though.

 

[Strange Fellow]

People are finally starting to figure out that a bit of mystery is far preferable to an endless exhausting barrage of "lore".

 

[Odoryuk]

His argument was that there was no point putting effort into writing good dialog any more because a post-it note (nanaya's torch) and a single line of dialog is enough to make 7 hour essays on youtube. And he's completely correct. From did exactly what he said they did and I can find multiple discussions on Nanaya who isn't a character and what we read may as well be random words.

Well, then it kinda goes in favor to FromSoftware to make things such compelling that people enjoy so much to discuss it endlessly, huh? Maybe that Borderlands person wasn't even attacking FS, but admiring their efficiency?

People are starting to figure out that a bit of mystery is preferable to an endless exhausting barrage of "lore". Shocker.

That is something that many developers that try to repeat FromSoftware's vibes and fail: they write too much text. Too many names, too many descriptions. They also try to mitigate their low budgets and cram everything into text, while FS provides the vibes with not only text, but visuals and sounds. Midra's cutscene is very strong and without it I doubt people would care about this odd couple that much