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Help me wade through the mountains of crap RPGs to meet my snobbish and very particular criteria

hal900x

Augur
Joined
Jul 2, 2009
Messages
573
Location
A good place to own a gun.
My favorite games are RPGs with small party sizes and turn based combat. That means Fallout 1/2, Underrail and AoD are my all-time tops. I am looking for something I haven't played with the following very particular features:

- An RPG, not one of the trillion RPG recommendations on Steam that turns about to be yet another Strategy game.
- True turn based combat, not RTwP. It was hard to even type it, so much do I hate the latter. Not a huge fan of "simultaneous" TB engines such as Balrum either. There are a few full-party exceptions I enjoyed such as ToEE but yeah.
- Very small party size or else party members controlled by AI, scripted or otherwise. Ideally only a single character
- Isometric or top-down, ideally. I enjoyed the MM and Wizardry series but very few do that type well. Excepting Cleve, ofc
- Good combat, and lots of it. I have hundreds of hours into Underrail. Blah blah blah Planescape Torment best game evar blah. No, no it isn't. Shit combat = shit game.

Have I played them all, all 5 or 6 of them? Seems this type of game is extremely rare. Numenera was underwhelming, although the setting was fantastic.
 

Fowyr

Arcane
Vatnik
Joined
Mar 29, 2009
Messages
7,671
Disciples of Steel and Aethra Chronicles.
P.S.: Damn, I should never permit scripts on the Codex. I gave you two random ratings when just tried to make window active. :M
 

YES!

Hi, I'm Roqua
Dumbfuck
Joined
Feb 26, 2017
Messages
2,088
My favorite games are RPGs with small party sizes and turn based combat. That means Fallout 1/2, Underrail and AoD are my all-time tops. I am looking for something I haven't played with the following very particular features:

- An RPG, not one of the trillion RPG recommendations on Steam that turns about to be yet another Strategy game.
- True turn based combat, not RTwP. It was hard to even type it, so much do I hate the latter. Not a huge fan of "simultaneous" TB engines such as Balrum either. There are a few full-party exceptions I enjoyed such as ToEE but yeah.
- Very small party size or else party members controlled by AI, scripted or otherwise. Ideally only a single character
- Isometric or top-down, ideally. I enjoyed the MM and Wizardry series but very few do that type well. Excepting Cleve, ofc
- Good combat, and lots of it. I have hundreds of hours into Underrail. Blah blah blah Planescape Torment best game evar blah. No, no it isn't. Shit combat = shit game.

Have I played them all, all 5 or 6 of them? Seems this type of game is extremely rare. Numenera was underwhelming, although the setting was fantastic.

I'm assuming you played Arcanum (in TB mode, which has just as bad combat as FO 1 and 2) so that leaves the following-
- F0 1.5 - very good, high production value. Consider it the real but more indie FO3
- WL2 DC, 4 party character creation, can have 2 recruited companions. Best party based crpg since ToEE. Hands down, only pederasts would not see it this way.
- Expedition Vikings - it is a good crpg with some strategy elements. But scratches the itch. The combat is decent, chardev is decent+, it is worth the money and playing
- RoE BoD remake with all the DLC - awesome. Only for people with sophisticated crpg tastes. Not for sophomores or usual fake rpg loving philistines. Also Star Trail is in EA.
- MMX if you haven't played that (you mentioned MM and Wiz but figured I'd throw it out there).
- The Shadowrun games are okay. I really enjoyed the mmo version called Boston Lockdown - I think it has better combat and better chardev and better itemization.
- Blackguards 1 is a great crpg but isn't 100% traditional. It isn't a strategy game either. It has town maps like Wiz&Warriors instead of real towns. Blackguards 2 is a dumbed down version for idiots who whined about the first one being to much game for them to handle and developers were dumb enough to listen to them. It has great combat and great chardev and your small party is all recruited.
- Dungeon Rats since you didn't list it
- T:ToN - fits you like a glove. I am with you with everything you said for the most part, and I I am the one who started the shit combat = shit game. That is me and has always been me. I dislike PST as a game because of the combat and other shitty game features of the IE engine, but TToN is a great crpg with better than average TB combat and chardev and even itemization. You are dumb if you don't give it a try. Don't listen to the real rpg haters on this site. They like children's games more than real rpgs or even rpg lite games. Real children games like pokeman and shit. They also love Asian rpg-lite games more than anything else besides Asian children games. Don't listen to these philistines.
- Knights of the Chalice - people compare it to ToEE because they are dumb. It is like more like a Spiderweb game with better combat. It is chargen lite and chardev lite, but is based on D&D 3.5 OGL. Well worth the money.
- I'm guessing you know about the Avernum remakes and the new series from Spiderweb, Avadon. The Avadon games are similar to the games you liked but in a liter way. I liked the first but didn't care for the second and the third was okay.

Great games that are not tier ones or perfect fits-
-Sword & Sorcery - FP Blobber in the veins of later Wizs and earlier MMs. TB combat, unlike the later MMs
-Waste Walkers - A good crpg with survival elements in a PA setting. Create one recruit the rest. Weirdish chardev and the game goes for a combat system making combat you are supposed to want to avoid. Rpgmaker so people hate it for that
-Last Dream - Surprisingly awesome cprg made with rpgmaker. It is good and worth the almost nothing it costs.
-Lords of Xiluma - Just look at the steam page. Non-traditional crpg with all the traditional elements. Good game, even better with mods that change the combat system in my opinion.
-Antharion - pure traditional crpg of yore. Good. Worth the few bucks it costs. If it came out on the Amiga when Magic Candle did it would have been OMG THIS IS THE BEST GAME EVER. Now, no one even looks at it.
-Heroes of Steel - on tracks linear but for some reason it keeps you wanting to play. I think it is because it has a challenge and most rpgs don't.

RtwP
I fucking hate it. Hating it has been my thing since the beginning. But there is one good RTwP game ever made and no one will play it even though they love RTwP. Probably because the combat isn't click and watch monkey shit for retards and requires thinking. This game is a linear srpg on reels with no chargen all premade characters like a jrpg but has decent chargen and itemization. This game is Aarklash Legacy. It is and will probably always be the only good RTwP game ever made with good combat.

That's all I can think of. I'm sure I left some out.
 

YES!

Hi, I'm Roqua
Dumbfuck
Joined
Feb 26, 2017
Messages
2,088
Well, I see people are recommending games from the 90s. I thought you meant recent and already knew about all the good old ones.
 

Black Angel

Arcane
Joined
Jun 23, 2016
Messages
2,910
Location
Wonderland
- True turn based combat, not RTwP. It was hard to even type it, so much do I hate the latter. Not a huge fan of "simultaneous" TB engines such as Balrum either. There are a few full-party exceptions I enjoyed such as ToEE but yeah.
I've heard bad things about Balrum, but you should still give simultaneous TB like ToME (Tales of Maj'Eyal) a chance anyway.
 

Alkarl

Learned
Joined
Oct 9, 2016
Messages
472
Dark Sun: Shattered Lands, Voidspire Tactics

I second the Dark Sun nomination. 4 member party, 2d iso, TB combat, d&d mechanics. Almost like a precursor to Fallout, these games have some themes in common. Pretty good if you can learn the interface and look past/enjoy the graphics. Also, bdsm Half-Giants. :lol:
 

hellbent

Augur
Joined
Aug 17, 2008
Messages
322
Since most everytihing has been covered already:

If you can deal with strategy/RPG mashups, consider Battle Brothers, Legends of Eisenwald, and Expeditions: Conquistador. Combat is TB in all of them and there are some good RPG elements as well.

Also, StarCrawlers is a nice FP blobber I'm playing lately, if you want to try a SciFi setting.
 

Deuce Traveler

2012 Newfag
Patron
Joined
May 11, 2012
Messages
2,902
Location
Okinawa, Japan
Grab the Codex by the pussy Divinity: Original Sin Torment: Tides of Numenera Shadorwun: Hong Kong Pathfinder: Kingmaker Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag. Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture
Geneforge series definitely and maybe Space Rangers 2.

The Geneforge series is exactly the game I was thinking of when I read the original post, especially the first game of the series. It is turn-based, isometric with plenty of combat and different character builds that allow you to overcome challenges in a number of different ways. As a shaper, you can play through the game with just your one character, though if you get lonely you can create some bestial companions that follow you and can grow in strength and experience. And the storyline of the first game is awesome. Second one is also not too bad. The fifth and final game is a wonderful conclusion to the series.

Space Rangers 2 is good, but I don't believe it fits into his other criteria.
 
Self-Ejected

IncendiaryDevice

Self-Ejected
Village Idiot
Joined
Nov 3, 2014
Messages
7,407
My favorite games are RPGs with small party sizes and turn based combat. That means Fallout 1/2, Underrail and AoD are my all-time tops. I am looking for something I haven't played with the following very particular features:

- An RPG, not one of the trillion RPG recommendations on Steam that turns about to be yet another Strategy game.
- True turn based combat, not RTwP. It was hard to even type it, so much do I hate the latter. Not a huge fan of "simultaneous" TB engines such as Balrum either. There are a few full-party exceptions I enjoyed such as ToEE but yeah.
- Very small party size or else party members controlled by AI, scripted or otherwise. Ideally only a single character
- Isometric or top-down, ideally. I enjoyed the MM and Wizardry series but very few do that type well. Excepting Cleve, ofc
- Good combat, and lots of it. I have hundreds of hours into Underrail. Blah blah blah Planescape Torment best game evar blah. No, no it isn't. Shit combat = shit game.

Have I played them all, all 5 or 6 of them? Seems this type of game is extremely rare. Numenera was underwhelming, although the setting was fantastic.

First of all, if you've managed to find 5 or 6 games which you consider to be similar and exact to a very specific taste then you've already done extremely well. No 2 RPGs are ever really the same, even among sequels most of the time. One of my first RPGs was Icewind Dale, for example, so, naturally, I went searching for more of the same, but, no, there aren't any games like Icewind Dale. As in, if you listed all the exact details of what makes IWD then no other game would match those elements. Even IWD2 was a different D&D ruleset.

What I did? Tried my best to learn to like different kinds of RPGs, enjoy the spice of variety as much as the comfort of the familiar. It sounds a bit trite, but the more you narrow down the specifics the less likely you are to ever find an exact match.

For example, small party size, turn based combat, isometric'ish, lots of good combat, are all very commendable and common features of a lot of RPGs, could list loads.

however,

Saying lots of good combat but nothing strategy? I don't know what you mean here, you'd have to give some examples. Some people think any game with good turn-based combat and lots of it is basically a strategy game. For me a strategy game involves actively producing units via buildings you yourself have built and the object of the game is to paint the map your colour. In these cases such games rarely refer to themselves as RPGs.

Being allergic to RTwP is just a shame, it excludes lots of combat focused games. I honestly don't understand what causes this in people, especially when the combat is still based on turn-based rules, but, meh, if you're allergic then you're allergic, nothing anyone can do about that. It's just a shame you're missing out on some really nice combat focused RPGs with a lot to offer.

When you then state a preference for AI controlled party along-side a single character controlled by yourself then, whoa, to me this is decline. This is the real kicker in looking for matching games. Suddenly the long list of options has shrunk dramatically. Most games that do this are the RTwP ones, or, more commonly even that that, the real-time ones. The idea of single character and turn-based is one of the more absurd RPG concepts and if you're having a party then most people would much prefer full party control in any fully turn-based system.

Fallout 1/2 aren't really reknown for their lots of good combat and neither is AoD. Underrail is though. But if combat was your priority then you wouldn't be so afraid of strategy elements and if you like party based RPGs with lots of good combat then why even specify a preference for single character, these concepts together all seem somewhat absurd'ish.

I could make lots of recommendations based on certain elements of what you ask, but these little things remove any confidence I have of actually naming anything without a greater understanding of where you're coming from.
 
Self-Ejected

IncendiaryDevice

Self-Ejected
Village Idiot
Joined
Nov 3, 2014
Messages
7,407
Geneforge series definitely and maybe Space Rangers 2.

The Geneforge series is exactly the game I was thinking of when I read the original post, especially the first game of the series. It is turn-based, isometric with plenty of combat and different character builds that allow you to overcome challenges in a number of different ways. As a shaper, you can play through the game with just your one character, though if you get lonely you can create some bestial companions that follow you and can grow in strength and experience. And the storyline of the first game is awesome. Second one is also not too bad. The fifth and final game is a wonderful conclusion to the series.

I wouldn't really call Geneforge good combat. There was lots of it, but it was hardly ever set-piece battles and mostly a frustrating grind of stop-start. The Shaper is the one that is likely to build the monsters (party members), I think it was playing as an Agent that was supposed to be the one where you would likely be able to go without party members (monsters). I don't think the monsters are controlled by the AI, unless there's a toggle for that.

But, yeah, Geneforge is a game that matches a lot of the criteria. Not really sure it's what the guy wants tho.
 
Self-Ejected

Drog Black Tooth

Self-Ejected
Joined
Feb 20, 2008
Messages
2,636
LOL @ asking for games with good TB combat and listing FO1/2 as good examples of such

Fallout's combat was p much hey dudes let's stand in a circle, everyone do a roll and awesome criticals happen! Stuff explodes in a gory mess! WOW. Be sure to reload if you don't like the outcome, because it's different almost every fuckin' time.

But yeah OP, FO1/2 are good games, but not for their combat. If you want to pass as a TB RPG connoisseur, then might as well have some higher standards.
 

YES!

Hi, I'm Roqua
Dumbfuck
Joined
Feb 26, 2017
Messages
2,088
I really enjoyed the mmo version called Boston Lockdown
Vomits

No idea how anyone can stand writing of this shit

By playing the game? If you can't have fun with a great game because you require specific writing criteria you are getting what you want from the wrong medium.
 

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