Morrowind was massive decline and should be considered as such

[Desiderius]

Has anyone played ESO?

 

[Grampy_Bone]

"I liked Morrowind more than Daggerfall" is a code for "I haven't been exposed to RPGs until 1999". No exceptions.

I'm betting most of the people here shitting on Daggerfall never made it out of the first cave, if they even played it at all.

 

[Tye]

All I could think about once Limmy was brought up.

 

[Wayward Son]

Skills:Orcish,Harpy,Deadric,Medecine,swimming,climbing,critical strike,Backstab,Centaurian,streetwise,SprigganThaumaturgy,Nymph,Orcish,Dragonish,dodging, Giantish,etiquette,Impish. A total of 19 skills removed in Morrowind

Of which 11 were the completely useless language skills I literally only take when I run out of skills I wanted to take, one isn’t needed anymore, and 2 got combined into speechcraft. It would’ve been cool if they had kept the language skills and made them work properly, but as others have said, they focused on other things instead.

NPC: No longer sleep, no longer answer you if they accept you in their houses. You can no longer ask for work.

NPCs in Daggerfall didn’t sleep, the answering was just flavour text, and the reason they no longer offer you work is because of the lack of radiant quest systems in morrowind, because every quest was handmade by the devs.

Factions: 18 factions removed from Daggerfall, Temple factions gone, Knightly orders gone. Factions can no longer dismiss you and factions can no longer refuse you if you have a bad reputation.Faction reputation

I actually agree with this one, although morrowind did have temple factions and it could be argued that the Great Houses and Imperial Legion factions replaced the mostly samey Knights’ Orders.

Dungeons: hidden doors, traps, complexity.

Agreed

Wereboar

non-sequitur bit of flavor

Music that changes considering the mood

Uhhh what? The music 100% changes in Morrowind based on what’s going on, primarily outdoors ambient music, dungeon music and combat music

Court: debate or lie

Agreed

Character creation, edit reputations, deep background, you can no longer edit advantages and disadvantages.

agreed, character creation isn’t as good in morrowind

 

[Master of Aviz]

Has anyone played ESO?

Yes. I wish I hadn't.

 

[HarveyBirdman]

Morrowind is decline in vision, incline in execution.

 

[RNGsus]

xbox killed this game

Morrowind was made by rubbing two manlets together.

 

[Desiderius]

Has anyone played ESO?

how did you like it Rus?

I played original demo and it was like worse than the inside of an Oblivion gate, but I understand that it has improved since then.

 

[Desiderius]

Morrowind is decline in vision, incline in execution.

Citizen Kane clap

 

[rusty_shackleford]

Has anyone played ESO?

how did you like it Rus?

I played original demo and it was like worse than the inside of an Oblivion gate, but I understand that it has improved since then.

it's ok if you like TES lore. My main issue was that the quests/solo content is too easy.
https://rpgcodex.net/forums/index.php?threads/the-elder-scrolls-online-gone-b2p.71846/

 

[Ranarama]

I don't understand why people care about the debate system. It was a dice roll. A single dice roll. You're all crying about it like it was some really deep system. It wasn't.

As for speech skills in Morrowind, (not languages, speech and personality). It frequently matters. The game reduces to quicksave and reload mostly, but it is there and often provides a pacifist way of solving quests. It's not perfect, mainly because you just reload until success. I'd prefer if it was either a straight check if you have enough skill (although frequently that sucks as a system) or provided a scaled discount on a fixed bribe. So you could spend 10k on a single bribe if you treated it as a dump stat.

I'm surprised there isn't more discussion on Battlespire in this thread. You want dungeons right?

 

[rusty_shackleford]

he game reduces to quicksave and reload mostly

 

[luj1]

Morrowind is decline in vision, incline in execution.

Actually it's the opposite. It's a miracle Morrowind works at all.

 

[anvi]

I liked trying to solo the world bosses in ESO, and some of the dungeons were fun to do alone. Fiddling with builds was fun for a while, the combat system is weird but I think most people don't understand that you can use 2 hotbars. Combat isn't great but it is a hell of a lot better than Skyrim. Group dungeons were below par but not too bad. My main issue with the game is that there is no long term goal. You reach end game in a month or so and then there are a small number of dungeons to do which don't take too long. The raid content is TERRIBLE. Really bad end game. If that was better I might actually play it.

 

[Desiderius]

Has anyone played ESO?

how did you like it Rus?

I played original demo and it was like worse than the inside of an Oblivion gate, but I understand that it has improved since then.

it's ok if you like TES lore. My main issue was that the quests/solo content is too easy.
https://rpgcodex.net/forums/index.php?threads/the-elder-scrolls-online-gone-b2p.71846/

Same thing happened to LotRO. I got Dreadlocked five minutes in when I played the original, now it's hard to die if you try.

 

[HarveyBirdman]

Morrowind is decline in vision, incline in execution.

Actually it's the opposite. It's a miracle Morrowind works at all.

>Morrowind had a grander vision than Daggerfall
>Daggerfall was a better realization of its purpose than Morrowind
Do you see how wrong that sounds?

 

[Curious_Tongue]

This castle looks impressive.

There's no such place in Vanilla Morrowind.

 

[Master of Aviz]

Bethesda has been removing features from one game to another, everyone knows that. But this pattern doesn't apply to the transition from Daggerfall to Morrowind. This downsizing has been largely offset by an increase in the overall quality and depthness of the game.

 

[Scarlet Lilith]

"Skyrim is decline compared to Oblivion"
"Oblivion is decline compared to Morrowind"
"Morrowind is decline compared to Daggerfall"

"Daggerfall is decline compared to Arena" when?

Now!

• It featured the entirety of Tamriel
• Single plane dungeons were labyrinthine enough without going antfarm
• Arguably less broken system
• Less bugs
• It didn't needlessly go bananas with the simulationist stuff
• More straightforward plot

All TES games up until Oblivion had something going for them, which one is the best is simply a matter of taste. Like I loved Battlespire, but I get that it's not for everyone. When it comes to Arena and Daggerfall then Arena is the clear winner for me.

 

[Lemming42]

Arena is really underrated, even though it's completely busted.

STEP 1: Go to Mages Guild
STEP 2: Make a cheap spell of Shield and Spell Reflection
STEP 3: Walk through the entire game completely invulnerable to all damage, laugh as all spellcasting enemies obliterate themselves against your reflective shield

 

[ADL]

Most things it got rid of weren't missed, and made the whole experience more focused and better for it.

It's a shame that they continued streamlining things too much for the latter entries in TES, but Morrowind had a great balance of everything, and only the annoying combat let it down really.

As someone that loves Daggerfall to death, the only thing I really miss from Daggerfall is a grander sense of scale and emergent gameplay systems. Perhaps it was far too big but it was nice being able to actually get lost in the wilderness. Lefay's Morrowind (with the actual mainland) was going to be condensed significantly to around 500 sq miles which would've been reasonable compared to Daggerfall's 50,000 and TESIII's 5.

 

[Scarlet Lilith]

Arena is really underrated, even though it's completely busted.

STEP 1: Go to Mages Guild
STEP 2: Make a cheap spell of Shield and Spell Reflection
STEP 3: Walk through the entire game completely invulnerable to all damage, laugh as all spellcasting enemies obliterate themselves against your reflective shield

I'd take that any day over being restricted to X damage of type Y or some mild effect if you're lucky. The spells got less cool with each successive game but you could always break the game if you wanted to, even in Skyrim and you couldn't even create your own spells in it!

 

[Casual Hero]

Most things it got rid of weren't missed, .

I disagree, I miss the deep character creation system,I miss the complexity of dungeons(but a bit tuned down), I miss horse,carriage with said horse, I miss the politic climax, I miss the debate system, I miss so many things from Daggerfall. Daggerfall needed to be improve instead of throwing everything it tried to achieve.

Dude, just play modded Daggerfall Unity.

 

[RNGsus]

Most things it got rid of weren't missed, .

I disagree, I miss the deep character creation system,(but a bit tuned down)

Yeah.

I miss the debate system

Phenomenal stuff.

Daggerfall needed to be improve instead of throwing everything it tried to achieve.

Sounds like you watched a video.

miss horse,carriage with said horse,

oh jesus christ

I miss the politic climax

the what

I miss the complexity of dungeons

Yeah, who doesn't miss gigantic dungeons?

 

[Lyric Suite]

Bethesda has been removing features from one game to another, everyone knows that. But this pattern doesn't apply to the transition from Daggerfall to Morrowind. This downsizing has been largely offset by an increase in the overall quality and depthness of the game.

More like it was caused by Morrowind being actually designed instead of being randomized nothingness.

I prefer Daggerfall because of the bigger dungeons and atmosphere but i don't get how people can complain that Morrowind was smaller in scope when Daggerfall produced areas thought an algorithm. Of course it was gigantic. For all that matters they could have made it ten times bigger than it was, or a hundred times.