Things can be worth reading for reasons other than amazing writing. They can provide lore, context for other moments that are more focused on, explanations about events/quests, etc. I can't think of any videogame or even film where every line was some standout thing. You need to be okay with "fine" writing between the more important bits, or you'll never finish anything.
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Obsidian General Discussion Thread
- Thread starter Duraframe300
- Start date
Things can be worth reading for reasons other than amazing writing. They can provide lore, context for other moments that are more focused on, explanations about events/quests, etc. I can't think of any videogame or even film where every line was some standout thing. You need to be okay with "fine" writing between the more important bits, or you'll never finish anything.
The Law of Conservation of Detail.
Concerning the lore for both PoEs, Sawyer & Co often sound like a 13 yo fanfic-writers that provide page upon pages of text to give the most detailed description ever of the clothes their Mary Sue wears.
Way beyond the line between solid world building and a boring crap.
EDIT: just check out what Deadfire welcomes people with:
And his portrait is right here, next to the description!
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The Outer Worlds has rather breezy dialogue for the most part. For example, you don't really understand the full backstory of Monarch (how Sanjar and Graham took over in the aftermath of the Amber Heights massacre) before you've dealt with both factions and done their quests, even though both faction heads know the story and either one of them could have theoretically told you everything the moment you met them. Or in another example, it's not entirely clear what happened in Roseway (the outlaw raid) until you make it to the secret lab. I thought that felt like a concerted effort from Obsidian to avoid "loredumps" and it's another thing in that game that deserves some respect.
So IMO the stereotype of Obsidian as the loredump company (and as I've said before most of this stuff isn't even "lore", it's an overall excess of writing of all types) is now incorrect.
So IMO the stereotype of Obsidian as the loredump company (and as I've said before most of this stuff isn't even "lore", it's an overall excess of writing of all types) is now incorrect.
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I think what happened with the writing this time around (which is more concise as you said) is similar to what happened to Deadfire: Full voice acting. More properly scoped this time, it likely led Obsidian to be more frugal in their writing and more reliant on environmental storytelling. I didn't find the world-building engaging myself (having played Disco Elysium just before), but certainly on the whole it was inoffensive.
Maybe they weeded most of the excessive crap out of dialogues because of voice acting, but all computers and journals in TOW not only sound like broken record but their sheer amount and length is staggering. Do not know why I read them all, because it became quite obvious quite early that every second terminal in the game contains just one more story about "horrible abuse and tragedy due to evil incompetence from yet one another evil corporation" that should evoke some feelies in my heart or make me feel good on the moral high ground for despising them.
I hate when someone trying to manipulate my feelies by telling dozens of similar stories about poor innocent people abandoned in hostile environment by their employers, being secretly experimented upon or just good old "They took her mom to another planet and she never seen her again. That makes her (daughter) such a sweet, likable character!".
I hate when someone trying to manipulate my feelies by telling dozens of similar stories about poor innocent people abandoned in hostile environment by their employers, being secretly experimented upon or just good old "They took her mom to another planet and she never seen her again. That makes her (daughter) such a sweet, likable character!".
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I think Josh is a good or decent-to-good writer. His writing in Fallout: New Vegas was brilliant and one of my all time favourites. Lore in Eternity wasn't that good, I'd say it was okay for a fantasy game. His problem is more with systems design. Combat in PoE was abysmal and it seems it was largely his responsibility. In PoE 2, turn-based combat was very enjoyable, but it wasn't done by Sawyer.
Actually, to me PoE 2 never felt like a chore - the feeling I had with the first game. I forced myself to finish PoE, but with PoE 2, I even enjoyed the last part of the game which wasn't the best the game had to offer.
Actually, to me PoE 2 never felt like a chore - the feeling I had with the first game. I forced myself to finish PoE, but with PoE 2, I even enjoyed the last part of the game which wasn't the best the game had to offer.
My point has literally zero to do with PoE, so not sure what this response is about. This is the general Obsidian thread, and I'm responding to the general concept in the tweet that "sometimes serviceable is fine." I generally agree, as long as the "sometimes" is the more mundane text between important text. I don't think writers responsible for thousands of lines should obsess over every one being as good as it can be. That path leads to madness.
vortex
Fabulous Optimist
Thanks. I didn't know that. I hardly read anything else on social media.
Wunderbar
Arcane
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you really shouldn't play games designed by chris avellone - if you didn't know, he's a bigoted shitlord who objectifies women."It's fine."
You really shouldn't use this guy's comics - if you didn't know, this was drawn by a schizophrenic pedophile.
EDIT: Oh, I forgot - he's also into rape fantasies.
https://kiwifarms.net/threads/chris-avellone-grieving-mother-history-with-durance-how-dare-he-rape-fantasy-boycott.17552/
rusty_shackleford
Arcane
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I have no issue with Starks
rusty_shackleford
Arcane
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"It's fine."
You really shouldn't use this guy's comics - if you didn't know, this was drawn by a schizophrenic pedophile.
EDIT: Oh, I forgot - he's also a diaperfur.
https://kiwifarms.net/threads/shmor...he-puppy-ex-fiance-amanda-mandy-mullen.23467/
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It's an amusing couple of panels, who cares if the artist is a loser (most web comic people are).
She is an only Lead Narrative Designer among the trio. So responsible by proxy for everything her minions write.
Yeah, I stand corrected. Stark is an only Senior Writer, when Patel & Dollarhide are Narrative Designers. All three credited as "Narrative Designer" among the TOWs creators with Boyarsky being lead (he is the man to blame).Starks' never been lead(?), she was referred to as senior narrative designer for TOW. Patel was co-lead of Deadfire and Dollarhyde was lead of a cancelled project and/or she is the lead/co-lead of Sawya's new project
I just remembered meeting Max in the game and thinking - wow, decent companion, maybe nu-wave Obsidian's of writers is not so hopeless... Only to stumble upon info that Vicar was like only companion written by Boyarsky himself. I could be wrong here too, I was not able to find the source again.
...I hope Dollarhyde is not a lead writer for a Sawyer's projects. I am afraid his sanity could not take another Deadfire-level hit so soon.
What the fuck does that have to do with the gunshow webcomic? This shmorky guy supposedly worked on an animated version of the comic, he is NOT the creator of the webcomic, the only thing that people care about or ever link to, which is made by KC Green."It's fine."
You really shouldn't use this guy's comics - if you didn't know, this was drawn by a schizophrenic pedophile.
EDIT: Oh, I forgot - he's also a diaperfur.
https://kiwifarms.net/threads/shmor...he-puppy-ex-fiance-amanda-mandy-mullen.23467/
Before you start going around saying that something was made a pedophile maybe you should consider getting your facts straight you fucking dumb faggot.
Stop harassing her you shitlord!
fantadomat
Arcane
agentorange send nudes lol
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Starks wasn't lead in title, but she had the responsibilites of one https://rpgcodex.net/forums/index.p...-leonard-boyarsky.130421/page-74#post-6379339
Additionally, companion writing breakdown https://rpgcodex.net/forums/index.p...-leonard-boyarsky.130421/page-44#post-6377172
Edit: more recent, thorough post where she outright states she was the team lead https://rpgcodex.net/forums/index.p...leonard-boyarsky.130421/page-219#post-6508965
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Thank you! It is so nice to have a person around who is serous about fact-collecting.
I remembered Starks appearing a lot in TOW promotional materials so my logic jumped straight to a leading role in the project.
RepHope
Savant
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SAM? She wrote fucking SAM the most useless party member since T3-M4? Jesus.
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Hey fuck you. T3 is one of the best companions in both KOTOR games.
Sailor Woedica
Cipher
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Disco Elysium is going to be the most influential rpg of the 2020s.
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