Pathfinder Pathfinder: Kingmaker Builds and Strats Thread

[Chippy]

Currently playing NWN and took the time to create a Druid/Shifter/Monk. It's so overpowered it's actually a bit fun. So was wondering if they've patched the rules since then to prevent the unarmed bonuses from the monk class applying to shifted forms?.

Um this is a Pathfinder thread bro

Yahhh, but me was wondering if da same fink does apply in dis game as much as well. 'Cause me like hitting finks.

 

[Yosharian]

Currently playing NWN and took the time to create a Druid/Shifter/Monk. It's so overpowered it's actually a bit fun. So was wondering if they've patched the rules since then to prevent the unarmed bonuses from the monk class applying to shifted forms?.

Um this is a Pathfinder thread bro

Yahhh, but me was wondering if da same fink does apply in dis game as much as well. 'Cause me like hitting finks.

Oh right.

So Pathfinder pretty much gutted Shifter/Monks. You can still benefit from the AC bonus in Wildshape, but Wildshape itself scales very poorly and you cannot benefit from Flurry of Blows in any way since Unarmed Strike and Natural Attacks are treated separately.

Of course you can still do it, with mods it would be better and there are some ways you can optimise for it, but you will never be the powerhouse that you were in 3.5E.

Desiderius would probably advise you to make a Feyspeaker, ask him about it

 

[Chippy]

Currently playing NWN and took the time to create a Druid/Shifter/Monk. It's so overpowered it's actually a bit fun. So was wondering if they've patched the rules since then to prevent the unarmed bonuses from the monk class applying to shifted forms?.

Um this is a Pathfinder thread bro

Yahhh, but me was wondering if da same fink does apply in dis game as much as well. 'Cause me like hitting finks.

Oh right.

So Pathfinder pretty much gutted Shifter/Monks. You can still benefit from the AC bonus in Wildshape, but Wildshape itself scales very poorly and you cannot benefit from Flurry of Blows in any way since Unarmed Strike and Natural Attacks are treated separately.

Of course you can still do it, with mods it would be better and there are some ways you can optimise for it, but you will never be the powerhouse that you were in 3.5E.

Desiderius would probably advise you to make a Feyspeaker, ask him about it

Thanks, but I'd rather not. Life being too short and all that.

 

[Desiderius]

Wrath as in many other cases has exactly what you're looking for.

New Elemental Shifter Druid class.

Yeah Flurry plus Natural was a CotW (P:K mod) thing and took an extra feat. They kind of work at cross purposes since Flurry is ultimately about iteratives and Natural Attax in most cases you get up front.

If you want a gorillion attax just turn into Smilodon or Dragon.

 

[Stavrophore]

Prestigious pathfinder autists. What's the best way to prevent undead from fucking my levels and draining stats? I know about death ward as prevention and restoration and greater restoration for removing the drain and negative levels. Anything else? Am i hopelessly fucked against undead?

 

[Wulfric Pinewood]

Just turn an enemy difficulty down and be happy.

 

[Stavrophore]

Spectres go through my defences 30-50% of time. I fucking hate it. Really no other tricks than death ward/restoration?

 

[mediocrepoet]

Spectres go through my defences 30-50% of time. I fucking hate it. Really no other tricks than death ward/restoration?

Have you heard about death ward?

Seriously though, DW is a hard counter to it and it's fairly easy to manage who the enemies are targeting or to cover most/all of your party with DW.
You can use CC to lock them down.
You can buff/debuff to avoid being hit.
You can use Jaethal and summons to eat the level drains and have it do nothing.
You can also use the hospitaler paladin who gets immunity to death magic effects at level 11.
Failing all that, time to bust out the restoration line of spells.

 

[Stavrophore]

Ive never used priests for buying scrolls, but i see they sell death ward scrolls and just for 175 gold[actually its 700, pathfinder wiki shows prices for lowest difficulty]. Since im already in vordekai tomb i think i will not need them again. Missed opportunity.

 

[Desiderius]

Wrath as in many other cases has exactly what you're looking for.

New Elemental Shifter Druid class.

Yeah Flurry plus Natural was a CotW (P:K mod) thing and took an extra feat. They kind of work at cross purposes since Flurry is ultimately about iteratives and Natural Attax in most cases you get up front.

If you want a gorillion attax just turn into Smilodon or Dragon.

I tried to get some shots of this thing but you don’t get your bloodline thingie until level four and the retrainer isn’t working. I’ll get one up to level 4 for you tonight and show some pics.

That’s how far I’m willing to go for you guys.

 

[Yosharian]

Prestigious pathfinder autists. What's the best way to prevent undead from fucking my levels and draining stats? I know about death ward as prevention and restoration and greater restoration for removing the drain and negative levels. Anything else? Am i hopelessly fucked against undead?

There is an item you can buy using Better Vendors, some boots that prevent your ability scores from being drained. Swamp dweller's boots

Otherwise use Death Ward, why are you fucked if you have that available?

 

[Desiderius]

Prestigious pathfinder autists. What's the best way to prevent undead from fucking my levels and draining stats? I know about death ward as prevention and restoration and greater restoration for removing the drain and negative levels. Anything else? Am i hopelessly fucked against undead?

Soul Eaters aren't Undead. Spectres target Touch AC which is what made everyone shit their pants and destroy their builds trying to get Touch AC up when game came out. Easier just to keep Death Ward up and/or follow Poet's advice.

 

[Desiderius]

Alright Gentlemen here's your Shifter at level 4:



That's with Seelah going Skald to give extra Bite on top of Motherless Tiefling. Kind of dumb I think because I'd rather be Wild Shaping but viable. If you Wild Shape to Wolf you get the Skald Bite (everyone does) but lose the two Claws the Druid starts with and the Motherless Bite.



This is how you start. Three attax from the beginning pretty solid.



You can see the Claws here. It says you gain a Claw attack but it's currently just implemented as the usual Two Claws that go away if you use a Weapon or Wild Shape. Would be better if it added a Primary Claw attack.

Rampage is purty good. You lose Poison Immunity and +4 Saves vs Fae and also... your Pet, but things get crowded there so no huge loss.



The Elemental Stuff is solid. You get increasing amounts, a basic enhancement at 11, then an AoE effect at 20, along with some Resists and Immunity at 20.

I chose Acid because Sickened is a good effect. There are some effects in Wrath that give you a big payoff for having extra packets of damage, and some others for apply different types.



This doesn't look so hot but you do get two spells to get an extra +6 CMB (they fell off when I Wild Shaped here, so would have to wait until next level for Natural Spell) so your Trips will land a lot which gives the whole team extra attax. Fighting Wildshaped turns on various items and Mythics and means you can go a different direction from Motherless. Probably want to end up Smilo anyway?



Can go off with Lore (Nature). Evidently has some uses now on World Map preventing Fatigue?



Can get WIS to Intimidate via Background that also gives you Persuasion and Lore (Religion) as Class Skill.

 

[Yosharian]

Wow the Wrath UI is looking slick

 

[Stavrophore]

I might do another playthrough of this game but i need to know how to make this game shorter. So far i come with this
-play in real time mode obviously
-a mod to remove random trash encounters, leave only encounters that are relevant to quests/plot
-a mod that allows casting restoration in capital to heal drain from party members, instead of going outside the city
-instant rest mod, no small talk, no trash encounter when you rest
-better UI so i don't have to click 'info' everytime[i will probably memorize most shit for next playthrough though]
-are there mods to make companion ai behavior more configurable? Like if target >30AC, cast such spell, if reflex < 10 cast this spell, that could store this in memory, so whenever you rearrange spells it wouldn't need to be set again. Possibly with export to file option.
-faster companion movement in locations and on the world map/parchment
-disabling kingdom management while getting benefits of trader shops you would normally had to build
-faster loading mod, even with SSD
-mod that allow completely custom team from the beginning
-mod that allow to disable shared experience, yet level up plot companions to still be competent advisors

This would leave this game as a good, focused, mostly combatfag experience with your own prefered team/builds, with up to 50% of time sheared right off, that you could replay many times.

 

[LannTheStupid]

I might do another playthrough of this game but i need to know how to make this game shorter.

1. Play the rogue-like mode.
2. Uninstall the game and forget about it.

 

[NJClaw]

-a mod that allows casting restoration in capital to heal drain from party members, instead of going outside the city

You can cast Restoration with your own character, you don't need to go anywhere.

-faster companion movement in locations and on the world map/parchment

You can install Cheat Engine and use two keybinds to switch between "travel" and "combat" speeds.

-mod that allow completely custom team from the beginning

That's already in the game. You just need to win the encounter with the bandits at the outpost without leveling up, so that you can recruit mercenaries at a very low price. Otherwise, you can use the Bag of Tricks mod to increase your gold and buy mercenaries regardless of your level.

-mod that allow to disable shared experience, yet level up plot companions to still be competent advisors

Disabling shared experience only does something if you play with less than 6 characters. If you play with a full party, your experience gets divided by 6 and the idle companions just gain free exp.

 

[Stavrophore]

Disabling shared experience only does something if you play with less than 6 characters. If you play with a full party, your experience gets divided by 6 and the idle companions just gain free exp.

Thanks, the information i found was claiming otherwise.

 

[Bloodeyes]

Lematte, the greatest character I ever made, is dead. He was level 8. Ganked by a couple manticores in a random encounter. He was a last Aslanti mode character so he's gone for good. Meanwhile my party of halflings have survived to level 13 exploring the tenebrous depths in Beneath the Stolen Lands DLC. Only death so far was Ethyl and we picked her right back up thanks to our stack of raise dead scrolls.

Spoiler

My first halfling PCs in any RPG. After a while you forget they are halflings and only think of them as heroes.

 

[gurugeorge]

I might do another playthrough of this game but i need to know how to make this game shorter. So far i come with this
-play in real time mode obviously
-a mod to remove random trash encounters, leave only encounters that are relevant to quests/plot
-a mod that allows casting restoration in capital to heal drain from party members, instead of going outside the city
-instant rest mod, no small talk, no trash encounter when you rest
-better UI so i don't have to click 'info' everytime[i will probably memorize most shit for next playthrough though]
-are there mods to make companion ai behavior more configurable? Like if target >30AC, cast such spell, if reflex < 10 cast this spell, that could store this in memory, so whenever you rearrange spells it wouldn't need to be set again. Possibly with export to file option.
-faster companion movement in locations and on the world map/parchment
-disabling kingdom management while getting benefits of trader shops you would normally had to build
-faster loading mod, even with SSD
-mod that allow completely custom team from the beginning
-mod that allow to disable shared experience, yet level up plot companions to still be competent advisors

This would leave this game as a good, focused, mostly combatfag experience with your own prefered team/builds, with up to 50% of time sheared right off, that you could replay many times.

Further to NJClaw's advice, Bag of Tricks also does instant rest. (It also has lots of other neat things you can do, like making the game spinney-rotatey and adding deeper zoom - great if you're using a better flanking mod - having several chances at lockpicking at the cost of some fatigue, being able to fiddle with stats, feats, etc.)

 

[NJClaw]

Lematte, the greatest character I ever made, is dead. He was level 8. Ganked by a couple manticores in a random encounter. He was a last Aslanti mode character so he's gone for good. Meanwhile my party of halflings have survived to level 13 exploring the tenebrous depths in Beneath the Stolen Lands DLC. Only death so far was Ethyl and we picked her right back up thanks to our stack of raise dead scrolls.

Spoiler

My first halfling PCs in any RPG. After a while you forget they are halflings and only think of them as heroes.

I think I'm in love with your halfling party. Please, keep us updated on their adventures. The halfling druid with a lizard is beautiful, but I can't wait to make a party of halflings with a mounted paladin in Wrath of the Righteous. Owlcat Games, if you're reading this, LET ME RIDE A GIANT TURKEY.

Your party seems well-rounded, but you know that you can recruit more mercenaries and play with 6 characters, right?

 

[Bloodeyes]

Lematte, the greatest character I ever made, is dead. He was level 8. Ganked by a couple manticores in a random encounter. He was a last Aslanti mode character so he's gone for good. Meanwhile my party of halflings have survived to level 13 exploring the tenebrous depths in Beneath the Stolen Lands DLC. Only death so far was Ethyl and we picked her right back up thanks to our stack of raise dead scrolls.

Spoiler

My first halfling PCs in any RPG. After a while you forget they are halflings and only think of them as heroes.

I think I'm in love with your halfling party. Please, keep us updated on their adventures. The halfling druid with a lizard is beautiful, but I can't wait to make a party of halflings with a mounted paladin in Wrath of the Righteous. Owlcat Games, if you're reading this, LET ME RIDE A GIANT TURKEY.

Your party seems well-rounded, but you know that you can recruit more mercenaries and play with 6 characters, right?

Yeah I know. I've got only active characters getting XP though so recruiting more isn't likely to happen. Yeah the portrait for Heather is stunning. I love all the artwork for these characters and I like that I can get pretty close to it with the character creator.

I'll try to remember and grab some screens of them in action. They're Last Azlanti, challenging difficulty which is a step up for me so their story may not have a happy ending, but I love their portraits so much I'll probably just remake them if they die TBH. I don't tend to do that but they're brilliant. Their voices fit them well too, it's a shame I can't convey that in screens. Drogo - grumpy and Scottish, Ethyl - carefree, Bradley - Confident, Heather - Cunning. If you know your character voices you'll be able to imagine that.

 

[Desiderius]

Lematte, the greatest character I ever made, is dead. He was level 8. Ganked by a couple manticores in a random encounter. He was a last Aslanti mode character so he's gone for good. Meanwhile my party of halflings have survived to level 13 exploring the tenebrous depths in Beneath the Stolen Lands DLC. Only death so far was Ethyl and we picked her right back up thanks to our stack of raise dead scrolls.

Spoiler

My first halfling PCs in any RPG. After a while you forget they are halflings and only think of them as heroes.

I think I'm in love with your halfling party. Please, keep us updated on their adventures. The halfling druid with a lizard is beautiful, but I can't wait to make a party of halflings with a mounted paladin in Wrath of the Righteous. Owlcat Games, if you're reading this, LET ME RIDE A GIANT TURKEY.

Your party seems well-rounded, but you know that you can recruit more mercenaries and play with 6 characters, right?

Yeah I know. I've got only active characters getting XP though so recruiting more isn't likely to happen. Yeah the portrait for Heather is stunning. I love all the artwork for these characters and I like that I can get pretty close to it with the character creator.

I'll try to remember and grab some screens of them in action. They're Last Azlanti, challenging difficulty which is a step up for me so their story may not have a happy ending, but I love their portraits so much I'll probably just remake them if they die TBH. I don't tend to do that but they're brilliant. Their voices fit them well too, it's a shame I can't convey that in screens. Drogo - grumpy and Scottish, Ethyl - carefree, Bradley - Confident, Heather - Cunning. If you know your character voices you'll be able to imagine that.

Depths is designed to kill your party periodically then give you boons for the respawn like a rogue-like.

 

[_V_]

So I've fired Kingmaker up again. To see how far I can get in the endless dungeon. But also experimenting with builds for the MC in Wrath. Currently playing with CotW, but I assume most/all feats will eventually be available in Wrath (via mods). I'll be wating till all DLCs are out + 1 to two months for them to iron out the most grievous bugs, anyway.

I know it's frowned upon but I will go with Vivi (16) + X. The buffs + sneak attack are just too good. The concept would be to let pets close in and take the beating while I bravely destroy the enemies from the second row with reach and combat reflexes.

I'd like some input.

1: I haven't followed Wrath. Anything I should be aware of for levelling? (Epic Destinies superceeding normal character progression? Levels higher than 20? etc?)

2: I tried vivi (16) +
a) Sword Saint (4), Rapier, dex focus, fencing grace: Great AC, soso damage, soso speed, few attacks, bad Will saves. Good crits but no blinding critical possible. Reduced amount of skill points.
b) Fighter (4), Fauchard, strength focus: Good AC, great damage, bad speed, good attacks, attrocious Will saves. Blinding Criticals. Great reach. Reduced amount of skill points.
c) Traditional Monk (4), Quarterstaff, strength focus: Bad AC, great damage, great speed, great attacks, okish Will saves. Blinding Criticals (possible). Better amount of skill points and more class skills. Evasion. (And of course, the Fauchard would possible here too. But then I'd be losing the extra attack...)

3) I'm tending towards the monk. I've always wanted to play a quarterstaff user, but so far my inner minmaxer has prevented this. But here you get an extra attack and the additional strength bonus for two handed weapon. And monks are cool. While he doesn't have reach, this is easily remedied with buffs. The bad AC isn't so bad, since the pets will be attrackting the attacks (hopefully). And some quarterstaff or monk robe might be tailored to offset this bad AC.

4) Improved Criit can be gained via "keen" or a spell (at least in CotW) and they don't stack. With a quarterstaff I'll definately not be critting a lot. Are there any more sensible investments, if I don't follow the crit line? (Shatter defenses will be on other characters)

5) I know it has been asked before, but I don't remember the answer: Is there any alternative to Fencing Grace that could be used with kamas, estoc or elven curved blade? At the moment I don't see a path towards using dex or int (or wis) as damage modifiers without having to switch to single style rapier and/or sacrificing attacks. Duelist looks meh...IMHO

6) In the past itemisation has alwaysy favored two weapon or sword and board fighting over two-handed/single handed, IMHO. Have there been any indications that Owlcat see that similarly and intend to keep that in mind while developing Wrath? :D

 

[Desiderius]

So I've fired Kingmaker up again. To see how far I can get in the endless dungeon. But also experimenting with builds for the MC in Wrath. Currently playing with CotW, but I assume most/all feats will eventually be available in Wrath (via mods). I'll be wating till all DLCs are out + 1 to two months for them to iron out the most grievous bugs, anyway.

I know it's frowned upon but I will go with Vivi (16) + X. The buffs + sneak attack are just too good. The concept would be to let pets close in and take the beating while I bravely destroy the enemies from the second row with reach and combat reflexes.

Vivi 16 is (mostly) great. It's Vivi 1, especially on ranged, that sucks balls.

This is Vivi17/Barb2:



I like Double Weapons for STR-based Vivis. Try that and get back to us. Monks should be able to use QStaves as a Double Weapon but that isn't in-game yet. Wrath does have a QStaff Master that it sounds like you will enjoy.

Not a fan of Blinding Crit. Shit you crit should already be dead and you even have to beat a save.