Pathfinder Pathfinder: Wrath of the Righteous - Game of the Year Edition

[Humanophage]

You sprinkle skeletons and other stuff all over the place, whilst the melee fighters fight mounted from afar in safety.

Sounds like a pain in the ass in TB, tbh, having to watch a billion summons take that one ineffective swing each Turn.

They don't last long enough for there to be a billion summons. It's usually the same 10 skeletons getting destroyed with a single attack and resummoned every turn. Their swing also has a short animation and it's great that it's only one swing rather than many. And it's good that they miss because they don't break slumber. I wish they had a lower initiative so they'd just stand where they are summoned instead of acting. That said, it's still fairly humane compared to other turn-based games with multiple opponents and no in-built animation speed slider, like nu-X-Com. As for other summons like the tankard summon or the mythic class summon, they are too powerful for major fights to avoid using them.

I tried a couple of harder fights on Unfair (e.g., cyberdemons), and the main problem with skeletons is that their AI is so bad they run away from the closest target only to die to an AoO. I wish there was a way to just make them attack the closest thing.

 

[Desiderius]

I don't like the term "tanks" regarding Pathfinder companions. I do, however, like the term "frontliner". A frontliner is a party member who can be attacked by enemies in melee and lose, say, no more than 1/4 of total health per fight. Camellia is a good frontliner.

A good general principle but depends on context. Having an actual tank to draw aggro may be required for Unfair depending on party comp and/or can be useful (especially on Hard and below but ultimately doable on Unfair) vs bosses.

With a lot of AoE AC (Skald with Guarded Stance/Animal Totem, Reg with Aura of Morale AC + Inspiring Command Insight AC) any frontliner can avoid attax from regular mobs even on Unfair (later on those can just be controlled), but you may not want to build your party that way which is where a tank comes in handy.

TSS1 Seelah functioned well to draw attention Charging to start fights on Unfair.

 

[ga♥]

I don't know why so many people fail at Camelia melee and end up making her ranged or a subpar caster/hexxer, same story over and over.
She has already the highest AC in act 1 in my party.

 

[Roguey]

Spirit hunters have average BAB and spirit enchantment isn't enough to make up for that.

The Mythic Carnivorous Crystal is one ridiculous troll of an optional fight. Opens with a large aoe that will instakill anyone who fails the save and has over 1000 HP, but a single casting of wracking ray followed by one polar ray will take it out in one round.

 

[Desiderius]

Spirit hunters have average BAB and spirit enchantment isn't enough to make up for that.

The Mythic Carnivorous Crystal is one ridiculous troll of an optional fight. Opens with a large aoe that will instakill anyone who fails the save and has over 1000 HP, but a single casting of wracking ray followed by one polar ray will take it out in one round.

It’s a STR-based archetype but that doesn’t really bite her until later.

Weapon enchanting + Bane Weapon + Hampering Hex (Battle Spirit exclusive to lower foe AC by 4 for team even on made save with no immunity) makes her a force to be reckoned with at lvl 8. Just make sure to use Reduce Person and Fencing Grace and she’s gold at lvl 8 when she gets Bane + second attack + Hex kicks up from 2 to 4. She gets Ghost Touch at lvl 1.

Then at lvl 9 Divine Power hits +3/+3. She gets it at lvl 7 for extra attack and +2/+2.

Basically people don’t know how to use one minute buffs because they’re resting like P:K. Spiking is a big part of Wrath success and she spikes hard.

 

[Haplo]

Spirit hunters have average BAB and spirit enchantment isn't enough to make up for that.

The Mythic Carnivorous Crystal is one ridiculous troll of an optional fight. Opens with a large aoe that will instakill anyone who fails the save and has over 1000 HP, but a single casting of wracking ray followed by one polar ray will take it out in one round.

It’s a STR-based archetype but that doesn’t really bite her until later.

Weapon enchanting + Bane Weapon + Hampering Hex (Battle Spirit exclusive to lower foe AC by 4 for team even on made save with no immunity) makes her a force to be reckoned with at lvl 8. Just make sure to use Reduce Person and Fencing Grace and she’s gold at lvl 8 when she gets Bane + second attack + Hex kicks up from 2 to 4. She gets Ghost Touch at lvl 1.

Then at lvl 9 Divine Power hits +3/+3. She gets it at lvl 7 for extra attack and +2/+2.

Basically people don’t know how to use one minute buffs because they’re resting like P:K. Spiking is a big part of Wrath success and she spikes hard.

I definately prefer her as ranged Vital Striker nowadays. Goes well with a Rowdy dip - and even better if you respec her to a Shadow Shaman. Later Loremaster will let her pick GVS.
Still has Move action to Chant.


Btw., Vek added Split Hex and Bewitching Reflex in TTT. Yay, witches are back on the menu!

 

[ArchAngel]

Spirit hunters have average BAB and spirit enchantment isn't enough to make up for that.

The Mythic Carnivorous Crystal is one ridiculous troll of an optional fight. Opens with a large aoe that will instakill anyone who fails the save and has over 1000 HP, but a single casting of wracking ray followed by one polar ray will take it out in one round.

It’s a STR-based archetype but that doesn’t really bite her until later.

Weapon enchanting + Bane Weapon + Hampering Hex (Battle Spirit exclusive to lower foe AC by 4 for team even on made save with no immunity) makes her a force to be reckoned with at lvl 8. Just make sure to use Reduce Person and Fencing Grace and she’s gold at lvl 8 when she gets Bane + second attack + Hex kicks up from 2 to 4. She gets Ghost Touch at lvl 1.

Then at lvl 9 Divine Power hits +3/+3. She gets it at lvl 7 for extra attack and +2/+2.

Basically people don’t know how to use one minute buffs because they’re resting like P:K. Spiking is a big part of Wrath success and she spikes hard.

Also she has good crit and activates Outflank often. When you give her that medium armor that gives +4 damage when using outflank she does even better. I usually get Extend spell with her and put Divine Power in lvl 5 slots as well and then use sorcerous reflex to have that cast as swift at start of each battle.
And she can grab Animal Spirit and get animal companion at lvl 16 which lets her move and do full attack.

 

[AshenNedra]

Hi, asking for a little help there. I suck at theory crafting and would like to try a shifter build ; I like the class thematically .

I found a demon mythic path based on Aspect of Kalavakus and trip feats onYoutube but I don't like the demon path

Would something work with Azata or trickster mythic class or would I gimp myself ?

Many thanks in advance

 

[Average Manatee]

You won't have the trip synergy so you probably want to change that around a bit. Haven't played it but Shifter looks like you kind of can't screw it up as a straight to level 20 melee class as long as you take either the base class or Feyform and pick up some of the obvious good abilities. Just take the shapes that boost your stats and attacks/damage to sky high levels and take the generically good feats that most melee classes are taking. Or just find a build someone's made that doesn't take demon.

 

[Haplo]

Hi, asking for a little help there. I suck at theory crafting and would like to try a shifter build ; I like the class thematically .

I found a demon mythic path based on Aspect of Kalavakus and trip feats onYoutube but I don't like the demon path

Would something work with Azata or trickster mythic class or would I gimp myself ?

Many thanks in advance

Well, Azata isn't a very strong path for martials, but it can still work. Trickster is okay, its crits are strong, but for a shifter - a pretty feat-starved class already - the 3 feats to spend on the critical hit improvements of vanilla Trickster are kind of a big deal.
Lich would work very well IMO. Aeon would be fine also.

 

[AshenNedra]

Hi, asking for a little help there. I suck at theory crafting and would like to try a shifter build ; I like the class thematically .

I found a demon mythic path based on Aspect of Kalavakus and trip feats onYoutube but I don't like the demon path

Would something work with Azata or trickster mythic class or would I gimp myself ?

Many thanks in advance

Well, Azata isn't a very strong path for martials, but it can still work. Trickster is okay, its crits are strong, but for a shifter - a pretty feat-starved class already - the 3 feats to spend on the critical hit improvements of vanilla Trickster are kind of a big deal.
Lich would work very well IMO. Aeon would be fine also.

My thanks to you and the above poster.
I'll try to play as I go. I wanted an optimized build for a change from my pathfinder walkthrough where my char was seriously underpowered at the end due to suboptimal build but following strict min-maxing strategies I find online is just no fun. I'm in act 3 with a trip kineticist but bored as hell.

 

[rojay]

Hi, asking for a little help there. I suck at theory crafting and would like to try a shifter build ; I like the class thematically .

I found a demon mythic path based on Aspect of Kalavakus and trip feats onYoutube but I don't like the demon path

Would something work with Azata or trickster mythic class or would I gimp myself ?

Many thanks in advance

Well, Azata isn't a very strong path for martials, but it can still work. Trickster is okay, its crits are strong, but for a shifter - a pretty feat-starved class already - the 3 feats to spend on the critical hit improvements of vanilla Trickster are kind of a big deal.
Lich would work very well IMO. Aeon would be fine also.

My thanks to you and the above poster.
I'll try to play as I go. I wanted an optimized build for a change from my pathfinder walkthrough where my char was seriously underpowered at the end due to suboptimal build but following strict min-maxing strategies I find online is just no fun. I'm in act 3 with a trip kineticist but bored as hell.

I know what you mean. When I've played kineticists it eventually devolves to alpha strike "deadly earth" followed by another deadly earth if anything wasn't in the first area of effect. Now and then maybe a blast, but empowered+maximized deadly earth trivializes most encounters in the game.

 

[Average Manatee]

Probably pay more attention to who you take as a companion, for melee like 75% of their capability comes from the amount and types of buffs other characters layer on them.

Melee builds in the end tend to fall into a fairly small number of categories:

trip builds
mounted/charge builds
improved improved critical improved trickster builds.
everything else

so once you've figured out which of these you're doing you kind of follow the same feat patterns with everyone unless there's some kind of gimmick/exploit you're taking advantage of.

Kineticist indeed gets quite boring because its so independent of everything else that can possibly be happening with your party or the enemies.

 

[Serus]

Sorry if not completely on topic but people talked about Golarion. Hope it isn't too far away. Are there any other official settings for Pathfinder, 1st or 2nd edition?

 

[ArchAngel]

Hi, asking for a little help there. I suck at theory crafting and would like to try a shifter build ; I like the class thematically .

I found a demon mythic path based on Aspect of Kalavakus and trip feats onYoutube but I don't like the demon path

Would something work with Azata or trickster mythic class or would I gimp myself ?

Many thanks in advance

Well, Azata isn't a very strong path for martials, but it can still work. Trickster is okay, its crits are strong, but for a shifter - a pretty feat-starved class already - the 3 feats to spend on the critical hit improvements of vanilla Trickster are kind of a big deal.
Lich would work very well IMO. Aeon would be fine also.

My thanks to you and the above poster.
I'll try to play as I go. I wanted an optimized build for a change from my pathfinder walkthrough where my char was seriously underpowered at the end due to suboptimal build but following strict min-maxing strategies I find online is just no fun. I'm in act 3 with a trip kineticist but bored as hell.

Best melee is Angel. Those spells and abilities you get even for non caster are bonkers.

 

[InD_ImaginE]

Sorry if not completely on topic but people talked about Golarion. Hope it isn't too far away. Are there any other official settings for Pathfinder, 1st or 2nd edition?

Paizo official for Pathfinder system? I don't think so. Starfinder has their own system but it is basically in the same universe as Golarion iirc

 

[Humanophage]

I wish the documentation was clearer. For example, you can see the DC dynamically, but it would be nice to be able to see how much damage your current channeling deals. For example, selective channel does affect Danse Macabre. But it seems that channeling crowns do not affect it, despite the ability being formally named "Negative Channeling" and being affected by selective channel. Or it is unclear if shadow casting is affected by Illusion or Conjuration/Evocation, or neither. It outwardly looks like it's Illusion because of the DC on the main icon, but the mini-icons seem to be affected by Conj/Evoc instead (without TTT, which I don't want to bother with for now). It is apparent that Elemental Barrage probably does not affect positive and negative energy, but nothing in its description suggests this (however, it does work with sonic, which is not an element by any stretch).

Another sad thing about documentation is cutting out monster descriptions. This is very puzzling because they already have them from the tabletop. It was fun to read them in Kingmaker.

 

[Desiderius]

Spirit hunters have average BAB and spirit enchantment isn't enough to make up for that.

The Mythic Carnivorous Crystal is one ridiculous troll of an optional fight. Opens with a large aoe that will instakill anyone who fails the save and has over 1000 HP, but a single casting of wracking ray followed by one polar ray will take it out in one round.

It’s a STR-based archetype but that doesn’t really bite her until later.

Weapon enchanting + Bane Weapon + Hampering Hex (Battle Spirit exclusive to lower foe AC by 4 for team even on made save with no immunity) makes her a force to be reckoned with at lvl 8. Just make sure to use Reduce Person and Fencing Grace and she’s gold at lvl 8 when she gets Bane + second attack + Hex kicks up from 2 to 4. She gets Ghost Touch at lvl 1.

Then at lvl 9 Divine Power hits +3/+3. She gets it at lvl 7 for extra attack and +2/+2.

Basically people don’t know how to use one minute buffs because they’re resting like P:K. Spiking is a big part of Wrath success and she spikes hard.

I definately prefer her as ranged Vital Striker nowadays. Goes well with a Rowdy dip - and even better if you respec her to a Shadow Shaman. Later Loremaster will let her pick GVS.
Still has Move action to Chant.


Btw., Vek added Split Hex and Bewitching Reflex in TTT. Yay, witches are back on the menu!

She’s ok ranged but wastes a lot of what makes her good there. I did that to facilitate the meta Snowball build with Winter Witch, which is kind of narrow (but good against Devarra). DEX-based wants to take advantage of the higher AC in melee.

Vital Strike is a really bad fit for DEX-based. Either you’re going small with Reduce Person (which is all upside DEX-based) or big with VS, not both. Her base class doesn’t have the Feats for it either, and VS is bad fit for ranged since ranged advantage is getting full attacks due to not needing to move.

When I finally get around to next playthrough I’ll be respeccing her to STR-based to take advantage of archetype. The other things you’re doing are either lateral moves (Shadow Shaman) or undermining the strength of her archetype (which scales by class level three ways) with the splashes.

 

[Desiderius]

Spirit hunters have average BAB and spirit enchantment isn't enough to make up for that.

The Mythic Carnivorous Crystal is one ridiculous troll of an optional fight. Opens with a large aoe that will instakill anyone who fails the save and has over 1000 HP, but a single casting of wracking ray followed by one polar ray will take it out in one round.

It’s a STR-based archetype but that doesn’t really bite her until later.

Weapon enchanting + Bane Weapon + Hampering Hex (Battle Spirit exclusive to lower foe AC by 4 for team even on made save with no immunity) makes her a force to be reckoned with at lvl 8. Just make sure to use Reduce Person and Fencing Grace and she’s gold at lvl 8 when she gets Bane + second attack + Hex kicks up from 2 to 4. She gets Ghost Touch at lvl 1.

Then at lvl 9 Divine Power hits +3/+3. She gets it at lvl 7 for extra attack and +2/+2.

Basically people don’t know how to use one minute buffs because they’re resting like P:K. Spiking is a big part of Wrath success and she spikes hard.

Also she has good crit and activates Outflank often. When you give her that medium armor that gives +4 damage when using outflank she does even better. I usually get Extend spell with her and put Divine Power in lvl 5 slots as well and then use sorcerous reflex to have that cast as swift at start of each battle.
And she can grab Animal Spirit and get animal companion at lvl 16 which lets her move and do full attack.

Precast Divine Favor/Power people. A minute is ten rounds. It’s enough.

 

[Desiderius]

Hi, asking for a little help there. I suck at theory crafting and would like to try a shifter build ; I like the class thematically .

I found a demon mythic path based on Aspect of Kalavakus and trip feats onYoutube but I don't like the demon path

Would something work with Azata or trickster mythic class or would I gimp myself ?

Many thanks in advance

Well, Azata isn't a very strong path for martials, but it can still work. Trickster is okay, its crits are strong, but for a shifter - a pretty feat-starved class already - the 3 feats to spend on the critical hit improvements of vanilla Trickster are kind of a big deal.
Lich would work very well IMO. Aeon would be fine also.

My thanks to you and the above poster.
I'll try to play as I go. I wanted an optimized build for a change from my pathfinder walkthrough where my char was seriously underpowered at the end due to suboptimal build but following strict min-maxing strategies I find online is just no fun. I'm in act 3 with a trip kineticist but bored as hell.

Can't go wrong with Angel. Very low maintenance with all the Immunities, Spellbook starts at lvl 3 spells, and Divine Favor/Power boost your attax even further.

If you play any class single-classed and read and use all your abilities you won't be underpowered in any sense. All the obsession with power levels really undermines enjoyment of the game. There are no ladders here.

You should get a good taste of Shifter from the Companion if you want to play something else with your main.

 

[Haplo]

Hi, asking for a little help there. I suck at theory crafting and would like to try a shifter build ; I like the class thematically .

I found a demon mythic path based on Aspect of Kalavakus and trip feats onYoutube but I don't like the demon path

Would something work with Azata or trickster mythic class or would I gimp myself ?

Many thanks in advance

Well, Azata isn't a very strong path for martials, but it can still work. Trickster is okay, its crits are strong, but for a shifter - a pretty feat-starved class already - the 3 feats to spend on the critical hit improvements of vanilla Trickster are kind of a big deal.
Lich would work very well IMO. Aeon would be fine also.

My thanks to you and the above poster.
I'll try to play as I go. I wanted an optimized build for a change from my pathfinder walkthrough where my char was seriously underpowered at the end due to suboptimal build but following strict min-maxing strategies I find online is just no fun. I'm in act 3 with a trip kineticist but bored as hell.

Best melee is Angel. Those spells and abilities you get even for non caster are bonkers.

Angel is fine.
However its far from best for melee. Angel never had much in the way of unique Attack Bonus boosts (gets Divine Favor/Power/Avenger - but other casting classes can access the first 2 as well). Now that Abolish Guile is supposedly fixed, he's also lost his major damage boost vs most enemies. And sure, he gets great buffs overall, particularly defensive. Sun Marked adds a nice chunk of damage to the whole party, Holy Sword adds a little more for himself.


But its nowhere near strongest martial support. In this field he's badly overtaken by Trickster, Lich, Aeon, raging Demon... hell even Azata with the DLC3 ring has stonger melee boosts.

Granted, the entire Angel party works very well due to the safety cushion of the awesome buffs plus SunMarked bonus damage.

However a trip machine, like a wolf shifter, would really want something more in the way of Attack Bonus boosts - as they also boost his CMB. And angel offers very little here (compare with Aeon who also has Divine Favor/Might, but ALSO gets up to +10 AB from Gaze + cloak AND up to +10 AB/damage more on AoOs or extra +6 CMB, Lich +4 AB & MR damage from Fear Control and potentially some 6+ AB & damage from Power from Death, Demon who stacks something like +19 CMB during rage, as well as lots of AB & damage...).

 

[Haplo]

You should get a good taste of Shifter from the Companion if you want to play something else with your main.

Gryphon companion is very strong... but also very one-note as far as shifters go (just choorge evry round, without worrying about positioning or line of sight).
Vanilla shifter is much more versatile (if not necessarily stronger). Like Wolf shifter with Trip on every attack offers a very different playstyle - that of melee CC/DD hybrid, potentially aoe.

 

[Haplo]

Spirit hunters have average BAB and spirit enchantment isn't enough to make up for that.

The Mythic Carnivorous Crystal is one ridiculous troll of an optional fight. Opens with a large aoe that will instakill anyone who fails the save and has over 1000 HP, but a single casting of wracking ray followed by one polar ray will take it out in one round.

It’s a STR-based archetype but that doesn’t really bite her until later.

Weapon enchanting + Bane Weapon + Hampering Hex (Battle Spirit exclusive to lower foe AC by 4 for team even on made save with no immunity) makes her a force to be reckoned with at lvl 8. Just make sure to use Reduce Person and Fencing Grace and she’s gold at lvl 8 when she gets Bane + second attack + Hex kicks up from 2 to 4. She gets Ghost Touch at lvl 1.

Then at lvl 9 Divine Power hits +3/+3. She gets it at lvl 7 for extra attack and +2/+2.

Basically people don’t know how to use one minute buffs because they’re resting like P:K. Spiking is a big part of Wrath success and she spikes hard.

I definately prefer her as ranged Vital Striker nowadays. Goes well with a Rowdy dip - and even better if you respec her to a Shadow Shaman. Later Loremaster will let her pick GVS.
Still has Move action to Chant.


Btw., Vek added Split Hex and Bewitching Reflex in TTT. Yay, witches are back on the menu!

She’s ok ranged but wastes a lot of what makes her good there. I did that to facilitate the meta Snowball build with Winter Witch, which is kind of narrow (but good against Devarra). DEX-based wants to take advantage of the higher AC in melee.

Vital Strike is a really bad fit for DEX-based. Either you’re going small with Reduce Person (which is all upside DEX-based) or big with VS, not both. Her base class doesn’t have the Feats for it either, and VS is bad fit for ranged since ranged advantage is getting full attacks due to not needing to move.

When I finally get around to next playthrough I’ll be respeccing her to STR-based to take advantage of archetype. The other things you’re doing are either lateral moves (Shadow Shaman) or undermining the strength of her archetype (which scales by class level three ways) with the splashes.

Melee doesn't mix with Hexes. You do one or the other. You need to use Move actions to engage or fullattack. If you want her to be an offtank and mostly ignore a major class feature like Hexes, that's fine, but IMO doesn't play to her strenghts.
Ranged VS + Chant to keep up Protective Luck on tank or/and Evil Eye/Hampering Hex on major enemy do work together.

Base Vital Strike might not be great with Reduce - and cost feats. But that's where a Rowdy comes into play. You get it for free and it scales basing on Sneak Attack damage (Shadow Shamans have Sneak progression). Later Mythic VS DOES multiply stat and other fixed modifiers (like enchantment, Divine Power and so on). And Cleaving Shots fire additional Vital Strikes :D ....eventually Loremaster adds GVS and you're golden.

 

[ArchAngel]

Spirit hunters have average BAB and spirit enchantment isn't enough to make up for that.

The Mythic Carnivorous Crystal is one ridiculous troll of an optional fight. Opens with a large aoe that will instakill anyone who fails the save and has over 1000 HP, but a single casting of wracking ray followed by one polar ray will take it out in one round.

It’s a STR-based archetype but that doesn’t really bite her until later.

Weapon enchanting + Bane Weapon + Hampering Hex (Battle Spirit exclusive to lower foe AC by 4 for team even on made save with no immunity) makes her a force to be reckoned with at lvl 8. Just make sure to use Reduce Person and Fencing Grace and she’s gold at lvl 8 when she gets Bane + second attack + Hex kicks up from 2 to 4. She gets Ghost Touch at lvl 1.

Then at lvl 9 Divine Power hits +3/+3. She gets it at lvl 7 for extra attack and +2/+2.

Basically people don’t know how to use one minute buffs because they’re resting like P:K. Spiking is a big part of Wrath success and she spikes hard.

Also she has good crit and activates Outflank often. When you give her that medium armor that gives +4 damage when using outflank she does even better. I usually get Extend spell with her and put Divine Power in lvl 5 slots as well and then use sorcerous reflex to have that cast as swift at start of each battle.
And she can grab Animal Spirit and get animal companion at lvl 16 which lets her move and do full attack.

Precast Divine Favor/Power people. A minute is ten rounds. It’s enough.

Sure but many fights are not controlled by you and for the rest you need to move slowly and carefully so you do not start the fight before you cast it. I rather just run through maps and into range of enemy so turn starts and then cast it as free action on turn 1

 

[ArchAngel]

Hi, asking for a little help there. I suck at theory crafting and would like to try a shifter build ; I like the class thematically .

I found a demon mythic path based on Aspect of Kalavakus and trip feats onYoutube but I don't like the demon path

Would something work with Azata or trickster mythic class or would I gimp myself ?

Many thanks in advance

Well, Azata isn't a very strong path for martials, but it can still work. Trickster is okay, its crits are strong, but for a shifter - a pretty feat-starved class already - the 3 feats to spend on the critical hit improvements of vanilla Trickster are kind of a big deal.
Lich would work very well IMO. Aeon would be fine also.

My thanks to you and the above poster.
I'll try to play as I go. I wanted an optimized build for a change from my pathfinder walkthrough where my char was seriously underpowered at the end due to suboptimal build but following strict min-maxing strategies I find online is just no fun. I'm in act 3 with a trip kineticist but bored as hell.

Best melee is Angel. Those spells and abilities you get even for non caster are bonkers.

Angel is fine.
However its far from best for melee. Angel never had much in the way of unique Attack Bonus boosts (gets Divine Favor/Power/Avenger - but other casting classes can access the first 2 as well). Now that Abolish Guile is supposedly fixed, he's also lost his major damage boost vs most enemies. And sure, he gets great buffs overall, particularly defensive. Sun Marked adds a nice chunk of damage to the whole party, Holy Sword adds a little more for himself.


But its nowhere near strongest martial support. In this field he's badly overtaken by Trickster, Lich, Aeon, raging Demon... hell even Azata with the DLC3 ring has stonger melee boosts.

Granted, the entire Angel party works very well due to the safety cushion of the awesome buffs plus SunMarked bonus damage.

However a trip machine, like a wolf shifter, would really want something more in the way of Attack Bonus boosts - as they also boost his CMB. And angel offers very little here (compare with Aeon who also has Divine Favor/Might, but ALSO gets up to +10 AB from Gaze + cloak AND up to +10 AB/damage more on AoOs or extra +6 CMB, Lich +4 AB & MR damage from Fear Control and potentially some 6+ AB & damage from Power from Death, Demon who stacks something like +19 CMB during rage, as well as lots of AB & damage...).

I played melee mad dog barbarian with Angel and that was still my easiest playthrough. And trip is overrated as many enemies cannot be tripped and really big ones and with many legs are very resistant. Vs those enemies you want it the most you will not be able to do it. And vs random idiots you do not need it.