Eternity Pillars of Eternity + The White March Expansion Thread

[Prime Junta]

The inevntory stash cannot be accessed during dungeon exploration. So once you start descending into the mega-dungeon, you will not be able to get items from the stash, only each charatcer's personal inventory, if I am remembering correctly.

That's an option you have to set. Do it if you're into self-punishment.

 

[oldmanpaco]

So is Expert mode just a pain in the ass or is there some hidden enlightenment that will reveal itself to me at some point?

 

[Roguey]

So is Expert mode just a pain in the ass or is there some hidden enlightenment that will reveal itself to me at some point?

If you think you'll enjoy those restrictions, use it, if you don't, don't.

 

[Lacrymas]

It just doesn't show AoE circles and some other stuff (health bars?), kinda like the BGs.

 

[Grotesque]

Why I can't access the stash in Caed Nua??
it's my own place for God's sake!

You have to repair the main keep first.

all constructions are built

I'm not sure what you mean by stash. There's your inventory stash (which is accessed per usual through the inventory) and there's the treasure chest/vault thingy that's in the room just to the right of the throne room, but it sounds like you mean something else?

I am talking about the inventory stash
And I am not into the dungeon levels, I am in front of the keep
I play expert mode

 

[Monkeyfinger]

Did it after a couple false starts stepping over traps.

What class?

That's the full party achievement. Solo version is called The Ultimate.

Used rogue (MC), kana, pallegina, hiravias, durance, aloth.

 

[Sacred82]

What information exactly is missing on Expert? Things like enemies' deflection and saves?

 

[Lacrymas]

What information exactly is missing on Expert? Things like enemies' deflection and saves?

Think of it as playing an IE game. No health bars, no aoe circles, no stats of any kind basically. They are still in the bestiary AFAIK, but don't show up on the battleground UI.

 

[oldmanpaco]

What information exactly is missing on Expert? Things like enemies' deflection and saves?

Think of it as playing an IE game. No health bars, no aoe circles, no stats of any kind basically. They are still in the bestiary AFAIK, but don't show up on the battleground UI.

Also limited access to stash and conversations no longer show what options you are missing out on due to low stats/skills.

 

[FreeKaner]

conversations no longer show what options you are missing out on due to low stats/skills.

People played with this on?

 

[oldmanpaco]

conversations no longer show what options you are missing out on due to low stats/skills.

People played with this on?

Yeah I would guess 95% of players had this on by default.

 

[FreeKaner]

conversations no longer show what options you are missing out on due to low stats/skills.

People played with this on?

Yeah I would guess 95% of players had this on by default.

Seriously? Next you are going to tell me people had the disposition notifiers. What's the point?

 

[oldmanpaco]

conversations no longer show what options you are missing out on due to low stats/skills.

People played with this on?

Yeah I would guess 95% of players had this on by default.

Seriously? Next you are going to tell me people had the disposition notifiers. What's the point?

These options were enabled by default. How many people do you think turned them off for a "real" RPG experience?

 

[Seaking4]

I had no interest in playing expert mode but even I turned off half the options.

 

[oldmanpaco]

I'm not saying its right or wrong but I bet the vast majority of people played with these options on.

 

[Mastermind]

Real RPG fans play with conversation stats on. People who turn them off are either disgusting adventurefags or baldur's gate nostalgia fags, and the latter are guaranteed to be disappointed if they play this game like it was BG2's successor. The game is much better if played as a separate and different IE style game.

 

[Haplo]

conversations no longer show what options you are missing out on due to low stats/skills.

People played with this on?

Yes I did. I like to optimize my choices. Sue me.

 

[Luckmann]

conversations no longer show what options you are missing out on due to low stats/skills.

People played with this on?

Yeah I would guess 95% of players had this on by default.

Seriously? Next you are going to tell me people had the disposition notifiers. What's the point?

The point is that showing the disposition modifiers makes you aware of whether the choice is Aggressive, Benevolent, or Deceptive. I tried turning them off, but ended up being so annoyed with the randomness of the outcomes that I had to turn it back on again. I have no idea how anyone roleplays with them turned off. Might as well roll a dice to see if you end up punching someone or not.

 

[Prime Junta]

The point is that showing the disposition modifiers makes you aware of whether the choice is Aggressive, Benevolent, or Deceptive. I tried turning them off, but ended up being so annoyed with the randomness of the outcomes that I had to turn it back on again. I have no idea how anyone roleplays with them turned off. Might as well roll a dice to see if you end up punching someone or not.

I played about 3/4 of the game once with a Goldpact paladin, with the modifiers turned off. I liked it. I had to pay attention to the dialogue in a whole new way.

It also worked. I succeeded in completely avoiding ranks in my avoided dispositions, and racked up clearly the highest ranks in the ones I was pursuing. I would certainly have done better with the texts on, but overall I thought the tags were a pretty good match for the content. YMMV as always

 

[Barnabas]

Any good mods yet

 

[Luckmann]

The point is that showing the disposition modifiers makes you aware of whether the choice is Aggressive, Benevolent, or Deceptive. I tried turning them off, but ended up being so annoyed with the randomness of the outcomes that I had to turn it back on again. I have no idea how anyone roleplays with them turned off. Might as well roll a dice to see if you end up punching someone or not.

I played about 3/4 of the game once with a Goldpact paladin, with the modifiers turned off. I liked it. I had to pay attention to the dialogue in a whole new way.

It also worked. I succeeded in completely avoiding ranks in my avoided dispositions, and racked up clearly the highest ranks in the ones I was pursuing. I would certainly have done better with the texts on, but overall I thought the tags were a pretty good match for the content. YMMV as always

My first character (and part of what prompted me to adopt this stance, I guess) was a Bleak Walker Paladin, and I wasn't really trying to go for specific dispositions, it was more the fact that I could never really be sure what the tone of what I was saying was. The fact that Bleak Walkers turned out to just be Blackguards despite indications of otherwise was an incredible let-down.

It was more an issue with certain dialogues than others, and in terms of min/maxing dispositions, that shouldn't actually be hard with the Disposition identifiers turned off. It was more a matter of not knowing whether I was being Aggressive or Benevolent in the way I was saying something like "Get out of here". If it was Aggressive, the NPC would react with fear and high-tail it out of there, it was Benevolent, the NPC would grovel a bit and be thankful I was letting them go. Without the identifiers, I just had no clue what would happen, and it was annoying the hell out of me. I remember especially one conversation (but not where), where I reacted to the fact that one of the answers were [Deceptive], yet there was no clear indication that it was deceptive, other than the tag, which was absent if you played without identifiers.

This kinda thing can be avoided by other kinds of tags, unrelated to the disposition system itself, or by clever writing, but PoE was obviously written with this design in mind, so it ended up using it as a crutch. Decline? Maybe, but then the decline is at a deeper level than the indicators themselves, and lies with the reliance on the indicators and the quality of writing and conveying the tone to the player. But it's very hard to write things that reads as intentionally deceptive without it losing the point, which is why having [Deceptive] as an indicator or (Lie) stuck onto the end are almost indispensable.

After playing Tyranny, I really hope that they make the most of the in-text tagging system in Pillars of Eternity 2, and also start applying it to dialogue choices. Being able to tag choices in terms of tone and intent shown when moused over them could be a real helper, much like how you sometimes explain to the GM when playing PnP that you're doing something in a specific manner, without taking up space for the actual dialogue option.

Spoiler

Dammit.. now I'm getting hyped for Pillars of Eternity 2. I promised myself this wouldn't happen again, not after Tyranny and Tides of Numenera...

 

[Sacred82]

It's not so much that the writing is unclear than that the dispositions are muddled. You can be a guy who hurls people against walls and threaten to break their face even though you have no reason to take any side in the quarrel, while also being a benevolent stroker of kitties.

 

[Luckmann]

It's not so much that the writing is unclear than that the dispositions are muddled. You can be a guy who hurls people against walls and threaten to break their face even though you have no reason to take any side in the quarrel, while also being a benevolent stroker of kitties.

I don't see a problem with that. Being aggressive have nothing to do with whether you're a benevolent stroker of kitties or not. And as opposed to Tides of Numenera, the way disposition points are doled out usually makes a degree of sense, whereas in Tides of Numenera, it's practically random.

Even if you turn off the Disposition identifiers in PoE and end up taking a response that makes you go "God fucking dammit, that's not what I meant", there's very few instances of "Wait, how the fuck is that Benevolent?", and most often I could actually argue "Oh, yeah, I guess that could make sense". The notable exception here being some instances of [Cruel] vs. [Aggressive], and [Rational] simply being all over the place (and sometimes downright irrational, as I remember it). Similarly, Stoic is usually only handed out for the answers that are both uncaring and laconic, which misrepresents the idea of being stoic - but at least it's consistent. In Tides of Numenera, merely asking someone what's wrong somehow means that you're Passionate (Red) and Benevolent (Gold), asking a question gives you Blue for being Inquisitive, but only for some questions and not others, and if you tell someone that they shouldn't sacrifice themselves, it's somehow Communual (Indigo), and if you tell someone that they should try to be an inspiration to the community, it's suddenly Silver (Aspirational, Power-Hungry, etc.).

But yeah, there are instances of the Dispositions being muddled in PoE, but it doesn't really tie into the issue of whether someone feels the need to have the Disposition Indicators on or off, that's almost entirely in the writing.

 

[Sacred82]

I don't see a problem with that. Being aggressive have nothing to do with whether you're a benevolent stroker of kitties or not.

As I said, you have absolutely no reason to take a side in that conversation (talking about the Trumbel thing). It's nothig but wanton violence. And I have yet to read a definition of benevolence that would include such a thing.

 

[Iznaliu]

After playing Tyranny, I really hope that they make the most of the in-text tagging system in Pillars of Eternity 2, and also start applying it to dialogue choices. Being able to tag choices in terms of tone and intent shown when moused over them could be a real helper, much like how you sometimes explain to the GM when playing PnP that you're doing something in a specific manner, without taking up space for the actual dialogue option.

1. Go to Obisdian forums/PoE subreddit, where it will get noticed by Obsidian. This is a legitimate breakthrough in RPG conversation design
2. Post idea there.