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Comte

Guest
Beamdog is working on a new DLC adventure for the critically acclaimed Planescape Torment.
 

TigerKnee

Arcane
Joined
Feb 24, 2012
Messages
1,920
That's kind of an interesting view on early Wizardry, since the developers themselves seem to have taken the angle that Wizardry was throughly-tested and heavily looked down upon cheat utilities because "they ruin the balance that we worked on".
 

Sigourn

uooh afficionado
Joined
Feb 6, 2016
Messages
5,732
I'll assume your question is honest and give you a honest answer. Classic cRPGs were about obsessing over your own devices. You're thrown into a flexible, sandboxy environment which you try to break with wild ideas and combination of ideas, either in combat tactics or character building. An essential part of these games was, precisely, that *not everything you could do had been anticipated*, nowadays the unpredictable & unbalanced character design of Wizardry would never be released by an AAA studio, and that's why things have lost their shine for me. I take great pleasure in that kind of exercise and challenge, not so much in the "immersion"(because I detest escapism), nor the plot & story which I agree are better delivered in other media, although when they correctly service the mechanics of a cRPG they can make it shine.

So... autism? All I see is four names and stats moving around a dungeon in Wizardry. Bear in mind I consider Wizardry more fun than Ultima, though. At least Wizardry had an interesting concept and gameplay, but Ultima, that I cannot understand how it was so succesful.
 

anvi

Prophet
Village Idiot
Joined
Oct 12, 2016
Messages
8,318
Location
Kelethin
Traditional RPGs are just an incredibly mundane and horrible ordeal. That's why they are dying.
I kind of agree with this. But I think they were mostly boring and tedious because of bad design, not because they are traditional RPG's. Stuff like Blackguards is new and far less mundane and tedious yet still keeps all that depth. Divinity is the same thing, it is still tactical combat with lots of stats and stuff, but the combat is actually fun. Covering goblins with oil to slow them down then lighting it on fire and incinerating them all was fun. Games can have depth and tactics without being tedious. I just think old RPG's hadn't quite had the chance to figure out how to do it well. And modern companies don't care to try to fix it, they would rather throw the whole thing away and make a dumb action game instead.
 

Bohrain

Liturgist
Patron
Joined
Aug 10, 2016
Messages
1,486
Location
norf
My team has the sexiest and deadliest waifus you can recruit.
I play games for the story and not the mechanics and I'm happy how developers cateri to me!
 

Sigourn

uooh afficionado
Joined
Feb 6, 2016
Messages
5,732
To anyone defending FF13 -

Here's a list of common RPG features that FF13 is completely missing;

Stats? No, they were taken out to make it easier for newcomers. Multiple weapons? Nope, they were stripped out too. Limit breaks? At the very end and weaker than normal attacks. Secret summons? Nope. Multiple extra locations to explore, some sense of freedom? No, the whole damn game is one long corridor of boredom, aside from one place - after which you're quickly pushed back in the corridor for the remainder of the game. Engaging battles? Nope, battles consist of nothing but "auto-something". Towns full of NPCs that provide interesting conversation or hints to secrets? Nope, because you don't go to a single town throughout the game. Memorable locations? I can't remember a SINGLE place name from FF13, not one. Memorable enemies? Well half of the enemies are re-coloured skins of different enemies, so I'll go with no. Memorable music? No, the main villain's theme song was just ANNOYING, I had to mute the damn thing every time. Memorable bosses? One, Dahaka was the ONLY boss that made me feel like I was fighting a Final Fantasy boss.

FF7 - 12 (not including X-2) are my five favourite games of all time, the only other game that comes close being Xenogears - made by the same people, so to say I'm a fan is an understatement - but 13 is just a stain on the name of the franchise.
 

Telengard

Arcane
Joined
Nov 27, 2011
Messages
1,621
Location
The end of every place
Your mama is better at playing rpgs than you are.

And that is a statement that could not be more true. Most crpg players these days are just guys who badly wanted to play dolly when they were kids but were too embarrassed to tell their parents, which is why they are so obsessed with how many clothing and hair options their character has, so they can play dress-up and style hair all day long.

Coupled with that, your modern rpg player now insists on having a home base - a place in which they can add furniture and trophies and wallpaper. Essentially, so that they can play House with their dollies.

Crafting collect-a-thons give the character something to do besides pillage and plunder, which "story" was already steering them away from anyways. And the recent addition of dating and children has at last made the circle complete, and now the modern role-playing gamers' secret dream has finally come true. They can now spend all their time picking out pink wallpaper and matching drapes, working as a trash collector of the town's trash barrels, dating, having children, and having dry, domestic conversations with the colorful local townsfolk.

Because nobody here actually wants to play rpgs anymore; they want to live out their childhood dream of playing House with their dollies. Which is why your mama is better at rpgs than you are. She's had years of practice playing House, both real and make-believe.
 

Sigourn

uooh afficionado
Joined
Feb 6, 2016
Messages
5,732
Telengard is the worst RPG I'll never have the displeasure of playing.
 

Severian Silk

Guest
Here are three things:

"Volourn is right about everything!"
"Prosper is right about everything!"
"Lyric Suite is right about everything!"
 

Lonely Vazdru

Pimp my Title
Joined
Jan 10, 2007
Messages
6,695
Location
Agen
With more people working on them, more money thrown at them and a better technology, CRPGs are nowadays way closer to the true nature of RPGs than they were a couple of decades ago.
 

retamar

Educated
Joined
Apr 7, 2014
Messages
64
Make it optional, whats wrong about adapting the game to different tastes?
RPG games
 

Crooked Bee

(no longer) a wide-wandering bee
Patron
Joined
Jan 27, 2010
Messages
15,048
Location
In quarantine
Codex 2013 Codex 2014 PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015 Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire MCA Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 BattleTech Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire
Checkpoint saves are superior to save anywhere. Save anywhere is basically the inherent cheat code in PC gaming.
 

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