Baldur's Gate Baldur's Gate 3 RELEASE THREAD

[BlackAdderBG]

how raiding the druids (aka the actual evil path split) will help you at all

There's more of then, and they are more likely to win. So just siding with the winning side. Not like the thieflings are offering any help to you. They are weaker, and less useful to you personally.
Druids sit it out, they lock themselves in their grove. They were offering help, but they also want the thieflings out anyways. Really, helping the thieflings isn't even neutral, its straight up a "good" coded decision. Its altruistic, you don't benefit from it.
The neutral decision would've been to wait for the druids to finish their ritual, wait for the thieflings to get on the road (and probably get massacred), and then negotiate passage into the Underdark or seek help from druids or whatever. But this isn't an option here, as far as I know.

No, that is meta knowledge and not pointed in the game dialog or quests on top

You feel forbidden to assume, or to think any thought not explicitly spelled out for you by the game "content"?

This actually is spelled out by the game, but I think its in Act II, when the guardian straight up says "its in our benefit to join and infiltrate the Absolute cult". Not sure if there's any such line in Act I. But also, its obvious.

Not like the thieflings are offering any help to you.

They offer you all their money, your own point for been "evil" aka greed just couple of posts ago. On top of promising to help you later in Baldur's Gate and if you have Karlach the blacksmith will upgrade her power. The cult doesn't offer you anything, everthing is assumed or meta knowledge. The game doesn't make a single hint that you can ally with the goblins (or any reason to do it) until you stumble randomly on Minthara and she talks to you as you know her. At that time you are encouraged by the game on two occasions to attack the bosses and she is the 3rd one(on top of been the main quest), not only in the journal, but ingame tadpole talking. You have to know thru meta gaming that you can ally with them so you either beeline to her and talk, skipping the shaman and the leader so you are not hostile when meeting Minthara. The whole area is terribly designed, placing dozens of quests that can turn all goblins hostile and you are going only by a random journal text that appears out of nowhere that you can raid the grove from where you had to assume you can ally with the cult e.g. another meta gaming.

One thing I will give credit is that you can on paper ignore all this shit and just go to underdark or mountain to do your thing. Ofc tons of problems come from that as quest chains get mixed up and NPCs dialog become fucked up talking to you as you did things you didn't or never even met them.

 

[Zariusz]

Have there been any larger modding projects trying to restore cut content in the OS and OS2 iterations of this engine? If yes i wonder the current BG 3 version will be viable for such attempts, i heard that Larian restores many things in later releases of their games but im not sure if this time its going to happen.

 

[whydoibother]

They offer you all their money, your own point for been "evil" aka greed just couple of posts ago. On top of promising to help you later in Baldur's Gate and if you have Karlach the blacksmith will upgrade her power. The cult doesn't offer you anything, everthing is assumed or meta knowledge. The game doesn't make a single hint that you can ally with the goblins (or any reason to do it) until you stumble randomly on Minthara and she talks to you as you know her. At that time you are encouraged by the game on two occasions to attack the bosses and she is the 3rd one(on top of been the main quest), not only in the journal, but ingame tadpole talking. You have to know thru meta gaming that you can ally with them so you either beeline to her and talk, skipping the shaman and the leader so you are not hostile when meeting Minthara. The whole area is terribly designed, placing dozens of quests that can turn all goblins hostile and you are going only by a random journal text that appears out of nowhere that you can raid the grove from where you had to assume you can ally with the cult e.g. another meta gaming.

Greedy for cure to the tadpole thing, and for power, not greedy for 200 gold lmao.
The cult offers both cure and power. And you can deal with the priest, she sleeps you and you are transported to her room. There you kill her after escaping or Raphael sends you help, and she is dead WITHOUT alerting anyone else. Then you can fake the interrogation of the dead illithid in front of the hobgoblin, and there's only 1 combination out of 5 that makes him suspicious and he aggroes. Else, he just lets you pass. And then you talk to the drow, whom you know is there, because people in the camp and corpses you can talk to will tell you. I think even the priestess tells you. The other drow, a corpse in the Druid cove, definitely tells you through Speak with the dead. And, a bit meta, but as the player you see her with the hobgoblins in the opening scene for Act I, after the tutorial.
When I did this whole thing in early access, I had no further knowledge, no guides, didn't look anything up, and it flowed perfectly fine. Helped the goblin escape. Went to the priestess. She tried to dupe me, killed her. Went to the hobgoblin, duped him. Talked to the drow, made the deal. Then, in the end I double crossed them, but I could've just as easily opened the door for them. They are likely to win, especially with my treason, so if you absolutely want to get involved, you get involved on the stronger side.

There's definitely issues, and we've discussed some ITT, but you are exaggerating how bad it is. Its fine. Its actually better than most other "evil" playthrough offerings in cRPGs.

 

[gurugeorge]

Aaaaand now I'm liking the game again, House of Hope is a great little zone, from the lore and atmosphere to the combat encounters. The sense of oppressive, whimsically evil horror is very BG too.

The city is a mixed bag. It's got lots of detail and charm, which is nice, but it definitely needs some more work in terms usability - it's got a lot of complex areas, but the "culling" or whatever you call it (the thing that lets you see through a "hole" in what's in front of the camera through to your characters) doesn't always work very well.

(Speaking of that, I always think with that "hole" developers never really make it big enough. Really that "hole" should be nearly the size of the whole screen resolution, with only a hint of what you're seeing through around the edges. After all, if you've moved your camera into a position where the game has to make a hole, you've probably got a rough idea of what you're seeing through anyway.)

 

[BlackAdderBG]

They offer you all their money, your own point for been "evil" aka greed just couple of posts ago. On top of promising to help you later in Baldur's Gate and if you have Karlach the blacksmith will upgrade her power. The cult doesn't offer you anything, everthing is assumed or meta knowledge. The game doesn't make a single hint that you can ally with the goblins (or any reason to do it) until you stumble randomly on Minthara and she talks to you as you know her. At that time you are encouraged by the game on two occasions to attack the bosses and she is the 3rd one(on top of been the main quest), not only in the journal, but ingame tadpole talking. You have to know thru meta gaming that you can ally with them so you either beeline to her and talk, skipping the shaman and the leader so you are not hostile when meeting Minthara. The whole area is terribly designed, placing dozens of quests that can turn all goblins hostile and you are going only by a random journal text that appears out of nowhere that you can raid the grove from where you had to assume you can ally with the cult e.g. another meta gaming.

Greedy for cure to the tadpole thing, and for power, not greedy for 200 gold lmao.
The cult offers both cure and power. And you can deal with the priest, she sleeps you and you are transported to her room. There you kill her after escaping or Raphael sends you help, and she is dead WITHOUT alerting anyone else. Then you can fake the interrogation of the dead illithid in front of the hobgoblin, and there's only 1 combination out of 5 that makes him suspicious and he aggroes. Else, he just lets you pass. And then you talk to the drow, whom you know is there, because people in the camp and corpses you can talk to will tell you. I think even the priestess tells you. The other drow, a corpse in the Druid cove, definitely tells you through Speak with the dead. And, a bit meta, but as the player you see her with the hobgoblins in the opening scene for Act I, after the tutorial.
When I did this whole thing in early access, I had no further knowledge, no guides, didn't look anything up, and it flowed perfectly fine. Helped the goblin escape. Went to the priestess. She tried to dupe me, killed her. Went to the hobgoblin, duped him. Talked to the drow, made the deal. Then, in the end I double crossed them, but I could've just as easily opened the door for them. They are likely to win, especially with my treason, so if you absolutely want to get involved, you get involved on the stronger side.

There's definitely issues, and we've discussed some ITT, but you are exaggerating how bad it is. Its fine. Its actually better than most other "evil" playthrough offerings in cRPGs.

I watched couple of streams by people that played for the first time (no EA) and non of them even made it to the shaman without aggroing the whole camp. I would have done it too if I didn't know from reading the threads here. It would be one thing if it was some easter egg type thing you discover on second playthrough, but that's not the case as it's clearly major part of the act design. Compared to BG2 or NWN2 early choice with who to ally it's not even close to been better.

 

[Tuco Benedicto Pacifico]

Come on. You have to be borderline retarded to aggro the entire goblin camp without noticing any of the HALF MILLION options for "pacific infiltration" the game offers.

 

[AwesomeButton]

Come on. You have to be borderline retarded to aggro the entire goblin camp without noticing any of the HALF MILLION options for "pacific infiltration" the game offers.

I noticed the camp doesn't treat me as a hostile by default. Nevertheless I decided to roleplay it and snuck all the way to the three truesouls and killed them, beginning with the hobgoblin. Killing him turns everyone hostile by itself, but I wanted to kill every last goblin anyway, for RP reasons. Sneaking in and executing this plan was a great experience.

 

[Space Satan]

My only problem with Shadowheart is that she is a half-elf. Half of filthy elven blood is only half-redeemable by her decent looks.

 

[Orud]

Come on. You have to be borderline retarded to aggro the entire goblin camp without noticing any of the HALF MILLION options for "pacific infiltration" the game offers.

At this point I'm quite sure a lot of Codexers are so socially inept that they're surprised that 'yes' or 'no' mean 2 different things.

 

[dukeofwoodberry]

They offer you all their money, your own point for been "evil" aka greed just couple of posts ago. On top of promising to help you later in Baldur's Gate and if you have Karlach the blacksmith will upgrade her power. The cult doesn't offer you anything, everthing is assumed or meta knowledge. The game doesn't make a single hint that you can ally with the goblins (or any reason to do it) until you stumble randomly on Minthara and she talks to you as you know her. At that time you are encouraged by the game on two occasions to attack the bosses and she is the 3rd one(on top of been the main quest), not only in the journal, but ingame tadpole talking. You have to know thru meta gaming that you can ally with them so you either beeline to her and talk, skipping the shaman and the leader so you are not hostile when meeting Minthara. The whole area is terribly designed, placing dozens of quests that can turn all goblins hostile and you are going only by a random journal text that appears out of nowhere that you can raid the grove from where you had to assume you can ally with the cult e.g. another meta gaming.

Greedy for cure to the tadpole thing, and for power, not greedy for 200 gold lmao.
The cult offers both cure and power. And you can deal with the priest, she sleeps you and you are transported to her room. There you kill her after escaping or Raphael sends you help, and she is dead WITHOUT alerting anyone else. Then you can fake the interrogation of the dead illithid in front of the hobgoblin, and there's only 1 combination out of 5 that makes him suspicious and he aggroes. Else, he just lets you pass. And then you talk to the drow, whom you know is there, because people in the camp and corpses you can talk to will tell you. I think even the priestess tells you. The other drow, a corpse in the Druid cove, definitely tells you through Speak with the dead. And, a bit meta, but as the player you see her with the hobgoblins in the opening scene for Act I, after the tutorial.
When I did this whole thing in early access, I had no further knowledge, no guides, didn't look anything up, and it flowed perfectly fine. Helped the goblin escape. Went to the priestess. She tried to dupe me, killed her. Went to the hobgoblin, duped him. Talked to the drow, made the deal. Then, in the end I double crossed them, but I could've just as easily opened the door for them. They are likely to win, especially with my treason, so if you absolutely want to get involved, you get involved on the stronger side.

There's definitely issues, and we've discussed some ITT, but you are exaggerating how bad it is. Its fine. Its actually better than most other "evil" playthrough offerings in cRPGs.

You didn't even play evil then so what are you talking about. You're only talking about act 1 also

 

[BlackAdderBG]

Come on. You have to be borderline retarded to aggro the entire goblin camp without noticing any of the HALF MILLION options for "pacific infiltration" the game offers.

Why would you do that, that's the problem. Did you read any of the last 10 pages? There are zero reasons to be peaceful with the goblins story-wise and mechanically. Again your point is meta gaming, "I see a lot of dialog choices of this type, the designers must have something stored" nice story structure Larian!

 

[Alienman]

None of the paths works, as you can do whatever you want regardless of whether you are evil or not. It has absolutely no restrictions. Kill the grove and the harpers and Jaheria will still treat you fine. Kill the goblins and the leaders, and the Absolute doesn't give a toss. They will welcome you with open arms in spooky town. However, if you side with the goblins in Act 1, you gain nothing, while being good, you get tons of loot, you get to keep companions and you don't have to use zombie help to fill out a party. You also don't break any long quest chains. I find both paths very disappointing since there is no difference between them except that by playing "evil", you will lose out on stuff. This is meta-knowledge, I know, but with hindsight, we can see how it all plays out. And I know the argument for choice and consequences, which I agree with, but there is nothing here to miss out on if you play good, except Minthara which is a broken companion. There is a lack of any interesting balance here, much like the damn tadpole powers. You might look like a 72-year-old meth smoker after consuming brain worms like popcorn, but in the end you are miraculously cured. That system symbolizes the whole game to me.

I gave up on my evil playthrough since it was so boring. You don't gain any cool power, you don't get extra loot, and you only make it harder for yourself, which to me seems like the opposite of a self-serving evil guy. The only way to play a non-retarded evil guy is to pretend to be a good guy and pick good guy choices. But what fun is that, and to what end? You might just reload before the ending and pick option EVUL (like it's an alternative universe or something).

 

[janior]

Should I tell her...?

 

[gurugeorge]

Come on. You have to be borderline retarded to aggro the entire goblin camp without noticing any of the HALF MILLION options for "pacific infiltration" the game offers.

Why would you do that, that's the problem. Did you read any of the last 10 pages? There are zero reasons to be peaceful with the goblins story-wise and mechanically. Again your point is meta gaming, "I see a lot of dialog choices of this type, the designers must have something stored" nice story structure Larian!

I didn't think of it that way, as soon as the True Soul business became evident, I realized that it might be possible to infiltrate, and I wanted to explore the goblin camp in peace to see what was what (especially with it becoming obvious they were being mind controlled - I might be able to overhear conversations, get intel about what was behind this Absolute business, etc.). After nosing around for a bit, I realized that at least one of them could be picked off probably without alerting the whole camp, and it turned out I was right. And so on and so forth. It all felt quite natural.

IOW, I was ready to go in all spells blazing, but as soon as the opportunity for infiltration came up, that seemed like the smarter thing to do.

 

[Desiderius]

how raiding the druids (aka the actual evil path split) will help you at all

There's more of then, and they are more likely to win. So just siding with the winning side. Not like the thieflings are offering any help to you. They are weaker, and less useful to you personally.
Druids sit it out, they lock themselves in their grove. They were offering help, but they also want the thieflings out anyways. Really, helping the thieflings isn't even neutral, its straight up a "good" coded decision. Its altruistic, you don't benefit from it.
The neutral decision would've been to wait for the druids to finish their ritual, wait for the thieflings to get on the road (and probably get massacred), and then negotiate passage into the Underdark or seek help from druids or whatever. But this isn't an option here, as far as I know.

No, that is meta knowledge and not pointed in the game dialog or quests on top

You feel forbidden to assume, or to think any thought not explicitly spelled out for you by the game "content"?

This actually is spelled out by the game, but I think its in Act II, when the guardian straight up says "its in our benefit to join and infiltrate the Absolute cult". Not sure if there's any such line in Act I. But also, its obvious.

Not like the thieflings are offering any help to you.

They offer you all their money, your own point for been "evil" aka greed just couple of posts ago. On top of promising to help you later in Baldur's Gate and if you have Karlach the blacksmith will upgrade her power. The cult doesn't offer you anything, everthing is assumed or meta knowledge. The game doesn't make a single hint that you can ally with the goblins (or any reason to do it) until you stumble randomly on Minthara and she talks to you as you know her. At that time you are encouraged by the game on two occasions to attack the bosses and she is the 3rd one(on top of been the main quest), not only in the journal, but ingame tadpole talking. You have to know thru meta gaming that you can ally with them so you either beeline to her and talk, skipping the shaman and the leader so you are not hostile when meeting Minthara. The whole area is terribly designed, placing dozens of quests that can turn all goblins hostile and you are going only by a random journal text that appears out of nowhere that you can raid the grove from where you had to assume you can ally with the cult e.g. another meta gaming.

One thing I will give credit is that you can on paper ignore all this shit and just go to underdark or mountain to do your thing. Ofc tons of problems come from that as quest chains get mixed up and NPCs dialog become fucked up talking to you as you did things you didn't or never even met them.

Saving Sazza vectors you directly to Minthara.

 

[Desiderius]

None of the paths works, as you can do whatever you want regardless of whether you are evil or not. It has absolutely no restrictions. Kill the grove and the harpers and Jaheria will still treat you fine. Kill the goblins and the leaders, and the Absolute doesn't give a toss. They will welcome you with open arms in spooky town. However, if you side with the goblins in Act 1, you gain nothing, while being good, you get tons of loot, you get to keep companions and you don't have to use zombie help to fill out a party. You also don't break any long quest chains. I find both paths very disappointing since there is no difference between them except that by playing "evil", you will lose out on stuff. This is meta-knowledge, I know, but with hindsight, we can see how it all plays out. And I know the argument for choice and consequences, which I agree with, but there is nothing here to miss out on if you play good, except Minthara which is a broken companion. There is a lack of any interesting balance here, much like the damn tadpole powers. You might look like a 72-year-old meth smoker after consuming brain worms like popcorn, but in the end you are miraculously cured. That system symbolizes the whole game to me.

I gave up on my evil playthrough since it was so boring. You don't gain any cool power, you don't get extra loot, and you only make it harder for yourself, which to me seems like the opposite of a self-serving evil guy. The only way to play a non-retarded evil guy is to pretend to be a good guy and pick good guy choices. But what fun is that, and to what end? You might just reload before the ending and pick option EVUL (like it's an alternative universe or something).

The Enlightenment doesn't consider evil a thing.

 

[BlackAdderBG]

Saving Sazza vectors you directly to Minthara.

If your character is "evil" or drow saving the goblin is a good/merciful deed and make no sense, there is special drow dialog to enjoy the goblin been killed. Another well designed Larian encounter.

 

[Black]

I thought if you save Minthara in a2 she comes clean- "I raided the grove cuz I got brainwashed, why did you do it?"
No wonder larians don't like her, she points out their shitty writing.

 

[Crichton]

I just completed Act II with my Gale the bard and his harem party; not as good as the first act but still lots of first-rate content.

Highs:
-Artwork; the tapestries and stained glass in Moonrise Towers are excellent and they're proper fantasy world-building, not just monkey-copies of the stuff we have in our world.
-Jaheira; she was not a favorite of mine in the originals but absence makes the heart grow fonder, it's good to see her again.
-Mechanics; I liked the unique mechanics for shadows and shadow-associated people; adds variety without being too cheap.
-Githyanki bounty hunters; that was a proper encounter.
-Being a Swords Bard; pick locks, pick pockets, pass all persuation checks, stab twice, grind up mooks with cloud of daggers, lots of mind-affecting spells and I finally hit level 10 for Magical Secrets (Fireball + Spiritual Weapon) (You're a wizard, CHARNAME!).

Lows:
-Writing; much less interesting branching in this act, everything's about the main quest and it seems like half the act is just Shadowheart's quest; it's her game and everyone else is just along for the ride. We'll see how the next act plays out, but I feel like the whole thing with the dead three and the Emperor is just too complicated and creates too many contradictions. Having the whole plot being about Myrkul trying to use the Elder brain to create a following and replacing the Emperor with some kind of shard of Bhaal trying to usurp the process would clean things up nicely. Similarly, I think this Nightsong character, that we're told fuck all about, is another pointless addition. Isobel being Kethric's daughter is cool; just stick with that and make their connection the source of his immortality so that it becomes difficult to kill him without harming her. Also, I understand why gameplay kind of compels the creation of giant enemy strongholds, but two big Selunite temples occupied by hordes of Abosolutist monsters just seems like lazy writing.

Codex's favorite topic: BG3 "romance"

Spoiler

Because of all the crazy shit I'd already read about how gay the game was, I've only recruited female companions and so far and it's clear even in that limited context, a setting to turn this shit off is needed.

Karlach: pretty much offers to fuck the PC immediately, but it's clear this will result in a bit of a roasted sausage situation, offers again after the 2nd engine upgrade, I gave it a go and honestly, it wasn't badly performed as these things run. I liked the blue flame effect.
Froggy: offers herself to the PC right after the big goblinoid genocide; makes no sense for the character; just 100% pandering.
Shadowheart: Shares one kiss with the PC and then gets a weeks-long headache despite her dialog greetings acting like the two are engaged. Despite slow-playing the PC, gets proper mad if he sleeps with Karlach.
Jaheira: thankfully we've been spared this so far, despite the pseudo-slavic accent, she doesn't have the cam-whore mentaility of the others.

I like the game overall, but it must be the gayest game yet made, even more gay than Wrath of the Righteous. And I've not yet gotten to the parts with Mindflayers sucking dicks or whatnot. Pray for Desiderius as he contemplates the absolute bag of dicks he'll have to suck to recruit all the Owlcat/Larian NPCs:

 

[Reinhardt]

how raiding the druids (aka the actual evil path split) will help you at all

There's more of then, and they are more likely to win. So just siding with the winning side. Not like the thieflings are offering any help to you. They are weaker, and less useful to you personally.
Druids sit it out, they lock themselves in their grove. They were offering help, but they also want the thieflings out anyways. Really, helping the thieflings isn't even neutral, its straight up a "good" coded decision. Its altruistic, you don't benefit from it.
The neutral decision would've been to wait for the druids to finish their ritual, wait for the thieflings to get on the road (and probably get massacred), and then negotiate passage into the Underdark or seek help from druids or whatever. But this isn't an option here, as far as I know.

No, that is meta knowledge and not pointed in the game dialog or quests on top

You feel forbidden to assume, or to think any thought not explicitly spelled out for you by the game "content"?

This actually is spelled out by the game, but I think its in Act II, when the guardian straight up says "its in our benefit to join and infiltrate the Absolute cult". Not sure if there's any such line in Act I. But also, its obvious.

Not like the thieflings are offering any help to you.

They offer you all their money, your own point for been "evil" aka greed just couple of posts ago. On top of promising to help you later in Baldur's Gate and if you have Karlach the blacksmith will upgrade her power. The cult doesn't offer you anything, everthing is assumed or meta knowledge. The game doesn't make a single hint that you can ally with the goblins (or any reason to do it) until you stumble randomly on Minthara and she talks to you as you know her. At that time you are encouraged by the game on two occasions to attack the bosses and she is the 3rd one(on top of been the main quest), not only in the journal, but ingame tadpole talking. You have to know thru meta gaming that you can ally with them so you either beeline to her and talk, skipping the shaman and the leader so you are not hostile when meeting Minthara. The whole area is terribly designed, placing dozens of quests that can turn all goblins hostile and you are going only by a random journal text that appears out of nowhere that you can raid the grove from where you had to assume you can ally with the cult e.g. another meta gaming.

One thing I will give credit is that you can on paper ignore all this shit and just go to underdark or mountain to do your thing. Ofc tons of problems come from that as quest chains get mixed up and NPCs dialog become fucked up talking to you as you did things you didn't or never even met them.

Saving Sazza vectors you directly to Minthara.

and why would someone save little loud and angry shaneekwa?

 

[Lovely Feather Pillow]

PS5 performance is dreadful

 

[VerSacrum]

I just completed Act II with my Gale the bard and his harem party; not as good as the first act but still lots of first-rate content.

Highs:
-Artwork; the tapestries and stained glass in Moonrise Towers are excellent and they're proper fantasy world-building, not just monkey-copies of the stuff we have in our world.

While the Moonrise tapestries are indeed nice, they are quite literally copies of millefleur tapestries from our world.
I much preferred the murals in the druid grove.

 

[Rhobar121]

PS5 performance is dreadful

I doubt if anyone expected anything else this generation is a failure.

 

[Lovely Feather Pillow]

PS5 performance is dreadful

I doubt if anyone expected anything else this generation is a failure.

Yep next gen consoles are a travesty. 45 second load times too.

 

[Mebrilia the Viera Queen]

Console be console