BG2 is overrated, not as good as BG1 and is not a top 10 CRPG

[Theldaran]

The genuine pen and paper Dungeons & Dragons experience has never been successfully transcribed into a cRPG, and never will be.

What about JRPG?

 

[JarlFrank]

BG1 is one of the most bland and boring RPGs ever made. BG2 is actually interesting.

It's not even a contest.

 

[Vulpes]

Yes, no and yes. I agree it's overrated but it definitely isn't worse than BG1. I'd say that they're on the same level. While BG2 was bigger in scope and took you to higher levels, BG1 simply had better writing and structure. I can't be the only one who found it annoying how the rest of the game gets locked off once you set sail for Spellhold right until you're close to finishing the main questline, right? I also concur that it isn't one of the top ten crpgs of all time. Heck, it's not even the best Bioware game. I'm more inclined to give that title to DA, KOTOR or maybe even ME

 

[Luckmann]

BG1 is better than BG2, but saying it's not worthy of Top 10 is fucking retarded.

Yes it is true. But the organized codex faggotry will call you retarded. Because in the codex dogma, you aren't supposed to have a different opinion than the circlejerk.

BG1 was better than BG2 in every way that mattered: Better exploration, better combat (due to no high level mage faggotry of 2nd edition dnd), better story, better art style (i hated the arabian pirate style of 2), better music. BG2 only improved the graphics, and had moar varied enemies and higher level lewt. it also had some cringe romances. That was it.

Even when I agree with you, you manage to be a fucking retard about it.

 

[Kyl Von Kull]

I have a strange relationship with this series. When the Baldur’s Gate games were new, I loved them more for their potential than anything else—here was a platform for D&D adventures where combat resolves quickly, everything takes place on the same screen, and they managed to do it without watering down the rules too badly. They even came up with a way to loosely approximate the feeling of having human operated party members. Baldur’s Gate was an excellent system—it felt like anything could be just around the corner (you could make a PS:T or an IWD), and that’s a great feeling.

But the games themselves? I liked the Baldur’s Gate series just fine. It had fun content and fun combat. However, on release, both games felt like eating cotton candy. If you binged on them—and I always binged—it left you feeling strangely unfulfilled. Outside of combat, the experience was shallow. Having played Fallout first, I understand why VD and Proverbius were so indignant in those old threads. Rather than integrating D20 mechanics all over the place like Fallout did for not-GURPS, BG gave you lots of combat, a good deal of story and plenty of paragon/renegade choices that didn’t have a ton of consequences. BG2 gave you even more story with a bit more C&C, mostly related to companion quests.

The BG games still felt like dungeon crawl cupcakes with a lot of extra narrative frosting on top. Now, that was plenty enjoyable for me, but it wasn’t what I truly craved from a CRPG in the age of Fallout, PS:T and Arcanum (which was already being hyped when BG2 came out and got released right after ToB). Compared to their contemporaries, there’s something hollow about the experience.

When I replayed the series around the time DA:O came out, I liked BG 1 & 2 A LOT more. After years of narratively bloated RPGs with terrible gameplay and stunted RPG mechanics, BG 1&2 felt like they had a lot more to offer—satisfying combat and meaningful character builds, oh my! In the context of the decline, these are great games. In the context of twenty years ago, I never would’ve imagined either Baldur’s Gate having a legitimate claim to a spot on any genre top ten list in 2018.

 

[Generic-Giant-Spider]

It must be said that I like Icewind Dale more than both BG games.

Atmosphere, bestiary, music, artwork, dungeon delving, creating your entire party from scratch and no chosen one narrative. Just you and your boys braving the Spine of the World. I also have a personal bias for winter settings.

 

[Deleted Member 16721]

Icewind Dale is a beautiful game. Very immersive. I loved the setting and the exploration as well as the character creation. Again, only played the EE with the extra kits but I did have to re-roll my first time through as Yxonomei (sp?) proved to be too tough for my terribly unoptimized party. Fun times, though. Played it on tablet (lol) in co-op with my old man. It's a very atmospheric game, even moreso than BG1. BG1 though is close to tied with IWD in terms of overall CRPG Fun Factor, but IWD might also have a slight edge. Depends on my mood.

 

[TemplarGR]

It must be said that I like Icewind Dale more than both BG games.

Atmosphere, bestiary, music, artwork, dungeon delving, creating your entire party from scratch and no chosen one narrative. Just you and your boys braving the Spine of the World. I also have a personal bias for winter settings.

Icewind dale was the crown jewel of the infinity engine games. Far better than Baldur's Gate 1 and 2, and Planescape. Extremely underrated.

The hillarious part is that it took criticism for not being more story-driven like BGs and PST, BUT, if you really think about it, it had a GREAT story with a deeper meaning, delivered in a great combination of serious+funny, exactly like the original Fallouts... That part with the phantom elves and dwarves, and how they continued their hatred, even though they were dead... Great stuff. Name me 10 games with a genuinely better story than Icewind Dale, released in the last decade...

 

[anvi]

BG1 is boring as fuck because you spend the whole game level 1 ish so combat is nothing more than everyone hitting everything with sticks. Then at the end game you get a magic missile. HURR!!! BG2 is a masterpiece, although the characters are annoying so playing it with your own party is better. IWD games are under rated. I probably wouldn't play any of these old games again though, I tried it recently and got bored.

 

[Lilura]

Icewind Dale ... Again, only played the EE with the extra kits

 

[A horse of course]

I'm going to critique that BG erotica rape comic:

First off, why are these orcs so talkative? You're forcing your will on someone, don't go on these big tangents while doing so. That just ruins the whole moment. More grunts, less Pillars of Eternity walls of text.

Secondly, Viconia would never cover up like that. She knows what she is and has it coming.

Thirdly, this is why Xzar > Edwin. Number of times Xzar has been assfucked by an orc: 0.

Overall, I will be masturbating to this tonight. Grade: C+

I think it's from the same patron who Extro did the Gnoll/Hobgoblin gangrapes for. As far as I can tell he just likes butts.

Spoiler

It's not me btw

 

[Generic-Giant-Spider]

Do you think guys that draw these porn things end up jerking off to them? Kind of like how a chef will taste their food to make sure it's finely made?

I think it's from the same patron who Extro did the Gnoll/Hobgoblin gangrapes for. As far as I can tell he just likes butts.

Please tell me the Hobgoblin gangrape had them all repeatedly saying "SPARE NO ONE" in each panel.

 

[A horse of course]

Do you think guys that draw these porn things end up jerking off to them? Kind of like how a chef will taste their food to make sure it's finely made?

I think it's from the same patron who Extro did the Gnoll/Hobgoblin gangrapes for. As far as I can tell he just likes butts.

Please tell me the Hobgoblin gangrape had them all repeatedly saying "SPARE NO ONE" in each panel.

I just checked and it was Ogres (though frankly they look more like Ogrillons to me) and Gnolls, not Hobgoblins. I apologize.

 

[laclongquan]

Icewind Dale series, both 1 and 2, got a bare backbone of a story. New threat loom over the Ten Towns. Mercenary defeat new threats. The end. No worthy story at all.

I love IWD1/2. I truly do. As tactical RPG they are great.

But not story. I dont require story from them. I dont need story from them. And I laugh straight at anyone's face for saying their stories are great. IF there's an absolutely must, then the Dream Song story at the Lake, IWD1's Easthaven, is the best in both game.

Bitches you need to read more. Have some taste.

 

[TemplarGR]

Icewind Dale series, both 1 and 2, got a bare backbone of a story. New threat loom over the Ten Towns. Mercenary defeat new threats. The end. No worthy story at all.

I love IWD1/2. I truly do. As tactical RPG they are great.

But not story. I dont require story from them. I dont need story from them. And I laugh straight at anyone's face for saying their stories are great. IF there's an absolutely must, then the Dream Song story at the Lake, IWD1's Easthaven, is the best in both game.

Bitches you need to read more. Have some taste.

I laugh at any idiot who claims Icewind Dales didn't have a good story.

I know most of you are just hipster faggots, but the "barebones story" nitpick you apply to IDW can be applied to ANYTHING: "zombie wakes up in morgue, zombie goes to fetch quest after fetch quest to discover someone who knows about his identity, zombie finally learns his identity and dies in peace". Yup that is Planescape Torment...

See? You can make any story look barebones and shit if you simplify it like that.

Now go bang your head to the wall or something, like autists do.

 

[laclongquan]

Icewind Dale series, both 1 and 2, got a bare backbone of a story. New threat loom over the Ten Towns. Mercenary defeat new threats. The end. No worthy story at all.

I love IWD1/2. I truly do. As tactical RPG they are great.

But not story. I dont require story from them. I dont need story from them. And I laugh straight at anyone's face for saying their stories are great. IF there's an absolutely must, then the Dream Song story at the Lake, IWD1's Easthaven, is the best in both game.

Bitches you need to read more. Have some taste.

I laugh at any moronic retard who claims Icewind Dales didn't have a good story.

I know most of you are just hipster faggots, but the "barebones story" nitpick you apply to IDW can be applied to ANYTHING: "zombie wakes up in morgue, zombie goes to fetch quest after fetch quest to discover someone who knows about his identity, zombie finally learns his identity and dies in peace". Yup that is Planescape Torment...

See you retard? You can make any story look barebones and shit if you simplify it like that.

Now go bang your head to the wall or something, like autists do.

You are a retard who like Bethesda level stories. Nough said~ The tags are entirely correct.
I wont mention the intricacies of PST since it would derail the discussion and go over your head anyway.

 

[TemplarGR]

You are a retard who like Bethesda level stories. Nough said~ The tags are entirely correct.
I wont mention the intricacies of PST since it would derail the discussion and go over your head anyway.

I don't play Bethesda games for the story you butthurt edgelord...

BTW Planescape story is nothing special. It is extremely overrated, as is this entire POS game that only sold like 100k copies (original + EE editions) and faggots like to pretend it is some deep shit while it is just a retarded visual novel for 12 year olds.

I PROVED in my previous post that if you really want to simplify a story, it is very easy to make any classic look like complete shit. You have no reply to that other than strawmaning (saying i like Bethesda stories, something i never claimed)...

Keep embarassing yourself...

 

[Lilura]

IF there's an absolutely must, then the Dream Song story at the Lake, IWD1's Easthaven, is the best in both game.

Debateable. For example, Mother Egenia's story stretches over both campaigns. The Iselore and Egenia-spirit dialogue is pretty deep, with three instances of reactivity. Both quests are poetic, but Egenia's story is arguably more emotive than Jhonen's.

Also, Everard's dialogues about Jerrod's Stone were pretty good:

Prologue:

Note the error, though: it should be "Let me say this of sacrifice" ...

Finale:

 

[hell bovine]

Icewind Dale is a beautiful game. Very immersive. I loved the setting and the exploration as well as the character creation. Again, only played the EE with the extra kits but I did have to re-roll my first time through as Yxonomei (sp?) proved to be too tough for my terribly unoptimized party. Fun times, though. Played it on tablet (lol) in co-op with my old man. It's a very atmospheric game, even moreso than BG1. BG1 though is close to tied with IWD in terms of overall CRPG Fun Factor, but IWD might also have a slight edge. Depends on my mood.

I've enjoyed them both, but: IWD EE does not play like IWD. IWD EE is actually far closer to BG2 in gameplay; it loses - in comparison to IWD - that frozen north adventure feeling, where everything is scarce and magic is rare.

 

[HeatEXTEND]

BTW Planescape story is nothing special.

I know right? We're positively drowning in games that let you play as an immortal beefjerky whose undeath is used as a gameplay mechanic.

Spoiler

say it

Spoiler

say it retard

Spoiler

say Dark Souls

 

[Outlander]

I don't know which one is 'better', but I enjoyed BG1 more over BG2 the same way I enjoyed F1 more over F2.

 

[Morality Games]

You think you are hot shit because you killed a red dragon?

Brother, I think I'm the HOTTEST shit because I just ended a red dragon, went down to kill some edgy faggoty "Shade Lord" and his bitch ass SHADOW DRAGON while simultaneously ending his sex cult, and I still have time to solve a murder mystery involving a tanner before dinner. I'm the fucking biggest dick you've ever seen walk into the Copper Coronet and you best remember this strut because it's gonna be going down into the Underdark in a few hours to kill the African elves, pit demons and silver dragons by the dozens. Then if I'm not too thirsty I'll go and smack down some pussy vampires.

If you want to apologize to me, just follow the trail of dead mindflayers and beholders I leave behind. In BG2 I am a God, son.

Even if true, this doesn't make you more than a tier 1 special forces operative in a world with thousands of special forces operatives, of which you might be in the top 100. Shadow Thieves of Amn are Mossad or the CIA.

 

[aweigh]

I find that people who classify RPGs by the "amount of story" they have are usually people who play games incorrectly. It is perfectly acceptable to think IWD has a better story than BG; the amount of dialogs or characters or whatever other arbitrary criteria these people ascribe to the telling of a story does not factor into its quality.

You can tell a story using one character inside one room, or inside nowhere at all, and it can be filled with dialog or have no dialog, and its quality won't be produced from these but rather by its execution and other factors of conveyance and impression. For example: BG1 has "less story" than BG2, I think that's pretty clear, and I also think most here prefer BG1 specifically because it has a better-executed story that serves its game play.

 

[anvi]

All game stories are terrible.

 

[Deleted Member 16721]

I miss the large open maps from BG1, even in Kingmaker. The player does not need to be funneled to content every other step, nor do maps need to only be as big relative to the amount of stuff on them. In a sense they do, but exploring in BG1 is fun because it's relaxed and you aren't sure what's around each corner, but a lot of times you're traveling in wilderness. I want an iso CRPG that brings that back. We don't need quests every 100 feet, but a few enemy encounters and dipping into the bestiary on a large map is just fine. Maybe a tattered journal to find and some environmental storytelling, etc.. Give us a chance to relax and get lost traveling a bit, drink a brewski or hot cocoa and enjoy the large scale journey more. I do love Kingmaker but I wish it had some larger maps, although it has so many small ones it all adds up to a ton of content and combat encounters anyway.