CD Projekt's Cyberpunk 2077 Update 2.0 + Phantom Liberty Expansion Thread

[Terenty]

It is a dystopian setting, not a heroic fantasy.

When i was mowing down hundreds of corpo super soldiers without breaking a sweat i felt pretty heroic

 

[orcinator]

On a related note, there's a cool mod for Skyrim that turns the mouse-wheel into an analogue of the analogue stick - i.e. as you move the mouse wheel forward the character speeds up to a run. Very nice, I wish more games would do that, because the analogue stick is one of the best things about controllers, and the mouse wheel is the best analogue for it in a m/k setup.

I think they got it from Star Citizen. In that game they use mouse wheel for multiple things and one of them is to regulate how fast your character is moving. Yeah it is pretty neat for adjusting character speed.

Splinted Cell did it way back in the 00's. It let you adjust your speed in relation to the noise level around you.

 

[moon knight]

When i was mowing down hundreds of corpo super soldiers without breaking a sweat i felt pretty heroic

There's nothing heoric in killing innocent workers who were just doing their jobs

 

[Yoomazir]

So I'm on my way to do all the ending and I did notice something, all of them mention the "6 months lifespan". And I'm calling it right here, right now: first expansion is in 6 months from now.

 

[gurugeorge]

I was feeling completely disconnected because it was Johnny's show and I was just a schmuck on the wrong place at the wrong time.

Which is the entire point choom. You are supposed to feel helpless and thrashing against your inevitable demise. It is a dystopian setting, not a heroic fantasy.

Yeesh, I dunno, you could still have a dystopian setting with some very flat endings and it not be fundamentally Johnny's show, which it kinda is.

I think the consensus reached a while back up-thread is that when they got Keanu in, instead of just letting him have a few cool cameos (which I don't think people would have expected much more than that), they decided to weave him into the story in a big way. That in itself may be a big part of the reason for the unfinished state of the game.

One gets the impression that despite the problems (e.g. developers leaving in 2016/2017) they were pretty much on-track to finish something that was more of an RPG, but then when Keanu came in they ended up making another Geralt story, except you're not even Geralt

 

[Quillon]

btw. you guys noticed the quest names being song names? imitating the GOAT RPG again

 

[Agame]

they ended up making another Geralt story, except you're not even Geralt

This is such a godawful idea when you boil it down to that sentence, it stinks of upper management chicanery. No creative in their right mind would think that sounds like a great concept for a game story.

 

[Zer0wing]

I was feeling completely disconnected because it was Johnny's show and I was just a schmuck on the wrong place at the wrong time.

Which is the entire point choom. You are supposed to feel helpless and thrashing against your inevitable demise. It is a dystopian setting, not a heroic fantasy.

I find this dystopian plot with inevitable player character's death shallow and forced compared to a certain rpg called Fallout 1.5: Resurrection where main protagonist is also dying offscreen. His motivation is clear and understandable and stakes are set. And he can actually give an impact on the world around him. Be that legend. Vincent, on the other hand, doesn't.

One gets the impression that despite the problems (e.g. developers leaving in 2016/2017) they were pretty much on-track to finish something that was more of an RPG, but then when Keanu came in they ended up making another Geralt story, except you're not even Geralt

After the soft reboot mid-2018 that enbiggens the role of Johnny Silverhand and throws the work on first 10-15 hours of "rags to riches" plot straight into recycle bin so it would not be possible to restore it, workers just gave up on Cyberpunk 2077 and were there just for wage and possible bonuses.

 

[DalekFlay]

I think the consensus reached a while back up-thread is that when they got Keanu in, instead of just letting him have a few cool cameos (which I don't think people would have expected much more than that), they decided to weave him into the story in a big way. That in itself may be a big part of the reason for the unfinished state of the game.

I don't really get the unfinished claim when it comes to gameplay. Obviously I get it about the tech, on console especially (I've had no real issues on PC), but the gameplay depth and structure seems very standard for this kind of game in today's "AAA" mainstream space.

 

[TheHeroOfTime]

Only on codex:

- I finished VTMB at launch best game ever 10/10
- Arcanum is my favorite game ever 10/10
- Nev Vegas grew on me 10/10
- Cyberpunk is buggy mess !

Reminds me how varying that quest chain could end in NV + you can just nuke'em, where in CP77 it ends in one way. NV proves itself to be GOAT once again

Except that part about it being one way is not true.

Like i said before CDPR doesn't do C&C like other games. They don't give you HERE IS AN IMPORTANT CHOICE TO MAKE. SO you have ABCD and each will give you different thing.

They give you a lot of those 1-2 options who are mostly illusory and hide in them real choices so you don't know which one of those is real so you are forced to pick the ones according to what kind of character you play. Some are more obvious than other though.

And then there is Consequences part which happen usually after a long while not imminently. So the "one way" talk about something 5 hours before could have been actually a choice and even reloading it 50 times to check every dialogie option would lead you to idea that it was not choice at all.

The thing with games like Bloodlines or New vegas is that their virtues are so strong that overshadow their flaws. Cyberpunk 2077 has good story, characters and setting. But as an action RPG and open world game it has a lot of room for improvement. It will gain some following with time, that's for sure, but I doubt it will get the same cult classic recognition that those games.

 

[DeepOcean]

I was feeling completely disconnected because it was Johnny's show and I was just a schmuck on the wrong place at the wrong time.

Which is the entire point choom. You are supposed to feel helpless and thrashing against your inevitable demise. It is a dystopian setting, not a heroic fantasy.

I'm not against my character dying or the feeling of helpless but I really dont like the way they did it, if they were going with it, if it is to be a schmuck, at least I would be one on my own terms than be a secondary character for Keanu Reeves.

Besides, they have scenes where Keanu Reeves blows up half of Arasaka security alone with his revolver then I'm supposedly to believe this is a realistic dystopic setting where I'm going to die as a schmuck because corpos are that powerful and I cant really do anything about it?

 

[Mitleser2020]

Edit: It's game logic, anyway. The corporations have stations in space and on the moon. To think that a group of desert dwellers could get away with a scheme like that without being found out breaks my suspension of disbelief. In principle, Cyberpunk shows its age here. While the topic is corporate control, the topic isn't really thought through to the bitter end. On the other hand, that's what makes up its nostalgic charm.

Keep in mind that at this point Arasaka is led by someone who wants to destroy this corp. Him letting such people who caused so much damage to Arasaka get away makes sense.
And in the original RPG, the (first) raid on Arasaka's HQ in NC was done by a group backed by Arasaka's main rival, Militech.

 

[Agame]

The thing with games like Bloodlines or New vegas is that their virtues are so strong that overshadow their flaws. Cyberpunk 2077 has good story, characters and setting. But as an action RPG and open world game it has a lot of room for improvement. It will gain some following with time, that's for sure, but I doubt it will get the same cult classic recognition that those games.

The thing that will kill it long term is replayability. There is plenty of 'ooh and aah' stuff going on when you do your first run, exploring city and cruising around is great and the graphics and ambiance can hide the lack of actual activities and gameplay in the open world.

But: Number 1, story is so on rails and C&C so lacking when you start over. I tried to start a new game to do a netrunner build, gave up half way through prologue cos already I was feeling fatigue at scripted unskippable sequences.

Number 2, the character development from school of Bethesda 'you can do everything because your AMAAAAAAZING' is a disastrous design decision for replayability. I focused on body and related skills, but I can use any weapon in the game very successfully in combat with no investment of perks. And I have enough backlog of stat and perk points I could easily have made a decent netrunner side build on this character. I mean what the actual fuck were they thinking with the character system?

Number 3, if you put aside story/side missions on rails so do not create enthusiasm for a replay what are we left with? A 'YUGE' open world right? Problem is it is filled with the the most basic bitch UbiCry 'bandit outpost' filler trash. Very quickly this becomes boring and tedious as you dash from 2 minute shootout to 2 minute shootout, maybe read the 2 emails placed at every location? Yea not thrilling content guys. Even Bethesda games have more interesting exploration than this.

Clearly none of the above are going to change after release now, we can get bugfixing and polishing, and probably more story DLC that will be one and done. The ONLY hope for this game to have major longetivity is modding. And that requires CDPR to do like Bethesda and open flood gates for modders to do complete overhauls and suchlike.

Otherwise Cyberpunk Online will completely eclipse this game for the masses, and it will be forgotten as some kind of intro/tech demo for Online version. (That is unless Cyberpunk Online release is a Fallout 76 level of disaster... And at this stage who knows?)

 

[gurugeorge]

The thing with games like Bloodlines or New vegas is that their virtues are so strong that overshadow their flaws. Cyberpunk 2077 has good story, characters and setting. But as an action RPG and open world game it has a lot of room for improvement. It will gain some following with time, that's for sure, but I doubt it will get the same cult classic recognition that those games.

The thing that will kill it long term is replayability. There is plenty of 'ooh and aah' stuff going on when you do your first run, exploring city and cruising around is great and the graphics and ambiance can hide the lack of actual activities and gameplay in the open world.

But: Number 1, story is so on rails and C&C so lacking when you start over. I tried to start a new game to do a netrunner build, gave up half way through prologue cos already I was feeling fatigue at scripted unskippable sequences.

Number 2, the character development from school of Bethesda 'you can do everything because your AMAAAAAAZING' is a disastrous design decision for replayability. I focused on body and related skills, but I can use any weapon in the game very successfully in combat with no investment of perks. And I have enough backlog of stat and perk points I could easily have made a decent netrunner side build on this character. I mean what the actual fuck were they thinking with the character system?

Number 3, if you put aside story/side missions on rails so do not create enthusiasm for a replay what are we left with? A 'YUGE' open world right? Problem is it is filled with the the most basic bitch UbiCry 'bandit outpost' filler trash. Very quickly this becomes boring and tedious as you dash from 2 minute shootout to 2 minute shootout, maybe read the 2 emails placed at every location? Yea not thrilling content guys. Even Bethesda games have more interesting exploration than this.

Clearly none of the above are going to change after release now, we can get bugfixing and polishing, and probably more story DLC that will be one and done. The ONLY hope for this game to have major longetivity is modding. And that requires CDPR to do like Bethesda and open flood gates for modders to do complete overhauls and suchlike.

Otherwise Cyberpunk Online will completely eclipse this game for the masses, and it will be forgotten as some kind of intro/tech demo for Online version. (That is unless Cyberpunk Online release is a Fallout 76 level of disaster... And at this stage who knows?)

Agree with much of this, but I partly disagree with the build system being "You can do anything."

Well, it is that, but only because the enemies are too weak, even on Very Hard, even by the end of the game. For example, if you do a Netrunner build that focuses on 20 into Int (both branches) and 20 into Cool (cold blood), you can get a truly spectacular, all-destroying mage build that insta-melts everything with crit-based Contagion, with other spells to spare and tidy up. Same if you focus on Sniper+cold blood.

Those are heights of power that you definitely can't get by building an unfocussed hybrid.

But the problem is there are no circumstances in the game where you really need that level of power and build focus, and you can actually finish the game with any old hybrid.

 

[Agame]

Agree with much of this, but I partly disagree with the build system being "You can do anything."

But the problem is there are no circumstances in the game where you really need that level of power and build focus, and you can actually finish the game with any old hybrid.

Sure, but this problem is baked into the game at the moment. In theory CDPR could balance things to make it harder to 'jack-of-all-trade', or maybe Modders will be able to do big overhaul.

Doesnt fix the other problems with story/open world.

More and more I think they fucked what could have been a great classic game, its sad really.

 

[alyvain]

Did you guys realize that all the troubles in the story are caused by rich asians and poor blacks?

 

[gurugeorge]

Agree with much of this, but I partly disagree with the build system being "You can do anything."

But the problem is there are no circumstances in the game where you really need that level of power and build focus, and you can actually finish the game with any old hybrid.

Sure, but this problem is baked into the game at the moment. In theory CDPR could balance things to make it harder to 'jack-of-all-trade', or maybe Modders will be able to do big overhaul.

Doesnt fix the other problems with story/open world.

More and more I think they fucked what could have been a great classic game, its sad really.

Yep, that's the tragedy.

 

[Origin]

I just realized cops can't chase you with police cars. What the fuck

 

[DeepOcean]

I think the consensus reached a while back up-thread is that when they got Keanu in, instead of just letting him have a few cool cameos (which I don't think people would have expected much more than that), they decided to weave him into the story in a big way. That in itself may be a big part of the reason for the unfinished state of the game.

I don't really get the unfinished claim when it comes to gameplay. Obviously I get it about the tech, on console especially (I've had no real issues on PC), but the gameplay depth and structure seems very standard for this kind of game in today's "AAA" mainstream space.

The GTA part is busted and unfinished, no doubt.

 

[Zer0wing]

Besides, they have scenes where Keanu Reeves blows up half of Arasaka security alone with his revolver then I'm supposedly to believe this is a realistic dystopic setting

You're not, CDPR just bullshitting us with historical revisionism. The main metaplot from pnp is conflict between Arasaka and Militech. Johnny was part of one strike team led by another legenday figure, Morgan Blackhand, who is absent from flashbacks. Silverdick was a pawn in hands of one side of the conflict, not a revolutionary figure. In cp2077, Militech is not in the focus of the plot.

 

[DeepOcean]

Besides, they have scenes where Keanu Reeves blows up half of Arasaka security alone with his revolver then I'm supposedly to believe this is a realistic dystopic setting

You're not, CDPR just bullshitting us with historical revisionism. The main metaplot from pnp is conflict between Arasaka and Militech. Johnny was part of one strike team led by another legenday figure, Morgan Blackhand, who is absent from flashbacks. In cp2077, Militech is not in the focus of the plot.

Man, those flashbacks with Johnny are so fucking dumb. Yeah, sure, you just got pissed, got a few dudes and just raided the Arasaka Tower by doing pew pew on a few shooting galleries... I'm aware of the version of events from the pnp what makes the way they decided to depict the whole thing on the game even more retarded.

 

[Quillon]

Besides, they have scenes where Keanu Reeves blows up half of Arasaka security alone with his revolver then I'm supposedly to believe this is a realistic dystopic setting

You're not, CDPR just bullshitting us with historical revisionism. The main metaplot from pnp is conflict between Arasaka and Militech. Johnny was part of one strike team led by another legenday figure, Morgan Blackhand, who is absent from flashbacks. Silverdick was a pawn in hands of one side of the conflict, not a revolutionary figure. In cp2077, Militech is not in the focus of the plot.

damn I'd be angry if I was familiar with the lore

They basically folded Johnny and Morgan together into one character. Like, the nuke the tower sequence? That was Morgan's op, not Johnny's. The bomb? That was Morgan's team, Johnny didn't even know about it (and this is a point which cuts across a greater part of the lore and history of Night City which is sort of brushed over in the game). The rivalry with Smasher? Was completely a Morgan thing, Smasher didn't give two shits about Johnny.

altho

Spoiler

Alt did say Johnny's memories aren't accurate, could CDPR use that if they decide to introduce Morgan B etc?

 

[True Ukrainian]

Besides, they have scenes where Keanu Reeves blows up half of Arasaka security alone with his revolver then I'm supposedly to believe this is a realistic dystopic setting

You're not, CDPR just bullshitting us with historical revisionism. The main metaplot from pnp is conflict between Arasaka and Militech. Johnny was part of one strike team led by another legenday figure, Morgan Blackhand, who is absent from flashbacks. Silverdick was a pawn in hands of one side of the conflict, not a revolutionary figure. In cp2077, Militech is not in the focus of the plot.

Another missed opportunity. They could have made Johnny deliberately lying to the player by hyping up his minor part in the raid. Or Johnny being delusional about events. That would have made the presence of V's imaginary BFF more sinister and granted some agency to the player to carry out their own investigation.

 

[alyvain]

There is a line by

Spoiler

Alt

, which states that Johnny remembers it all wrong, because he is a sad mad fuck, who spent fifty years in some metaphorical prison.

She didn't mention the fact that the shard is damaged, but I do.

Still seems like an afterthought, I know, but I wouldn't completely dismiss it.

 

[Agame]

There is a line by

Spoiler

Alt

, which states that Johnny remembers it all wrong, because he is a sad mad fuck, who spent fifty years in some metaphorical prison.

She didn't mention the fact that the shard is damaged, but I do.

Still seems like an afterthought, I know, but I wouldn't completely dismiss it.

Yea they really should have leaned into the 'unreliable narrator' thing, would have made it all more interesting. But it is also becoming a tired trope in our age of postmodern storytelling so meh...