Jagged Alliance 3 from Haemimont Games

[ArchAngel]

So is this game actually good?

Good tactical game? Yes.

Good Jagged Alliance game? Opinions are all over the place.

Do you mean it's another XCOM clone?

I'ts more similar to Wasteland, but better

let's recap.

- You have something similar to XCOM pod activation mechanic, but not really. It's not POD, it's per individual, all enemies who see action will react. Unless you initiated combat with agressive action, they tend to seek cover on first round, but it's wildly inconsistent, I encountered both shooting and stabbing when they supposed to run for cover. I don't have enough data of why this happens. If you initiate combat yourself, all your shoot/overwatch guys will have their AP spent
- You DO NOT have double action of XCOM. I'ts AP, just like in JA2/Wasteland. I wish they inflated AP number, like 1.13, for granularity, but we get what we get. I think they tried to copy JA2 instead of 1.13, which is questionable decision, but whatever. AP depends on same stats and expended with different speed depending on stance, just like JA.
- Despite couple retards here insist that game have binary hit/miss system like nuXCOM, it's properly simulates bullet physics. You will get stray hits, you will get wall penetration, floor destructions with fall damage and hits to different (from which you intended) body parts. Game literally have free aim mode (which you should use for better shotgun cones) if you dislike XCOM-like selection of targets. Once you get your first MG, any doubts about that will dissipate. Pretty much like JA2 minus bullet drop (which many people disable in 1.13 anyways)
- The cover system, it's basically visual. You see that pile of rubble? You see it red-broken-shield when you stay, it becomes half-shield when you crouch and full cover when you prone. Bad news it's not gonna provide any cover the steeper the angle from enemy to that cover. Not like nuXCOM, where full cover is full cover., unless you perfectly 90+ degrees flank it. Not to mention, that you don't see shit and can't shoot directly through that cover, so expect crouch/prone hopping. General advice - don't rely on UI cover representation at all - if it looks shabby or questionable it's indeed shabby and questionable.
- Overwatch system. Very similar to XCOM, but it's cone (unless you have merc with 360 degree), be careful with setup, because your merc can leave cover to set it up.

I think you getting so much feedback about it being close to nuXCOM than to JA2 because a) people are generally morons b) they don't play both games like I do regularly (and I play openXCOM too a lot). This game is infinitely closer to JA2 than to XCOM, not even close, even if it's need a lot of fixing.

I have still not see this miss one body part, hit another and I have also spent hours watching people playing it. Also didn't devs themselves confirm that if you miss one body part you will not hit another.
Also this is all beat by using hit chance mod that clearly shows that things like darkeness, cover and other shit gives -20 or -10 or -XX to your hit chances. It is not hard for PC game to say if cover gives -20% penalty and you miss by that 20% game fires your bullet towards that cover to make it seem more realistic.

 

[bobocrunch]

They didn't do the missed shots hitting other limbs because of people being confused in some interview

Literally everything in games is computer calculations, the point is that the guns aren't just stat lasers that either do damage or not but an actual thing that spews bullets (can see in my video the AA12 breaking the railing and floor) that can break shit or hit the wrong target

 

[Strange Fellow]

Do I really need to kill all the commies in Pentagruel to take control of the mine?

Not that that's a problem.

No, you'll get to 50 loyalty just by fighting the Legion, then you can do 1 or 2 quests (preferably including distributing this work of propaganda).

And the commie leader will realize that the revolution betrayed its own ideas and will step down giving you the mine.

So it's another quest, just like Landsbach. Disappointing. I'm not convinced the huge increase in quests actually works to the game's benefit. Starting to really feel the fatigue from running to and fro and clicking clicking clicking outside of combat. I might just kill them all anyway.

 

[ArchAngel]

They didn't do the missed shots hitting other limbs because of people being confused in some interview

Literally everything in games is computer calculations, the point is that the guns aren't just stat lasers that either do damage or not but an actual thing that spews bullets (can see in my video the AA12 breaking the railing and floor) that can break shit or hit the wrong target

They did the same in nuXcoms as well. This game only added penetration and missing shots able to hit other targets which is better than nuXcom but still not full projectile simulation. And it can be easily proved if you can miss shots from standing next to enemy.

 

[randir14]

The game is soulful with a shitton of reactivity to your choices both big and minor.

That's one of my favorite things about it, and how each merc has their own personality that causes them to react differently to whatever's happening. For example Raider has the highest leadership stat in the roster, and it's reflected in the way he encourages your team and boosts them up.

 

[Tuco Benedicto Pacifico]

This is honestly a game changer:

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3005944929

 

[Cyberarmy]

Welp, lost 2 mercs to a grenade and 2 others to lucky hits from burst fire. Commando Iron man don't allow fuck ups.

 

[Abu Antar]

This is honestly a game changer:

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3005944929

Cool, I will restart, and try this.

 

[Beowulf]

The game is soulful with a shitton of reactivity to your choices both big and minor.

That's one of my favorite things about it, and how each merc has their own personality that causes them to react differently to whatever's happening. For example Raider has the highest leadership stat in the roster, and it's reflected in the way he encourages your team and boosts them up.

Agreed. The game world shows a surprising amount of reactivity - there are voice-lines for major choices (sparing or killing Pierre, helping communists, killing slave master or the prison warden etc), but also for those smaller quests.
Once I distributed those revolutionary pamphlets (which is totally optional and not necessary to progress the game, not even necessary to have 100% loyalty in Pantagruel, I believe), I'm seeing different people asking about them in other parts of the country:

 

[Grampy_Bone]

I got sucked in last night until 1am which is always a good sign. All the combat grannies died to the last, but took out half the attack force in return, and I got to loot their guns. Win-win.

On Commando difficulty, I was able to preserve the lives of all but one. Rude Trudy just starts too isolated to rescue in time.
To be fair I save scummed after seeing where the town defenses were actually deployed (in my mind we were able to coordinate after I basically sat there waiting for 3 days).

And yeah I already have 15 hours in the game over 2 days played, while still trying to do normal weekend things. It's different, which we all knew it would be, but it goddamn sure scratches the itch.

I think I went to Cacao too early, first place I stopped after the starter island. It looked like the least well guarded mine and easiest to defend.

I took the prison nearby and it was intense. I'm assuming someone will give you the quest to go there so I'm testing the limits of sequence breaking. I had Fox sneak around and shoot most of the isolated guards in the back to avoid a battle, the guards were tougher and much better equipped that other enemies so far. It's funny how stealth kills work, Fox had a better chance to instakill from shooting and enemy in the foot than Omryn with head hots because she has 100 dex.

After clearing the outside guards I snuck into the lower level, cleared about half the guys with stealth including the warden, who actually dropped his Steyr Aug, unlike all the snipers with their mysterious vanishing Drugonovs outside. After clearing the inside I freed some dude who had 5 prisoners join me to finish the battle outside, then left to go to some other town to kill a guy I hadn't met yet. Well I hope there's no consequences for that decision!

When I went back outside the AI seemed to break. I ambushed the prison chief Jackhammer in his office, who sadly did not drop his auto shotty. But the 5 helpers just sat there in the yard and did nothing, and the remaining guards in the barracks didn't react either. Probably some scripting error. Then I had to go to bed because it was waaay too late.

 

[Ghulgothas]

Be sure to have some lockpicks/crowbars with you when you go to the prison basement, you can bust some prisoners out for minor loyalty gains/losses for all towns on the map depending on who you spring.

 

[Jrpgfan]

Decided to give it a try and it's not as bad as I thought it would be based on Codex Popular Opinion™.

However, the writing is awfully bad. The humor seems to be aimed at 10yos. Beats me why they thought it would be a good idea to insert chidilsh humor in a game with a mostly adult playerbase. And it's not even the "good" childish humor, some(most) of them is so retarded and badly written that I doubt even the 12yo me would have laughed. I wouldn't be surprised at all if it was done by one of those so called "professional" writers praised by the likes of Fargo and Inxile devs(like that Samantha chick or whatever the fuck was her name).

This kind of writing makes me even more glad indie devs with "amateur" writers(like Vault Dweller, Styg and sser) exist.

 

[gogis]

So is this game actually good?

Good tactical game? Yes.

Good Jagged Alliance game? Opinions are all over the place.

Do you mean it's another XCOM clone?

I'ts more similar to Wasteland, but better

let's recap.

- You have something similar to XCOM pod activation mechanic, but not really. It's not POD, it's per individual, all enemies who see action will react. Unless you initiated combat with agressive action, they tend to seek cover on first round, but it's wildly inconsistent, I encountered both shooting and stabbing when they supposed to run for cover. I don't have enough data of why this happens. If you initiate combat yourself, all your shoot/overwatch guys will have their AP spent
- You DO NOT have double action of XCOM. I'ts AP, just like in JA2/Wasteland. I wish they inflated AP number, like 1.13, for granularity, but we get what we get. I think they tried to copy JA2 instead of 1.13, which is questionable decision, but whatever. AP depends on same stats and expended with different speed depending on stance, just like JA.
- Despite couple retards here insist that game have binary hit/miss system like nuXCOM, it's properly simulates bullet physics. You will get stray hits, you will get wall penetration, floor destructions with fall damage and hits to different (from which you intended) body parts. Game literally have free aim mode (which you should use for better shotgun cones) if you dislike XCOM-like selection of targets. Once you get your first MG, any doubts about that will dissipate. Pretty much like JA2 minus bullet drop (which many people disable in 1.13 anyways)
- The cover system, it's basically visual. You see that pile of rubble? You see it red-broken-shield when you stay, it becomes half-shield when you crouch and full cover when you prone. Bad news it's not gonna provide any cover the steeper the angle from enemy to that cover. Not like nuXCOM, where full cover is full cover., unless you perfectly 90+ degrees flank it. Not to mention, that you don't see shit and can't shoot directly through that cover, so expect crouch/prone hopping. General advice - don't rely on UI cover representation at all - if it looks shabby or questionable it's indeed shabby and questionable.
- Overwatch system. Very similar to XCOM, but it's cone (unless you have merc with 360 degree), be careful with setup, because your merc can leave cover to set it up.

I think you getting so much feedback about it being close to nuXCOM than to JA2 because a) people are generally morons b) they don't play both games like I do regularly (and I play openXCOM too a lot). This game is infinitely closer to JA2 than to XCOM, not even close, even if it's need a lot of fixing.

I have still not see this miss one body part, hit another and I have also spent hours watching people playing it. Also didn't devs themselves confirm that if you miss one body part you will not hit another.
Also this is all beat by using hit chance mod that clearly shows that things like darkeness, cover and other shit gives -20 or -10 or -XX to your hit chances. It is not hard for PC game to say if cover gives -20% penalty and you miss by that 20% game fires your bullet towards that cover to make it seem more realistic.

I had 2 cases when I had friendly fire which was avoidable by selecting headshot (the usual situation when you shoot crouched right behind your prone ally) and still hitting my teammate. Also I had occasion of MD dropping a guy (with a perk) when I clearly selected body shot, not leg shot.

I already covered in this thread, that the fact that any game could show you percentage with all modifiers, despite fully simulating bullet physics, is not hard to do (you juxtapose easily calculated cone for distance vs size of the target) OpenXCOM does exactly that. It's literally means nothing. Usually this system ignores everything on the path of bullet, so percentage would lie.

Like I had occasion in mob boss mansion battle, where I placed my MG guy near guardhouse left of the gate and he literally couldn't hit shit for 3 rounds, both overwatch and long burst. After investigation I found he was hitting the impregnable rock patch in the grass in front of him. And I never saw "rock patch in front of you" modifier in my modifiers. After redoing this battle several times (it's super hard) he was routinely downing 2-3 people a turn (it's super packed with enemies), never completely missing a shot

 

[Black]

It's set ~20 years after JA2 but many mercs look the same or younger than they did in JA2.

 

[Silva]

Shit, this must be the hottest thread in the Codex right now.

P.S: kneel down octavius and Storyfag to Jagged Alliance 3, the true king of the Codex (Baldurs Gate 3 will be shit).

 

[Storyfag]

P.S: kneel down octavius and Storyfag to Jagged Alliance 3, the true king of the Codex (Baldurs Gate 3 will be shit).

Why do you even summon me?

 

[Jonathan "Zee Nekomimi]

boys I am getting properly fed up with pixel hunting a million billion containers on ever single goddamn map

modders get a move on

press alt so it show the stuff you found. I just wish for two things, fixed action bar and sorting auto sorting on cache inventory. Pain in the ass to sort different kinds of ammo.

 

[Smashing Axe]

At the mine in Fleatown, Lucky Veinard says I killed his friend. I suspect this is a bug? I don't recall killing anyone other than random goons. Has anyone else encountered this?

 

[Reject_666_6]

the point is that the guns aren't just stat lasers that either do damage or not but an actual thing that spews bullets (can see in my video the AA12 breaking the railing and floor) that can break shit or hit the wrong target

Yeah, most impressive detail I noticed was when I was aiming a shot with dual revolver Fox. I was in a position where the game said that the enemy was in cover vs her left hand but not in cover vs her right hand shot.

 

[Strange Fellow]

press alt so it show the stuff you found.

I'm aware of this, but it doesn't make the actual clicking on the containers any less annoying.

Pain in the ass to sort different kinds of ammo.

Not sure what you mean. Ammo is a magical substance that doesn't eat up inventory space and doesn't require any management whatsoever.

 

[Raghar]

It's set ~20 years after JA2 but many mercs look the same or younger than they did in JA2.

They are eternally young. Because of events from previous games.

 

[oasis789]

It's set ~20 years after JA2 but many mercs look the same or younger than they did in JA2.

JA3 is set in 2001

 

[gogis]

I got sucked in last night until 1am which is always a good sign. All the combat grannies died to the last, but took out half the attack force in return, and I got to loot their guns. Win-win.

On Commando difficulty, I was able to preserve the lives of all but one. Rude Trudy just starts too isolated to rescue in time.
To be fair I save scummed after seeing where the town defenses were actually deployed (in my mind we were able to coordinate after I basically sat there waiting for 3 days).

And yeah I already have 15 hours in the game over 2 days played, while still trying to do normal weekend things. It's different, which we all knew it would be, but it goddamn sure scratches the itch.

I think I went to Cacao too early, first place I stopped after the starter island. It looked like the least well guarded mine and easiest to defend.

I took the prison nearby and it was intense. I'm assuming someone will give you the quest to go there so I'm testing the limits of sequence breaking. I had Fox sneak around and shoot most of the isolated guards in the back to avoid a battle, the guards were tougher and much better equipped that other enemies so far. It's funny how stealth kills work, Fox had a better chance to instakill from shooting and enemy in the foot than Omryn with head hots because she has 100 dex.

After clearing the outside guards I snuck into the lower level, cleared about half the guys with stealth including the warden, who actually dropped his Steyr Aug, unlike all the snipers with their mysterious vanishing Drugonovs outside. After clearing the inside I freed some dude who had 5 prisoners join me to finish the battle outside, then left to go to some other town to kill a guy I hadn't met yet. Well I hope there's no consequences for that decision!

When I went back outside the AI seemed to break. I ambushed the prison chief Jackhammer in his office, who sadly did not drop his auto shotty. But the 5 helpers just sat there in the yard and did nothing, and the remaining guards in the barracks didn't react either. Probably some scripting error. Then I had to go to bed because it was waaay too late.

I've had my sequence other way around. I cleared top, got my 2 Dragunovs, not Aug (I am also certain I came to prison too early, it's waay too hard), cleared bottom, had no interactions with prisoners aside from freeing some and freeing mob dude. Btw, Jackhammer dropped his shooty... Eventually. Don't want to spoil it to you

 

[ArchAngel]

So is this game actually good?

Good tactical game? Yes.

Good Jagged Alliance game? Opinions are all over the place.

Do you mean it's another XCOM clone?

I'ts more similar to Wasteland, but better

let's recap.

- You have something similar to XCOM pod activation mechanic, but not really. It's not POD, it's per individual, all enemies who see action will react. Unless you initiated combat with agressive action, they tend to seek cover on first round, but it's wildly inconsistent, I encountered both shooting and stabbing when they supposed to run for cover. I don't have enough data of why this happens. If you initiate combat yourself, all your shoot/overwatch guys will have their AP spent
- You DO NOT have double action of XCOM. I'ts AP, just like in JA2/Wasteland. I wish they inflated AP number, like 1.13, for granularity, but we get what we get. I think they tried to copy JA2 instead of 1.13, which is questionable decision, but whatever. AP depends on same stats and expended with different speed depending on stance, just like JA.
- Despite couple retards here insist that game have binary hit/miss system like nuXCOM, it's properly simulates bullet physics. You will get stray hits, you will get wall penetration, floor destructions with fall damage and hits to different (from which you intended) body parts. Game literally have free aim mode (which you should use for better shotgun cones) if you dislike XCOM-like selection of targets. Once you get your first MG, any doubts about that will dissipate. Pretty much like JA2 minus bullet drop (which many people disable in 1.13 anyways)
- The cover system, it's basically visual. You see that pile of rubble? You see it red-broken-shield when you stay, it becomes half-shield when you crouch and full cover when you prone. Bad news it's not gonna provide any cover the steeper the angle from enemy to that cover. Not like nuXCOM, where full cover is full cover., unless you perfectly 90+ degrees flank it. Not to mention, that you don't see shit and can't shoot directly through that cover, so expect crouch/prone hopping. General advice - don't rely on UI cover representation at all - if it looks shabby or questionable it's indeed shabby and questionable.
- Overwatch system. Very similar to XCOM, but it's cone (unless you have merc with 360 degree), be careful with setup, because your merc can leave cover to set it up.

I think you getting so much feedback about it being close to nuXCOM than to JA2 because a) people are generally morons b) they don't play both games like I do regularly (and I play openXCOM too a lot). This game is infinitely closer to JA2 than to XCOM, not even close, even if it's need a lot of fixing.

I have still not see this miss one body part, hit another and I have also spent hours watching people playing it. Also didn't devs themselves confirm that if you miss one body part you will not hit another.
Also this is all beat by using hit chance mod that clearly shows that things like darkeness, cover and other shit gives -20 or -10 or -XX to your hit chances. It is not hard for PC game to say if cover gives -20% penalty and you miss by that 20% game fires your bullet towards that cover to make it seem more realistic.

I had 2 cases when I had friendly fire which was avoidable by selecting headshot (the usual situation when you shoot crouched right behind your prone ally) and still hitting my teammate. Also I had occasion of MD dropping a guy (with a perk) when I clearly selected body shot, not leg shot.

I already covered in this thread, that the fact that any game could show you percentage with all modifiers, despite fully simulating bullet physics, is not hard to do (you juxtapose easily calculated cone for distance vs size of the target) OpenXCOM does exactly that. It's literally means nothing. Usually this system ignores everything on the path of bullet, so percentage would lie.

Like I had occasion in mob boss mansion battle, where I placed my MG guy near guardhouse left of the gate and he literally couldn't hit shit for 3 rounds, both overwatch and long burst. After investigation I found he was hitting the impregnable rock patch in the grass in front of him. And I never saw "rock patch in front of you" modifier in my modifiers. After redoing this battle several times (it's super hard) he was routinely downing 2-3 people a turn (it's super packed with enemies), never completely missing a shot

It does sound like that but ultimate test is if you can miss body shots at enemy standing one square next to your guy where hit chance says it is less than 100%.

 

[octavius]

Shit, this must be the hottest thread in the Codex right now.

P.S: kneel down octavius and Storyfag to Jagged Alliance 3, the true king of the Codex (Baldurs Gate 3 will be shit).

I hope this is not the hypetrain to Butthurtville?