Jagged Alliance 3 from Haemimont Games

[Strange Fellow]

It's cool to see how several people have different opinions on which style of play is the best. That's a sign of good game design right there. But I absolutely cannot fathom how you can run even a single MG, use it consistently (by which I mean overwatch with it), and have enough ammo. I'm carrying around a 5.56 and a 7.62 MG for one merc, just so I can switch to the other when one is low, and all that's happening is that I'm out of two types of ammo instead of one.

 

[Lord of Riva]

Maybe you're trying headshots way out of the weapon's range, or not paying attention to walls and stuff?

Clearly. Also I'm cheaping out and not using scopes on beginner guns.

Worth stating what difficulty people are playing on, I'm on the middle with "forgiving mode" turned off. I also avoid save scumming mid battle, though I do restart the map if I lose a guy.

managed nearly 80% accuracy

So you modded your weapons (spent resources), utilized the environment (system mastery), and chose your targets well (player skill/tactics), and were rewarded by achieving 12% better results than a half-assed player with much less time spent on the game, with a lower leveled character to boot. I think that's pretty good! I mean, what do you WANT to happen? Were you hoping that all your efforts would come to naught, and nothing you did made any difference besides the hard character stats? Are you saying I should achieve the same results as you, without learning the same lessons or devoting the same time to the game? I think it's good when a game rewards a variety of efforts, I think that's one of the best things about RPGs.

I've been playing on the hardest difficulty(Mission impossible or something) and I've had no trouble at all hitting headshots regularly with the G98. And I don't even have an accuracy scope - like I said, I've been using crit scopes.

However, I always try to shoot within the weapon's range(although many of the shots I've done outside of it were succesful aswell). If you do it out of the range all the time and/or doesn't use the max aim level, your accuracy rate is obviously gonna drop regardless of the weapon.

How does it feel overall, apart from the hit chance is it decently challenging?

It's cool to see how several people have different opinions on which style of play is the best. That's a sign of good game design right there. But I absolutely cannot fathom how you can run even a single MG, use it consistently (by which I mean overwatch with it), and have enough ammo. I'm carrying around a 5.56 and a 7.62 MG for one merc, just so I can switch to the other when one is low, and all that's happening is that I'm out of two types of ammo instead of one.

I agree on the game design part.

Yeah I am using stealth a lot, which means my MG is only used when, as is the case most maps, after thinning out the map the enemy is eventually triggered or it's a story set-up thing.

I shoot around 3 - 6 Salvos with the MG each map at best as it's a kill with every salvo anyways with steroid on 91 Marksmen and a fully kitted MG.

 

[Grampy_Bone]

I think he is saying he was using common sense and simple options and other players are retarded as a result if they are not capable of the same.

Yet he admitted he "didn't realize rifles were good" at first, and clearly has played the game much longer than I have, so it took him awhile to reach this 'retard' level. Though I will admit, I am the only guilty man in Shawshank, and the only Codex player who doesn't instantly master every game the first second I boot it up. You got me there.

 

[Jrpgfan]

Maybe you're trying headshots way out of the weapon's range, or not paying attention to walls and stuff?

Clearly. Also I'm cheaping out and not using scopes on beginner guns.

Worth stating what difficulty people are playing on, I'm on the middle with "forgiving mode" turned off. I also avoid save scumming mid battle, though I do restart the map if I lose a guy.

managed nearly 80% accuracy

So you modded your weapons (spent resources), utilized the environment (system mastery), and chose your targets well (player skill/tactics), and were rewarded by achieving 12% better results than a half-assed player with much less time spent on the game, with a lower leveled character to boot. I think that's pretty good! I mean, what do you WANT to happen? Were you hoping that all your efforts would come to naught, and nothing you did made any difference besides the hard character stats? Are you saying I should achieve the same results as you, without learning the same lessons or devoting the same time to the game? I think it's good when a game rewards a variety of efforts, I think that's one of the best things about RPGs.

I've been playing on the hardest difficulty(Mission impossible or something) and I've had no trouble at all hitting headshots regularly with the G98. And I don't even have an accuracy scope - like I said, I've been using crit scopes.

However, I always try to shoot within the weapon's range(although many of the shots I've done outside of it were succesful aswell). If you do it out of the range all the time and/or doesn't use the max aim level, your accuracy rate is obviously gonna drop regardless of the weapon.

How does it feel overall, apart from the hit chance is it decently challenging?

It's cool to see how several people have different opinions on which style of play is the best. That's a sign of good game design right there. But I absolutely cannot fathom how you can run even a single MG, use it consistently (by which I mean overwatch with it), and have enough ammo. I'm carrying around a 5.56 and a 7.62 MG for one merc, just so I can switch to the other when one is low, and all that's happening is that I'm out of two types of ammo instead of one.

I agree on the game design part.

Yeah I am using stealth a lot, which means my MG is only used when, as is the case most maps, after thinning out the map the enemy is eventually triggered or it's a story set-up thing.

I shoot around 3 - 6 Salvos with the MG each map at best as it's a kill with every salvo anyways with steroid on 91 Marksmen and a fully kitted MG.

Tutorial island is piss easy, but the game gets harder and legit challenging as you progress. I'm judging based on the hardest difficulty though which is the only one I've played so far.

 

[Strange Fellow]

Having now reached the tweest, I'm starting to see some proper challenge again. It's possible that I've been faffing around a bit too long capturing mines and such. Then again I've never gone to Meduna in a timely fashion, either.

Tweest spoilers

The coup being carried out on the strategic map by actual enemy squads is way cool. It's actually possible to repel some of the attacks if you've trained enough militia. These guys get it, man.

In other news, I've got over two hundred thousand dollarydoos in the bank. Let me buy ammo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Lord of Riva]

I think he is saying he was using common sense and simple options and other players are retarded as a result if they are not capable of the same.

Yet he admitted he "didn't realize rifles were good" at first, and clearly has played the game much longer than I have, so it took him awhile to reach this 'retard' level. Though I will admit, I am the only guilty man in Shawshank, and the only Codex player who doesn't instantly master every game the first second I boot it up. You got me there.

It's a skill and a curse. We could all have mastered something useful instead :D

 

[Sunri]

So i saved the president then talked to mayor, and he told ne that he killed the president that i just saved, and the game counted him as dead, lol

 

[Shaki]

I think he is saying he was using common sense and simple options and other players are retarded as a result if they are not capable of the same.

Yet he admitted he "didn't realize rifles were good" at first, and clearly has played the game much longer than I have, so it took him awhile to reach this 'retard' level. Though I will admit, I am the only guilty man in Shawshank, and the only Codex player who doesn't instantly master every game the first second I boot it up. You got me there.

My point is what I said at the beginning, that the game isn't really tactical, because once you realize the dominant strategy (modded rifles + explosives) game becomes easy af, there is literally 0 challenge left. Explosives at least are kinda scarce at the beginning, but you quickly start amassing insane amounts. Pistols/smgs/assault rifles/shotguns are literally useless dogshit trash, melee is situationally good only because it's bugged and gives you literally infinite attacks on a single target, or multiple targets close to each other, MGs are decent for clearing big clumps of enemies, but explosives are better at it. I don't recall any other tactical game I've played in the last decade, that would launch with THAT unbalanced and easy to abuse combat, with 80% of weapon classes being completely useless - and since it has very streamlined strategic layer, character building and inventory management and non-existent economy, if combat is bad then the whole game is bad and worthless.

 

[Grampy_Bone]

Very bummed out. I finished the Haunted Mansion mission and found some cool stuff like a Colt Anaconda and satchel charges. But then I realized moving between the cellar and the surface with enemies still active counted as abandoning the mission, and I lost all my loyalty with Fleatown. So I restarted the map and the loot changed, and I lost the gun and goodies. Lame.

 

[Grampy_Bone]

Pistols/smgs/assault rifles/shotguns are literally useless dogshit trash,

No.

In the mission I just did, Raven with her high marksman, 10x scope, bipod while prone Drugonov still missed a few times, well within accurate range, and when she did hit it was usually a graze due to the fog and darkness (she had night vision goggles but it didnt seem to do much, might be busted.) Worst performing character for that map. Barry was out of shaped charges, he only makes two per week and I haven't spent a lot of time crafting yet.

Shotguns, pistols, smgs, and assault rifles carried the day though.

 

[gogis]

Where is screenshot with stats? Aiming to 3+ with Gewehr is default mode for any non braindead player. Crap shooters still can't hit shit.
Not to mention scrubs with low AP, like Steroid, can't even prime it fully with 7AP base. Like, you actually don't even understand basic mechanics of the game, it's not just Marksmanship
Where is your stats to prove your bold claim, mate?
Take it now, show to us or GTFO. Or do I need step-by-step guide for you on how to find merc stats?

Most of stats would be skewed since I'm using mostly the same team since the beginning, and tried different weapons, fortunately tho I replaced Steroid with Livewire after I already realized rifles are OP, so she was using only rifles and sometimes throwing a nade.

Notice how her most used weapon is a fucking gewehr, worst rifle in the game that can have only 2 mods and sucks dick, because all better rifles were taken by other team members when she joined. Still she managed nearly 80% accuracy with her fucking 64 marksmanship and low level. Now that I recently gave her a fully modded winchester too, she pretty much doesn't miss at all anymore, and I started exclusively targeting the heads. I'm thinking about downloading the hitchance mod and just screenshoting her hitchances on long range headshots, since I'm pretty sure it would be 100% unless the game has some forced miss chance.

Are you serious here? You barge in with "I almost always hit with headshots" then you show us a screen with 78% and THEN admitting that you not always used headshot? Do you know what exaggeration means? First, with "always headshot" you not going to hit 78%, second, even 80% is not fucking "almost always hit". Not even close. Let's not even start talk about headshot <> kill here. It's already entered retarded level.

"Almost always hit, always one-shot" is not what you described and shown in this post.

The truth is that your whole tirade is wrong on every level. MG is superior to rifle in any given average encounter, melee completely trumps sniper rifles in CQC and not everyone uses Barry, so fuck shaped charge. The only thing we can conclude from all of that is that assault rifles and burst-fire sucks ass. Everybody agrees

Oh, and go and complete Mob boss Mansion battle in "don't involve me" variant with 6 sniper rifles. It's gonna suck ass

 

[Strange Fellow]

The only thing we can conclude from all of that is that assault rifles ... sucks ass.

my dude, may I introduce you to my very good friend the underslung grenade launcher

 

[gogis]

The only thing we can conclude from all of that is that assault rifles ... sucks ass.

my dude, may I introduce you to my very good friend the underslung grenade launcher

Badly worded, meant to be "burst-fire of assault rifles" Mea culpa. See, even assault rifles have redeeming qualities!

 

[Stavrophore]

Niggers when you talk about hit chances and what tactics are good or not, tell what difficulty you play on. I play on standard, and the sniper rifles are way too easy.

 

[gogis]

Niggers when you talk about hit chances and what tactics are good or not, tell what difficulty you play on. I play on standard, and the sniper rifles are way too easy.

I play on hardest, but does it REALLY matter? I thought it's only affects composition of enemies. Like more elites and such. Aren't comparative power of guns should stay the same? It's not like burst works better vs elites, usually headshot from sniper is still better (helmets notwithstanding)

 

[Hobo Elf]

Burst Fire is kind of doggie shit in this game, until it isn't. When your Marksmanship is over 90 and you mod your gun to shoot 4 bullets, then it actually becomes good in Overwatch. And also as Strange Fellow said modding your AR to shoot nades is good. Fuck me, it's so good you could just use the AR for that alone. SMGs I found to be less useful but not to the point where it made the game unplayable. I think Burst Fire needs a new balance pass because as it is it just isn't worth it until the very end of the game. Early and mid game it's absurd to even think about it. You pay more in AP and bullets and you _have_ to hit with all 3 bullets for it to be worth it. Otherwise you're paying 2 bullets and an extra AP to do the same amount of damage as you'd have done with the single shot, or worse.

 

[Nortar]

I'm on Commando (Hard I think?)

I'm having great fun, it's a bit too easy on normal. I'm wondering why people are complaining it's too hard on the steam forums, for all intents and purposes if there is something that is sucking the fun out of it it would be the low difficulty.

This is the newspeak for modern audience.
If your game has 3 difficulty setting you just don't call the first one piss-easy.
You call it "standard" or "adventure" or some other bullshit that won't hurt anyone's feeling for chosing piss-easy mode.
Coz if it is not called piss-easy than you're not weaksause for playing it, right?

Likewise, the middle one of the 3 setting is not hard.
It's "medium" regardless if it's called Commando or even Fucking-Ubermench-God mode.
Being neither lowest nor highest difficulty average is what it is.

But looks like that newspeak has backfired.
Now they seem to believe that if the lowest difficulty is called "standard", then the game could have been made even easier.

 

[ArchAngel]

I think he is saying he was using common sense and simple options and other players are retarded as a result if they are not capable of the same.

Yet he admitted he "didn't realize rifles were good" at first, and clearly has played the game much longer than I have, so it took him awhile to reach this 'retard' level. Though I will admit, I am the only guilty man in Shawshank, and the only Codex player who doesn't instantly master every game the first second I boot it up. You got me there.

My point is what I said at the beginning, that the game isn't really tactical, because once you realize the dominant strategy (modded rifles + explosives) game becomes easy af, there is literally 0 challenge left. Explosives at least are kinda scarce at the beginning, but you quickly start amassing insane amounts. Pistols/smgs/assault rifles/shotguns are literally useless dogshit trash, melee is situationally good only because it's bugged and gives you literally infinite attacks on a single target, or multiple targets close to each other, MGs are decent for clearing big clumps of enemies, but explosives are better at it. I don't recall any other tactical game I've played in the last decade, that would launch with THAT unbalanced and easy to abuse combat, with 80% of weapon classes being completely useless - and since it has very streamlined strategic layer, character building and inventory management and non-existent economy, if combat is bad then the whole game is bad and worthless.

Uhh, you must have not played Phoenix Point at release where you had multiple builds that could clear the whole map of enemies in single turn :D

 

[Jrpgfan]

Honestly, this was definitely the big surprise of the year for me. I was expecting a nuXCOM clone at best.

With the release of Colony Ship and maybe that zombie survival game and Project Haven, this could be the best year for me for cRPGs and Tactical CRPGs in recent times.

 

[Lord of Riva]

But looks like that newspeak has backfired.
Now they seem to believe that if the lowest difficulty is called "standard", then the game could have been made even easier.

I know of this issue but frankly aside from the mainstream games, which I was not sure I would count that towards, i tend to give developer balancing a go. When it comes to indies it is sometimes turned on it's head and the difficulty is completely arse on the highest level, basically at this point in time it's basically a coinflip is something is of adequate difficulty since the options have basically lost meaning.

 

[ArchAngel]

Honestly, this was definitely the big surprise of the year for me. I was expecting a nuXCOM clone at best.

With the release of Colony Ship and maybe that zombie survival game and Project Haven, this could be the best year for me for cRPGs and Tactical CRPGs in recent times.

Aliens: Dark Descent seems like a bigger pleasant surprise.

 

[Wirdschowerdn]

Honestly, this was definitely the big surprise of the year for me. I was expecting a nuXCOM clone at best.

With the release of Colony Ship and maybe that zombie survival game and Project Haven, this could be the best year for me for cRPGs and Tactical CRPGs in recent times.

Aliens: Dark Descent seems like a bigger pleasant surprise.

Have times become so desperate for tactical fans that this half-baked AA trash galore is now being lauded as the second coming?

 

[Lord of Riva]

Honestly, this was definitely the big surprise of the year for me. I was expecting a nuXCOM clone at best.

With the release of Colony Ship and maybe that zombie survival game and Project Haven, this could be the best year for me for cRPGs and Tactical CRPGs in recent times.

Aliens: Dark Descent seems like a bigger pleasant surprise.

Have times become so desperate for tactical fans that this half-baked AA trash galore is now being lauded as the second coming?

why are you so unbelievable gay

 

[Jrpgfan]

Honestly, this was definitely the big surprise of the year for me. I was expecting a nuXCOM clone at best.

With the release of Colony Ship and maybe that zombie survival game and Project Haven, this could be the best year for me for cRPGs and Tactical CRPGs in recent times.

Aliens: Dark Descent seems like a bigger pleasant surprise.

Have times become so desperate for tactical fans that this half-baked AA trash galore is now being lauded as the second coming?

I completely ignore anything with "GmbH" in it. Sorry.

 

[Grampy_Bone]

Not sure if people realize you get extra shots in Overwatch than your AP would normally allow, and different weapons/mods can get even more shots. It's completely viable to run an overwatch merc and provide covering fire each turn. This has a denial effect since the AI will try to avoid overwatch cones if it can, and you can use it to set up ambushes or otherwise control enemy movement. So there is a role for burst-fire guns to play, just maybe not the role people wanted. Of course MGs are the kings of overwatch, assuming you want to pay the ammo cost. ARs are the budget option.

Really though it's absurd you can't buy ammo. I'm not low or anything but still, what else are you spending money on? Some kind of system where you need to make contact with local arms dealers to grow your supply and increase stock would have made sense, not to mention centralized player bases with recon vehicles, insertion choppers, etc. Missed opportunity to enhance the strategy layer.