SMT: Nocturne

[Average Manatee]

The best damage is having 999 HP + Deathbound (damage scales based on your max HP) + focus. Life Surge is effectively a straight +30% damage boost for Deathbound along with the obvious advantages of high HP in a game where you don't want to die, so definitely take that. With this and full buffs/debuffs you can do about 10k damage with a single attack. I went though some more math stuff on comparing some phys skills and the best magic skills on page 4.

Also, Might does *NOT* affect physical skills, only auto attacks. Which makes it fairly awful.

If you wanna keep at least one heavy hitting spell on the MC, Tornado can be replaced by Bolt Storm or Glacial Blast, since high level enemies are commonly weak to either elec or ice element. Both spells have a chance to inflict paralyze/freeze too, wasting their turns.

Doesn't waste a turn, unless I'm completely misremembering things. What it does is make them unable to evade and all phys attacks crit. Additionally freeze will remove any phys resist/immunity sort of as if you had pierce, which makes it a very useful fallback for a physical-based main character that runs up against phys immunes. Don't recall what it does to phys absorb/repel exactly though.

 

[Vorark]

Doesn't waste a turn, unless I'm completely misremembering things. What it does is make them unable to evade and all phys attacks crit. Additionally freeze will remove any phys resist/immunity sort of as if you had pierce, which makes it a very useful fallback for a physical-based main character that runs up against phys immunes. Don't recall what it does to phys absorb/repel exactly though.

Ah, that was it then! I remember Freeze and Shock status being very useful when I last played but that was like a decade ago.

 

[Tigranes]

OK, I have COMPLETED. Good shit.

I chickened out at the end and went Normal for the "real big bad", because fuck me only being able to damage with the MC is a pain in the arse. (Of course, Raidou leveled up once I won, and turns out his next ability would have given him Pierce.) Endgame bosses at the Tower seemed to devolve into a lengthy "buff, heal, then whittle them down over 20 turns", but maybe that's just a factor of my party.

83 MC w/ Freikugel at the end, then demons like Abaddon, Atropos, Flauros, Albion, Raidou, Trumpeter - though until the very end they were more likely to be Daisoujou, the Riders and Harlot. Basically held on to War Cry, Fog Breath, Megidolaon, Focus, Prayer, etc. whenever I found them.

Only figured out that you can buy demons off Compendium 2/3rds of the way through, until then I was just Pokemon capturing whatever I came across then fusing on the fly.

Anyway, great stuff all round. I didn't enjoy some of the design like the arbitrary unmarked teleport panels, random enemies crit-killing you from behind to wipe out 2 hours of progress, etc., but that was a minority. Would play again.

 

[Puukko]

Lol, how did it take you that long to figure out the compendium? Did you at least know about sacrificial fusions?

 

[d1r]

Lol, how did it take you that long to figure out the compendium? Did you at least know about sacrificial fusions?

S-Sacrificial wh-?

 

[Puukko]

I'm getting serious deja vu here...

 

[Abu Antar]

These things are easy to miss as a newbie.

 

[Tigranes]

Lol, how did it take you that long to figure out the compendium? Did you at least know about sacrificial fusions?

By not reading shit, of course

I eventually used a bit of elements, mitamas & sacrificial fusion, but only for getting demons I liked (e.g. Ongyo-Ki) - I know you're supposed to use the latter 2 to power up your demons, but I could never quite figure it out, e.g. Sacrifices, let's say a level 50 demon, then it seemed lkike the sacrifice needed to be a higher level ot make a difference?

Also, the first time I got an accidental fusion, I thought WTF I don't want this and reloaded.... it was an Amaterasu.

I'll probably do a magic MC + hyper-theorycrafted fusion NG+ at some point, but I'm not sure I'll enjoy it right now. The content is all the same, right? Does NG+ just involve grabbing some cash and fusing like your best demons from the start?

 

[Puukko]

Sacrificial fusions carry ALL the EXP the sacrificial demon and all of its parents have accumulated which is then carried on to the final demon. This is how you could make a say, level 60 base demon, which could then be boosted to 65 for example. It will also force you to make the skill inheritance lottery all over again since the resulting demon will inherit skills from not only its parents but the sacrificial demon as well.

If you just use random demons you recruited for sacrifice, it won't do shit and will just fuck up the skill inheritance.

This is how it worked OG mind you, with the remake you don't have to worry about the inheritance bit.

 

[Tigranes]

Sacrificial fusions carry ALL the EXP the sacrificial demon and all of its parents have accumulated which is then carried on to the final demon. This is how you could make a say, level 60 base demon, which could then be boosted to 65 for example. It will also force you to make the skill inheritance lottery all over again since the resulting demon will inherit skills from not only its parents but the sacrificial demon as well.

If you just use random demons you recruited for sacrifice, it won't do shit and will just fuck up the skill inheritance.

This is how it worked OG mind you, with the remake you don't have to worry about the inheritance bit.

Thanks! OK, so what matters is the XP accumulated (e.g. fuse a level 60 demon, level it up to 65 - the XP worth those 5 levels are used in the sacrifice)? I did zero grinding and maybe often I was trying to use demons without much added XP.

And yeah, I can't imagine playing with totally random skill inheritance...

 

[Puukko]

The way you wanna play is to keep a few "bloodlines" that have accumulated EXP as well as useful skills (eg Daisoujou's Prayer) that you can then sacrifice for EXP boosts and carrying those useful skills forward, and you use the compendium to keep resummoning these demons to be sacrificed/used again. Of course eventually you will hit a wall where the amount of EXP will be too large to be useful as every resulting demon would end up well above the Demifiend's level which would prevent the fusion from happening. So it's a balancing act.

 

[Average Manatee]

Sacrifices in fact multiply accumulated XP of the demon being sacrificed by 1.5x before being applied to the result. Fusing some low level demons with watchful + forever useful skills like buffs/debuffs/dark might/focus/boosts/immunities can get you a lot of cheap XP and good skills when fusing higher level demons as sacrifice. Also the extra XP is particularly important for unlocking the skills demons get when leveling which otherwise takes a lot of grinding. Often this is the earliest way you can get certain powerful skills. Low level demons with watchful can also be leveled up just fishing for random skill upgrades or gifts like stat increasing incense. Technically if you really grind enough you could max your stats and have all the strongest available skills at very low level through this.

I'll probably do a magic MC + hyper-theorycrafted fusion NG+ at some point, but I'm not sure I'll enjoy it right now. The content is all the same, right? Does NG+ just involve grabbing some cash and fusing like your best demons from the start?

I've never actually done a NG+ run but yes. The MC starts at level 1 still and doesn't level up any faster, also has no extra money or items carried over. The main changes are that you preserve your compendium (though I'm not sure if its accessible at the start or you have to reach the story point where it opens up), you can fuse demons above your level (which due to sacrifice XP multiply each time means you can easily fuse demons to level 255), and there's a certain thing you can do to permanently unlock an extra move in battle (so MC + 3 demons gets 5 moves).

I chickened out at the end and went Normal for the "real big bad", because fuck me only being able to damage with the MC is a pain in the arse. (Of course, Raidou leveled up once I won, and turns out his next ability would have given him Pierce.) Endgame bosses at the Tower seemed to devolve into a lengthy "buff, heal, then whittle them down over 20 turns", but maybe that's just a factor of my party.

The demon seller at the bottom of amala will sell a demon with pierce to you and you can fuse it around. Though honestly only having the MC able to damage the TDE boss is fine if you had 999 HP and focus deathbound. Rest of the party handles buffs/debuffs/healing.

 

[Machocruz]

Putting not-actually-present slang into a localization of a game is bad enough, putting modern slang into a game from 2003 is particularly egregious. So many American localizers are such hacks.

 

[grimace]

Lol, how did it take you that long to figure out the compendium? Did you at least know about sacrificial fusions?

When does the Compendium become available?

 

[Jenkem]

Lol, how did it take you that long to figure out the compendium? Did you at least know about sacrificial fusions?

When does the Compendium become available?

First time you go to the Cathedral of Shadows in Ikebukuro iirc.

 

[Tigranes]

Well, given this successful entry, I could also try a different SMT/Persona/whatever the hell all these spinoffs. What's the best from a gameplay standpoint?

 

[Jenkem]

Devil Summoner: Raidou Kuzunoha vs. the Soulless Army

 

[WhiteShark]

Well, given this successful entry, I could also try a different SMT/Persona/whatever the hell all these spinoffs. What's the best from a gameplay standpoint?

Strange Journey (original) is a good dungeon crawler. I've heard good things about SMT4 and SMT4A gameplay but I can't attest to them personally. I think Devil Survivor (Overclocked version) is the best SMT game despite being a spinoff. It plays like a tactics game except that when you attack an enemy it goes into a Nocturne-style combat for 1 turn (2 if you press turn). It also has a lot of dialogue and story choices and many different endings.

 

[grimace]

Well, given this successful entry, I could also try a different SMT/Persona/whatever the hell all these spinoffs. What's the best from a gameplay standpoint?

Strange Journey

 

[grimace]

I think Devil Survivor (Overclocked version) is the best SMT game despite

seconded

 

[Tigranes]

Thanks, these look good. Are Personas worth looking at gameplay wise or is it just completely for the interaction stuff and not at all the same?

 

[Abu Antar]

Thanks, these look good. Are Personas worth looking at gameplay wise or is it just completely for the interaction stuff and not at all the same?

Persona series have okay gameplay, but I'd say they're more about the story and characters. You can't really decide much about building your other party members. Can you stand Japanese teens in a school setting? If so, you might like it. There's a lot of time management, too.

Devil Survivor games are fun, if you don't mind tactical rpgs.

In general, my personal opinion is that all sub-series are decent to great.

Me, I am playing DDS2, and while it is more like a normal rpg, I am still having a lot of fun.

 

[Sarathiour]

I think Devil Survivor (Overclocked version) is the best SMT game despite being a spinoff.

I only played like 3 SMT game, so i can't vouch for it being the best one, but it was definitely solid.

 

[ghostdog]

Thanks, these look good. Are Personas worth looking at gameplay wise or is it just completely for the interaction stuff and not at all the same?

You've played SMT 1 & 2 ? If not, get to them first.

 

[Roguey]

Putting not-actually-present slang into a localization of a game is bad enough, putting modern slang into a game from 2003 is particularly egregious. So many American localizers are such hacks.

Different word, somewhat-different definition.