Baldur's Gate Baldur's Gate 3 Early Access Thread [GAME RELEASED, GO TO NEW THREAD]

[Ontopoly]

But I appreciate that you admit you don't have a good alternative metric.

You don't need an alternative. The power to decide what's good and bad is inside all of us. If you think steam reviews are so magical, check the difference between Solasta's and bg3's.

 

[Cryomancer]

Look I'm also not a fan of modern soy reviewers but I believe a metascore is the best we have to measure the quality of a game. (+ steam reviews)

I disagree. I think that user reviews >>> game journalist reviews.

It is perfect? No. But look to for eg metascore vs user score on D3.

Many reviews I read do hate the game for being so different to BG I and BG II, which is understandable, I'm still of the opinion that marketing it as BG3 is very scummy, but they don't necessarily represent the opinion of the playerbase as a whole, at least I think.

Nice point. To be fair, neverwinter nights 1/2 is nothing in common with neverwinter from AOL which is nothing like the generic wow clone aka neverwinter mmo. Calling a game "baldur's gate 3" creates a expectancy of a sequel to the Bhaalspawn saga.

 

[Butter]

Imagine consulting Metacritic or Steam reviews when you have the Kodex Kool Konsensus at your fingertips.

 

[Swen]

Look I'm also not a fan of modern soy reviewers but I believe a metascore is the best we have to measure the quality of a game. (+ steam reviews)

I disagree. I think that user reviews >>> game journalist reviews.

It is perfect? No. But look to for eg metascore vs user score on D3.

Problem with metacritic user scores is that EVERYONE can post a review, not the case with steam player reviews.

 

[Ontopoly]

And in this very entertaining thread we witness one man troll about 5 different people.

He's only trolling himself by establishing that he's an idiot and a cultist.

 

[Cryomancer]

Problem with metacritic user scores is that EVERYONE can post a review, not the case with steam player reviews.

Yep. But the game is only on Blizz platform which doesn't allow user submitted reviews. Metacritic should require a proof of game ownsership. The user score on steam/gog is a way better indicator of how the purchasing player view a game.

 

[vota DC]

What's the problem? The zoomer has exposed those old boomer RPG's as the overhyped mediocre trash that they really are.

Go kill yourself,retard.

Hush hush now my sweet summer child, your suffering will be over soon when BG3 fully gets released. From then on the Baldur's Gate name will only be associated with BG3, the older boomer trash will be forgotten and only remembered by a small group of autists on the codex.

Or ... Will be considered too boomer for Larian fanboys and too modern for BG1/2 fanboys and have the same fate of lawbreakers which din't pleased old school arena shooter fans nor modern hero shooter fans. People are posting memes like

On REEDDIT

https://www.reddit.com/r/baldursgate/comments/nmnj6i/i_know_this_has_get_off_my_lawn_young_people/

https://www.reddit.com/r/baldursgate/comments/mqo8yz/2e_mage_vs_5e_wizard/

Even on reddit, people are mocking BG3.

Lmfao, that "baldurs gate" boomer subreddit has only 45k members. Meanwhile BG3 hasn't even launched and its subreddit already has 75k members.

It's even worse than I thought, the old BG boomer rpg's will be forgetten very fast.

Baldur's gate was already 7 years old when reddit was born.

Damn so the old BG boomer games had a decade+ head start and still only could gather 45k autists who are interested in the old BG games...so sad and pathetic.

Same scenario of Ultima Underworld and ultima ascendant. The difference Is even bigger, that game made a great effort about being discussed more than Ultima Underworld, you shouldn't miss it!

 

[underground nymph]

Victor “I’ll use whatever metrics I find supporting my agenda, though I’ll deny my opponents in doing so if they will be contradicting my beliefs” aka Victor “there’s no shame in using a questionable quality memes as long as there’s a clear statement in my favor”

did I miss anything?

Ah yes, Victor “I’ll be tireless and extremely deliberate in manifesting my autism”

 

[Cryomancer]

find supporting my agenda,

Yep. Mocking Larian cultists = Agenda.

We are powerless to stop the decline, so let me get some fun. Is not clear that I was trying to trigger Larian cultists?

 

[Swen]

find supporting my agenda,

Yep. Mocking Larian cultists = Agenda.

We are powerless to stop the decline, so let me get some fun. Is not clear that I was trying to trigger Larian cultists?

"I..is it not clear I was tryin to trigger larian cultists?"

 

[The Dutch Ghost]

Genuine question as I have never looked into Larian games before, including their re releases of old Iplay RPGs (I have the feeling I am better off with the originals)
But what is bad about the studio or their products?

 

[Cryomancer]

But what is bad about the studio or their products?

DOS2 has the worst armor system ever invented. The combat is too slow, with low lethality + extremely slow animations and the writing is really bad. The unique Larian game which I recommend is divine divinity. But honestly, Larian is not that bad. Compared to other AAA studios, they are fine. The problem is the Larian cultists.

 

[Swen]

Genuine question as I have never looked into Larian games before, including their re releases of old Iplay RPGs (I have the feeling I am better off with the originals)
But what is bad about the studio or their products?

To sum up the butthurt: boomers are mad I won't make the same Baldur's Gate game from 20 years ago.

 

[Anonona]

But what is bad about the studio or their products?

As an studio they are more or less okay. They actually started 2 kickstarter projects and end up delivering. They also released Definitive Versions of those two same games and gave them free to owners of the originals, as well as allowing users to play either the regular and the definitive version. They seem so far to be relatively consumer friendly, with the worst offense being taking full price for an EA game, BG3.

Their games are a mix of very good and very bad ideas. So, for example, in D:OS 2 you have good things like a lot of freedom and interactivity, pretty decent "tacticool" combat, fun skills, good graphical optimization and multiplayer mode together with awful ideas like the loot system, the initiative system,weak stat system and a strange skill progression where you unlock almost all of the skills by the end of chapter 2. Then you have divisive things like the armor system, which some like and others hate, the writing and the cool down system for skills.
So depending on how much the bad outweighs the good for you, is easy to either like or hate their games.

But I think is pretty evident that the recent flak they are getting is because of their vision of BG3. Any studio would have been judged harshly when taking this endeavour, but Larian and the changes they had introduced are, to put it lightly, very polemical. Add a lack of information moving forward and the fear of those that like the game that their feedback isn't being listened, and the hate of those that consider BG3 not a true sequel and an insult to the originals, and you can see why so many people are up in arms against them.

 

[Cryomancer]

Genuine question as I have never looked into Larian games before, including their re releases of old Iplay RPGs (I have the feeling I am better off with the originals)
But what is bad about the studio or their products?

To sum up the butthurt: boomers are mad I won't make the same Baldur's Gate game from 20 years ago.

Nope. The greatest problem of Larian is underestimating the player base.

Swen said that spell slots aren't intuitive. OwlCat gave two spellbooks on the vancian magical system for Wizards who follow the Lich path, the wiz leveling with XP and lich with milestone leveling. Each one with his own save DC, concentration, caster level, spell slots to memorize, etc. And unique feats for the mythic path which affects both spellbooks.

My two spellbooks on Wrat

weak stat system and a strange skill progression where you unlock almost all of the skills by the end of chapter 2. Then you have divisive things like the armor system, which some like and others hate, the writing and the cool down system for skills.

There is anyone who likes his armor system?

 

[Anonona]

There is anyone who likes his armor system?

I do. Wouldn't put it every game, but in the context of D:OS 2 it works well.

Is a whole system with skill balanced around it, so you have status effect that actually bypass armor or that precisely targets armor itself like Acid or Suffocation, and skills that add armor or remove it to produce certain effects. When creating characters you end up having to take both type of armour into account and I find myself seeking to find synergies between skills to make it so no a single one of my party members is unable to target a type of armor or use a type of CC skill. For example, making sure to take some necromancy with my casters so they can target physical armor, or some spells like medusa head for my martials so they can CC enemies without magic armor. It does help the game differentiate itself from others DnD derivatives by adding a certain unique layer of tactical thinking in combat.

In conclusion, is a system that in paper may not look so good and there are some balancing issues, but in execution it actually works better than one may think, at least in my opinion.

 

[Reinhardt]

ARMOR WON'T LET WIZARDS TO BE COOL!

 

[The_Mask]

But what is bad about the studio or their products?

The studio is fine.

Their products won't rise above mediocrity.

And their fanbase is a chore to listen to.

 

[Larianshill]

Victor's chosen character portrait is everything I expected and more.

And their fanbase is a chore to listen to.

You are a chore to listen to.

 

[Sharpedge]

There is anyone who likes his armor system?

I do. Wouldn't put it every game, but in the context of D:OS 2 it works well.

Is a whole system with skill balanced around it, so you have status effect that actually bypass armor or that precisely targets armor itself like Acid or Suffocation, and skills that add armor or remove it to produce certain effects. When creating characters you end up having to take both type of armour into account and I find myself seeking to find synergies between skills to make it so no a single one of my party members is unable to target a type of armor or use a type of CC skill. For example, making sure to take some necromancy with my casters so they can target physical armor, or some spells like medusa head for my martials so they can CC enemies without magic armor. It does help the game differentiate itself from others DnD derivatives by adding a certain unique layer of tactical thinking in combat.

In conclusion, is a system that in paper may not look so good and there are some balancing issues, but in execution it actually works better than one may think, at least in my opinion.

Not to derail this thread again, but I would be somewhat interested in seeing you substantiate your opinion on the D:OS 2 armour system. This thread provides quite a few differing opinions on the subject and is probably a good place to discuss it, if you would be willing to do so? In particular, why do you think that the system encourages taking both types of damage into account when the following is the case:

The whole discussion was about whether the armor system encourages sticking to a single damage type or generalizing. In theory such a system is capable of encouraging having a party which is more generalized, provided that in some situations you would want elemental damage over physical. For that to be true, there would need to be some enemies which either have high physical resistance, or a high physical armor but low magical armor, or a combination of both. This is not the case however and enemies both have high elemental resistances and usually have higher magical armor than physical armor. In theory it would also have been possible to offset it by giving magical abilities much higher multipliers, but for the most part, this is also not the case.

 

[Swen]

But what is bad about the studio or their products?

Their products won't rise above mediocrity.

"T..their producs wont rise bove medicority"

 

[His Dudeness]

Eat shit, millions of flies can't be wrong.

 

[The_Mask]

And their fanbase is a chore to listen to.

You are a chore to listen to.

Username checks out.

 

[Cryomancer]

portrait is everything I expected and more.

If you checked the thread about Wrath of The righteous, the dhampir portrait is very popular.

Eat shit, millions of flies can't be wrong.

Yep. IMO game journalists praising a game is a evidence against the game quality, not in favor of game quality.

 

[Anonona]

Not to derail this thread again, but I would be somewhat interested in seeing you substantiate your opinion on the D:OS 2 armour system.

I actually participated in that topic and I think I already wrote what I though and many others expressed it better than me. I'll say that despite some problems with the balance, you can get very powerful skill and spells that target the opposite type of armor for minimal investment. Things like Necromancy is one of the most powerful physical damage, and it scales with INT. Skills like Chloroform require a single point on Trickery but is incredibly effective through the game. Earth spells target magic armour but apply physicall CC and so on and so fort. Is very easy to get a party that covers both types of damage and have always something to do each turn regardless of enemies resistances with very little sacrifices on their main builds.

Yet I don't disagree that more enemies necessitated physical resistances. But magic was still quite powerful when combined with the right skills and feats. An Elf with Elemental Affinity and Adrenaline is dangerous from the beginning, add later skills like Apotheosis or Skin Graft and you will be able to pull incredible damage and CC in a few turns.