Jagged Alliance 3 from Haemimont Games

[Yosharian]

Way ahead of you

 

[ArchAngel]

So many butthurt people. Everywhere. You are all funny.

 

[3 others]

Tried the demo and played through the tutorial island. I'm very impressed with what they've achieved with this cursed IP. Here are some thoughts while I wait for the full game installer to download from GOG.

+ I'm having FUN.
+ The tone of the game is on point. I've never thought of JA2 being particularly action-movie-like, as the publisher has for some reason felt the need to convey while promoting this game, but the lightheartedness and a certain kind of light irreverence fits well here.
+ The setting is well realized. It feels enough like an African shithole instead of some Caribbean amalgam like the previous ones.
+ There's a nice rhythm to the combat. The enemy repositioning turn is a nice halfway compromise solution to the inherent problem of first-turn advantage in turn-based tactics games. Overwatch adds dynamism to the my-turn-your-turn flow, and is IMO a better mechanic than the old all-or-nothing interrupt.
- ...but the enemies don't seem to play with the same rules though. I don't think even Mouse can move 15 squares and still have enough APs for two pistol shots.
~ The enemy AI (as noted in approx. 1256298 other places too) is way too careless and should at least react to 15 shredded corpses in an overwatch line of fire. On the other hand I think this fits the African bush war theme somewhat, and wouldn't look that out of place in some of the African modern-era warfare books I've read (Hannes Wessels' Rhodesian SAS memoir A Handful of Hard Men is the gold standard in this genre btw. - highly recommended for anyone intrigued by the JA3 setting)
- Burst fire seems pointless. I get the sense that it never deals any more damage than single shots even if all three bullets hit the mark.

+ The "chunkiness" of strategic layer Operations is a plus. No incentive to micromanage mercs to repair, rest, or training tasks every hour when there's downtime. In JA3, the equipment repair task for example requires a minimum time investment of 6 hours so you're better off fixing a larger amount of stuff once you get down to it.
- On the other hand, some granularity is unnecessarily lost. A merc no longer has a continuous stamina bar, instead he is either normal or tired (or well-rested), with appropriate tokens. And I don't think it's tracked anywhere in the UI how near a merc is to getting tired.
- In general, there is an unnecessary vagueness to many game mechanics. I know everything can't be Into The Breach, but why can't I do knife takedowns if I have a gun in the other hand? I still haven't quite come to grips with what I can expect the enemies to be capable of during their turns. How far can that guy move to that direction and still shoot during his turn, is my cover enough? What can and can't I do when I'm being pinned in overwatch?
+ The sidequests seem fun, and numerous. And let's not act like that flaming twink tattoo shop quest in JA2 was some high watermark of vidya gayme writing.

+ The merc designs and portraits are generally very good and cheeky, with a lot of character. Thor's flip-flops, Mouse's cheesy keychain, and all that... and their personalities shine through in the banter (which there is a lot) and other interactions.
- ...but the faces look like they've been pieced together with some internal Tropico NPC character creation tool slider wankery. Most of the black mercs don't look bantuid or nilotic at all, and half of the roster has a retarded grin on their face.
+ The NPC portraits look nice, and are voiced well enough.

- Some of the merc stats don't make sense. Wolf exudes competence and charisma so why is his leadership so low? Why does the half-retarded Ukie girl have a high leadership value? Some of this is carryover from JA2 but still... they felt no need to adhere so strictly to JA2 concepts elsewhere so why here?
~ The new mercs are kind of hit-and-miss, although the concepts are at least somewhat entertaining. Ultrazoomer Kashmiri tech wiz? Childish potatozone sharpshooter girl? Lazy Samoyed shaman/ranger dual class? Sure, why not. At least the girls are as annoying as Ira, though.
- I feel like there's some missed potential being left on the table with the merc selection... in addition to being the most entertaining merc in the whole series, Malice would be a nice addition for loads of French interactions. Cliff is a native Anglo South African, and Stephen was a diamond mine operator...

 

[Ryzer]

The deadeye perk is so op, to the point that I wonder if they playtested it.
It's a net 20% increase in crit chance+ bipod + grip and you have a rifleman constantly doing crit damages on target.
The bipod as well is so important compared to the rest, it's almost game-breaking.

 

[Yosharian]

...but the enemies don't seem to play with the same rules though. I don't think even Mouse can move 15 squares and still have enough APs for two pistol shots.

That's one of the ways they add difficulty. In Commando, enemies get +30% Free Movement. In Mission Impossible, they get +60%. I started on First Blood to learn the ropes, just now restarted on MI difficulty and.. wow. It's a huge step up haha.

I personally think you aren't emphasising how good the voice acting, sound & music are. The atmosphere of this game is fucking tremendous. IMO the music alone is insanely good, way better than it has any right to be with a game of this quality.

 

[Beowulf]

Burst fir is all right. It is useful when:
- your enemy is Almost Dead, or Severly Wounded and you are shooting with a merc that doesn't have Marksmanship high enough to risk a single shot, so it's better to just spam bullets and count on at least one hit.
- you install one of those mods increasing number of bullets shot while using burst or auto fire - this time combine it with a merc with high Marksmanship and suddenly AR's perform like you would them to perform. You can kill someone with one burst to the head, 2 burst to the torso, or combine single shot and burst fire for the same effect. Of course it is still RNG susceptible, especially for those high level enemies in the late game.

 

[3 others]

...but the enemies don't seem to play with the same rules though. I don't think even Mouse can move 15 squares and still have enough APs for two pistol shots.

That's one of the ways they add difficulty. In Commando, enemies get +30% Free Movement. In Mission Impossible, they get +60%. I started on First Blood to learn the ropes, just now restarted on MI difficulty and.. wow. It's a huge step up haha.

I personally think you aren't emphasising how good the voice acting, sound & music are. The atmosphere of this game is fucking tremendous. IMO the music alone is insanely good, way better than it has any right to be with a game of this quality.

How to tell you're playing JA3 on higher difficulty without telling you're playing JA3 on higher difficulty

Yeah, audiovisual art direction seems to be surprisingly high quality here. It would be excusable to have Deus-ex-in-Paris -grade voice acting but every single character this far sounds at least generally believable for the setting.

Can't comment on the soundtrack. With a noisy laptop it's... unobtrusive but I'll plug some headphones in the next time.

 

[Grampy_Bone]

Burst fir is all right.

I used an M14 with burst on my main IMP merc most of the game, and it was very good. Quick scope means two full aimed bursts per round, four bullets to the head usually enough to kill 1-2 guys. He rarely missed, good at hitting partially covered targets, and even better after damage/accuracy bonuses from AGI perks. Even my snipers couldn't do better than 1 per round unless they were perfectly lined up for two kills with one bullet. Would have been even better with a G36 but I never found one, or maybe an AR15 with a crit build. FN FAL does better damage but I didn't like the high maintenance level, and an AK-74 couldn't mount a quick scope for some dumb reason.

I've said this before but the problem with burst fire is it's too accurate, so the damage nerf is necessary. I'm all for making the damage even across firing modes but only if burst fire accuracy is capped much lower and can't be aimed at limbs/heads. Being able to laser-focus four bullets into someone's head at range is absurd.

 

[Strange Fellow]

Yup, snippers op but they can only take out 1, maaaybe 2 guys. A properly kitted out merc with anything else can reliably delete multiple dudes per turn. The trouble is it's a lot riskier.

I've said this before but the problem with burst fire is it's too accurate, so the damage nerf is necessary. I'm all for making the damage even across firing modes but only if burst fire accuracy is capped much lower and can't be aimed at limbs/heads. Being able to laser-focus four bullets into someone's head at range is absurd.

This. The burst fire will be sensible only when a mod comes along that reduces accuracy and that can be combined with the restored burst damage one. To be honest, the reduced damage didn't bother me too much precisely because accuracy is artificially high, so it effectively works out about the same as it should have been where it'll still outperform single shots for mercs with high marksmanship.

 

[Beowulf]

Burst fir is all right.

I used an M14 with burst on my main IMP merc most of the game, and it was very good. Quick scope means two full aimed bursts per round, four bullets to the head usually enough to kill 1-2 guys. He rarely missed, good at hitting partially covered targets, and even better after damage/accuracy bonuses from AGI perks. Even my snipers couldn't do better than 1 per round unless they were perfectly lined up for two kills with one bullet. Would have been even better with a G36 but I never found one, or maybe an AR15 with a crit build. FN FAL does better damage but I didn't like the high maintenance level, and an AK-74 couldn't mount a quick scope for some dumb reason.

I've said this before but the problem with burst fire is it's too accurate, so the damage nerf is necessary. I'm all for making the damage even across firing modes but only if burst fire accuracy is capped much lower and can't be aimed at limbs/heads. Being able to laser-focus four bullets into someone's head at range is absurd.

Snipers should be able to score 2 headshots per turn. You can put a quickscope on the sniper rifle to assure 3 aim levels on the first shot, but truth be told late game snipers with their high MRK can score headshots without aiming, so you just need to pick those with high AGI to have at least 14 AP's per turn. Or let them drink in a bar from time to time.

 

[gogis]

Burst fir is all right.

I used an M14 with burst on my main IMP merc most of the game, and it was very good. Quick scope means two full aimed bursts per round, four bullets to the head usually enough to kill 1-2 guys. He rarely missed, good at hitting partially covered targets, and even better after damage/accuracy bonuses from AGI perks. Even my snipers couldn't do better than 1 per round unless they were perfectly lined up for two kills with one bullet. Would have been even better with a G36 but I never found one, or maybe an AR15 with a crit build. FN FAL does better damage but I didn't like the high maintenance level, and an AK-74 couldn't mount a quick scope for some dumb reason.

I've said this before but the problem with burst fire is it's too accurate, so the damage nerf is necessary. I'm all for making the damage even across firing modes but only if burst fire accuracy is capped much lower and can't be aimed at limbs/heads. Being able to laser-focus four bullets into someone's head at range is absurd.

Snipers should be able to score 2 headshots per turn. You can put a quickscope on the sniper rifle to assure 3 aim levels on the first shot, but truth be told late game snipers with their high MRK can score headshots without aiming, so you just need to pick those with high AGI to have at least 14 AP's per turn. Or let them drink in a bar from time to time.

I've actually tried it and didn't liked it. Had 96mrk sniper. 14AP is super easy in endgame with all morale buffs you have access to. You not going to have 100% HS without SOME aiming. And weather effects will ruin you.

The problem is that sniper job is to provide one-shot-kill all the time, no backsies. That's REQUIRES thermal scope. Or, just splash resources and carry 2 PSGs kitted with thermal/quick in two slots.

 

[Yosharian]

Completed Ernie Island on Mission Impossible. That was pretty fun.

 

[TheSoul]

I finished the game. , the main foundation's good but could easily be better with a few mods and updates. A pleasant surprise for me.

Main complaints

• It's undeniably a lot more "gamey" with combat and crafting. Random drops fucked me over and I only found 6 sticks of dynamite the entire game so I could barely make any explosives.
• Inventory Management is fucking awful.
• AI
• Roster is a bit too small, and the quips aren't as memorable as 2. The Imp barely says anything during the campaign and I would've preferred a few more locals to recruit for flavor.
• A bit too much backtracking if you don't know what you're doing and having a merc without high leadership makes it take way too long.
• There's a lot of pop culture references, and the ones post 2000s are especially annoying.

Main positives

• Combat flows a lot better once you get decent gear and a few perks.
• The game maintains 2's scale. We still have large squads that can be used across the map and personality (with varying quality).
• Weapon modding was well done.
• The game has some really funny moments. Some highlights include Grizzly calling the commie Chimichanga and Luigi.
• I liked a lot of the larger encounters. Biff's in particular feels like a proper challenge.

If anyone's curious, this channel is uploading a lot of the banter between mercs.

Spoiler

 

[Yosharian]

Inventory Management is fucking awful.

I got some mods on my page, one of them is basically mandatory for managing your sector stash. No fucking sort button, what were they fucking thinking??

 

[raeven]

Inventory Management is fucking awful.

I got some mods on my page, one of them is basically mandatory for managing your sector stash. No fucking sort button, what were they fucking thinking??

I don't know.. this one floored me tbh. Hoping it's coming in a patch.

 

[Cyberarmy]

Games UI is seriously lacking and one of the worst I have seen. It is kind of an achievement.

 

[Feyd Rautha]

Is Calvin Barkmore in this game?

 

[Zed Duke of Banville]

Is Calvin Barkmore in this game?

Alas, this is the principal failing of Jagged Alliance 3.

 

[ArchAngel]

Is Calvin Barkmore in this game?

Alas, this is the principal failing of Jagged Alliance 3.

It is just one of many failings.

 

[Beowulf]

Seems like some nice mods are already coming in:
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3019207726&searchtext=

This mod introduces a suppression system, which is reflected in 5 new combat effects. While a counter tracks the suppression for each unit in the background, your units and opponents can acquire the following statuses:

• Shot At
• Under Fire
• Under Heavy Fire
• Suppressed
• Pinned down

The higher the status, the fewer APs are available to your characters in the next round and, in the case of interrupts, also in this round. In addition, units run the risk of panicking or going berserk.

 

[3 others]

Yeah, having played this a bit more on the mainland, the annoyances are getting more prominent. The inventory management screen is indeed an unbelievable abomination once you start getting more stuff and soldiers to play around with, just a total misfire on a PC screen. Especially repairing equipment in a sector with multiple squads is a total nightmare since the mercs assigned to the task can only fix their own squad's stuff.

The game economy (and some leftover assumptions from JA2) is starting to bite me in the ass too. As noted before, single shots are generally superior to burst fire even in close quarters so I'm starting to run low on ammo because I stubbornly kept firing those 3 shot bursts wondering if there's something I missed. I can definitely see where the sniper strategy comes from: the Gewehr campers are picking up kills left and right while my assault squad goes around tickling goons to death. It's like the sniper rifles are the only gun in the game that actually FEELS right. They're not necessarily overpowered per se, but everything else is underpowered in their main function... killing enemies. And if single shots are the best way to get some mileage from your assault rifles, why not go all the way with sniping?

That being said, a well-placed machine gun with a bipod racks up fearsome body counts too, and melee attacks, explosives & shotguns have their moments to shine in close, but it's a bit deflating to see how the game mechanics drift towards a singular advantageous approach. Maybe someone will eventually figure out a way to balance this all out, the game certainly seems moddable.

Other thing I'm having trouble with are the Meds (but enough about Nassim Nicolas Taleb). They aren't being sold at the flea market and since I generally try to roll with how the combat goes, my guys are getting wounded often. The early game stockpiles are a long gone memory, and I may have to start getting used to having slightly injured mercs taking part in firefights. As a double-monocled long-time Jagged Alliance enjoyer, I made the assumption that wounded mercenaries are increasingly useless in combat the closer they get to death, but it doesn't seem to be the case here at all (the same applies to enemies, better nick down those "almost dead" Zulus before they run across the map to slice Igor's ear off). Wounds reduce maximum HP but that seems to be the extent of it. Maybe autistically doctoring the squad to full health after each firefight wasn't the way to go but still... Though I admit that the idea of a ragtag group of mercenaries headed by a Polish bodybuilding retard having their own Anabasis scavenging for herbs in the Central African savannah is kind of entertaining. And not that out of place, I mean. 50 years ago we had Swedish noblemen flying personally procured WWI-era biplanes in the Biafran war. It's a strange continent.

Having got all that griping out of the way, Jagged Alliance 3 is still nothing less than glorious and just oozing with incline almost everywhere. It's just as good as JA2 at the time of its release, and I'm tired of pretending that game didn't have its set of issues - or areas of improvement - especially back then.

Every night after the kids are asleep and I've slap-and-tickled my wife to her fleeting satisfaction, I sit down on my PC and hit Grand Chien with as much enjoyment as we all got from Arulco back in the day. It's a good time to be alive.

 

[ArchAngel]

Yeah, having played this a bit more on the mainland, the annoyances are getting more prominent. The inventory management screen is indeed an unbelievable abomination once you start getting more stuff and soldiers to play around with, just a total misfire on a PC screen. Especially repairing equipment in a sector with multiple squads is a total nightmare since the mercs assigned to the task can only fix their own squad's stuff.

The game economy (and some leftover assumptions from JA2) is starting to bite me in the ass too. As noted before, single shots are generally superior to burst fire even in close quarters so I'm starting to run low on ammo because I stubbornly kept firing those 3 shot bursts wondering if there's something I missed. I can definitely see where the sniper strategy comes from: the Gewehr campers are picking up kills left and right while my assault squad goes around tickling goons to death. It's like the sniper rifles are the only gun in the game that actually FEELS right. They're not necessarily overpowered per se, but everything else is underpowered in their main function... killing enemies. And if single shots are the best way to get some mileage from your assault rifles, why not go all the way with sniping?

That being said, a well-placed machine gun with a bipod racks up fearsome body counts too, and melee attacks, explosives & shotguns have their moments to shine in close, but it's a bit deflating to see how the game mechanics drift towards a singular advantageous approach. Maybe someone will eventually figure out a way to balance this all out, the game certainly seems moddable.

Other thing I'm having trouble with are the Meds (but enough about Nassim Nicolas Taleb). They aren't being sold at the flea market and since I generally try to roll with how the combat goes, my guys are getting wounded often. The early game stockpiles are a long gone memory, and I may have to start getting used to having slightly injured mercs taking part in firefights. As a double-monocled long-time Jagged Alliance enjoyer, I made the assumption that wounded mercenaries are increasingly useless in combat the closer they get to death, but it doesn't seem to be the case here at all (the same applies to enemies, better nick down those "almost dead" Zulus before they run across the map to slice Igor's ear off). Wounds reduce maximum HP but that seems to be the extent of it. Maybe autistically doctoring the squad to full health after each firefight wasn't the way to go but still... Though I admit that the idea of a ragtag group of mercenaries headed by a Polish bodybuilding retard having their own Anabasis scavenging for herbs in the Central African savannah is kind of entertaining. And not that out of place, I mean. 50 years ago we had Swedish noblemen flying personally procured WWI-era biplanes in the Biafran war. It's a strange continent.

Having got all that griping out of the way, Jagged Alliance 3 is still nothing less than glorious and just oozing with incline almost everywhere. It's just as good as JA2 at the time of its release, and I'm tired of pretending that game didn't have its set of issues - or areas of improvement - especially back then.

Every night after the kids are asleep and I've slap-and-tickled my wife to her fleeting satisfaction, I sit down on my PC and hit Grand Chien with as much enjoyment as we all got from Arulco back in the day. It's a good time to be alive.

Switch to JA2 1.13 and you will skip the kids and wife and go straight for gaming.

 

[Heroic Liberator]

 

[Lyre Mors]

Eh, an interesting take from a veteran Jagged Alliance 2 fan, but he's also coming from the "I'll replay the same games forever" perspective. Who asked for this game? People who aren't satisfied with playing the same stuff over and over again, I guess. I also think he's a little hard on the setting and writing. I've had a plenty of genuine laugh out loud moments, and find most of the characters to be quite memorable.

Overall, he seems to enjoy the game. It's just diminished when placed in the shadow to his favorite game of all time. One of the few videos of his I find myself mostly unsatisfied with.

 

[ArchAngel]

Storyfag complains about story and characters but says combat is OK. LOL wtf!
Storyfags everywhere!