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Lyric Suite

Converting to Islam
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Messages
51,105
So some dude in PvP dropped 999 golden centepes.

This is lame it's basically all cheaters in Limgrave. Was low level PvP like this in previous Souls games?
 

mediocrepoet

En français: poètemédiocre!
Patron
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Sep 30, 2009
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Combatfag: Gold box / Pathfinder
Codex 2012 MCA Project: Eternity Divinity: Original Sin 2
So some dude in PvP dropped 999 golden centepes.

This is lame it's basically all cheaters in Limgrave. Was low level PvP like this in previous Souls games?
After a certain point, yeah. You find the occasional legit person, but a lot of crap like that. It sucks.
 

Caim

Arcane
Joined
Aug 1, 2013
Messages
10,153
Location
Dutchland
So some dude in PvP dropped 999 golden centepes.

This is lame it's basically all cheaters in Limgrave. Was low level PvP like this in previous Souls games?
DS1 was purely level based scaling: if you managed to run through the game as a SL1 Pyromancer you could get the stuff you need to one-shot newbies in the Undead Burg. DS2 instead had Soul Memory, which was based on how many souls you had picked up. Pick up a lot and you'll be facing tougher enemies. DS3 and DS1's remaster both have a system that combines character level with weapon upgrade level, so no remaining SL1 and getting a fully upgraded weapon to clown on fresh characters. Elden Ring also has this system.
 

mediocrepoet

En français: poètemédiocre!
Patron
Joined
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Messages
5,228
Location
Combatfag: Gold box / Pathfinder
Codex 2012 MCA Project: Eternity Divinity: Original Sin 2
So some dude in PvP dropped 999 golden centepes.

This is lame it's basically all cheaters in Limgrave. Was low level PvP like this in previous Souls games?
DS1 was purely level based scaling: if you managed to run through the game as a SL1 Pyromancer you could get the stuff you need to one-shot newbies in the Undead Burg. DS2 instead had Soul Memory, which was based on how many souls you had picked up. Pick up a lot and you'll be facing tougher enemies. DS3 and DS1's remaster both have a system that combines character level with weapon upgrade level, so no remaining SL1 and getting a fully upgraded weapon to clown on fresh characters. Elden Ring also has this system.

No, but you can upgrade to the highest level allowed by your bracket and have end game items that are generally better than other available items at that time, whether because of stat boosting, better weapon arts, etc. This is even more of an issue in Elden Ring than it was in DS2 or 3.
 

Lim-Dûl

Educated
Joined
Apr 11, 2022
Messages
215
So some dude in PvP dropped 999 golden centepes.

This is lame it's basically all cheaters in Limgrave. Was low level PvP like this in previous Souls games?
The only souls game I played on pc was 2, and I played a lot of pvp in that, I rarely came across cheaters. Maybe a couple per week.
 

Bloodeyes

Arcane
Joined
Jan 30, 2007
Messages
2,650
I've taken a day off the game, but its been on my mind. I'm thinking about Malenia, planning how I'd beat her. I think I've got it. Here's the idea:

Talismans: Blue dancer charm, claw talisman, lord of blood's favor, kindred of rot's exultation.
Clothing: Raptor's black feathers and nothing else, not even trousers.
Armaments: Primary weapon heavy star fist with royal knight's resolve, secondary dagger with seppuku. Offhand Clawmark seal.

At the start of the fight I'd throw a shit pot away from her to poison myself, eat exulted flesh, cast golden vow and FGMS then seppuku. I've seen videos where at the start Malenia takes ages to aggro and just slow walks towards you. So hopefully I'd have time to do this. From there I'd have 20 seconds to switch to the fists, RKR and jump attack her. I'm hoping this would one shot her first phase, though a second or even third jump attack may be needed. I'd need to practice my buffing sequence because I only get one chance to beat Malenia first try. If it doesn't work I may as well just fight her properly with my normal gear.

In the second phase I'm thinking I run away. I think she does a big attack at the start of the phase and this may give me time to summon Black Knife Tiche and drink a blue. From there I figured I'd just dodge roll like crazy until she aggros on Tiche. Once she's on Tiche I should try to proc frost with Dragonice, then probably run away more until I can set up again. From there I've seen a rumor that Rotten breath is affected by blue dancer, given it's pure physical. So maybe seppuku and shit pot again and try that? I know she's immune to rot, but if she's aggrod on Tiche it could be a safe way to get the finish. Or I could just try to jump attack her back when she's attacking Tiche. That could be a lot simpler, but it's risky because I've seen a lot of clips of her one shotting people.

The visualization phase is hard because I've never fought her, only seen vids. It's a high risk plan and very precise. Not much chance I'd get it first try. But how awesome would it be if I did?
Exalted Flesh and FGMS are mutually exclusive and overwrite each other. Malenia has 18 473 HP with 123 flat defence and 10% physical reduction so you need to be able to do over 20 800 raw damage in a single attack if you want to one-shot her.

Not sure it's possible to go that high without powerstancing and buffing both weapons with RKR (which boosts both weapons by 224%). Don't think you can do this with fist weapons as the buff disappears if you 2-hand the other weapon, but I've never tried myself.

Skip BDC (Raptor's Black Feathers takes you above the first soft cap, will not give the full +20%) and replace it with Red-Feathered Branchsword (+20% damage below 20% HP) if you disregard defence. Go for Bloodboil Aromatic over Exalted Flesh/FGMS for a 30% boost to physical damage. Do a hardswap with Commander's Standard instead of Golden Vow. Wear the White Mask or Mushroom Crown for an extra 10% on top of LoB/KoR. Including 2x RKR and assuming a 230 MV for a jumping L1 you'd need 745 unbuffed physical AR on each weapon you powerstance assuming you're able to get off the attack before any buff expires. If you don't want to be below 20% HP use the Ritual Sword Talisman instead for +10% when at full HP, though that increases the unbuffed AR requirement to 812.

Also, you can't just run straight away from Scarlet Aeonia as she can reach you no matter how far you run. The best strategy is to run directly below her to trigger the dive and then keep running away from her. I think you might be able to out run the delayed shockwave, but I usually roll to be on the safe side.

E: Updated the required ARs as I initially forgot to add her flat defence twice. Once for each weapon.

E2: If you powerstance +25 Heavy Guts' Greatswords you need 63 STR to reach 745 and 80 STR to reach 812. With Heavy Giant Crushers you need 51/66 STR.
Thanks so much! I don't have two Guts Greatswords so I guess I'll try powerstancing Giant crusher with prelate's inferno crosier. I just checked and thankfully I can carry both while medium without needing great jar's. I can even wear trousers! But not a helm, so that's I problem. I'd need to either grind or do a temporary respec to add endurance for the mushroom crown. At max upgrade level both weapons would exceed 812 AR single handed with my current STR score.

One thing about your post confuses me: How would I use the ritual sword when I'd need to poison myself? Or would I not need to do this?

As I write this I'm realizing how insanely precise all of this is and thinking I should simplify the process as much as possible, to minimize the number of variables and opportunities for mistakes. I'll be very tense and even if I practice I'm likely to fuck something up.

I'm wondering if I should skip the poison and the mushroom crown and instead go with the white mask, powerstance my Guts Greatsword with a watchdog's greatsword (Better range than the hammers, less practice needed to not miss), and attack multiple times instead of going for the one shot.

My crystal tear gives me heath regen and a boost to health, and Morgott's great rune boosts health. I've got 40 vigor. Maybe I could survive getting hit by her if I'm quick with my reds. I rarely win boss fights without getting hit, let alone against frickin Malenia. I could also do a temporary respec before the fight and dump FTH, DEX, arcane and INT into vigor. This would give me 29 extra points, so I could have 60 vigor and STR above 80. If I'm not casting in the fight I wouldn't need the FTH and I'd put everything back after. I could also drop mind to the minimum needed to summon, or perhaps increase it enough to summon and buff without needing a blue. I think I like the second better as it's less steps under pressure.

So I could use ritual sword, claw talisman, raptor's black feathers and lord of blood's exultation. 4th talisman could be dragoncrest greatshield or whatever would be best for survivability.

Buff with commander's standard, bloodboil aromatic and seppuku then immediately drink a red, double RKR and attack. Obviously this would take more attacks but it seems like it would have a smaller margin of error. I've seen the Malenia one shot and it's so precise it probably would take fewer attempts to fight her legitimately. So maybe I should go for a four or five shot instead, relying on the summon to draw aggro so I can set up carefully and attack her back. The one shot isn't important, the goal is first try with the most bullshit tactics possible - nothing less than what is deserved by reportedly one of the most bullshit enemies in the Souls franchise.

Further questions: Is there a respawning enemy in the world with similar defense to Malenia's that's near to a site of grace? It would be good to do some trial runs with the buffs and check the damage first.

Also, I'm planning to distract with a summon during the second phase. I don't care too much about how much damage the summon does, just their aggression and survivability. I can't find a table for max upgraded summons listing their HP, but I'm thinking the jellyfish could work. Its very good at drawing aggro and quite tanky, though I'm not sure how its HP compares to Mimic tear or Tiche who are both great at drawing aggro but very mobile, meaning they make enemies jump all over the place which often makes them quite tricky to hit, even from behind.

Does this sound realistic? Or would she just immediately kill a +10 jellyfish? Can I even find grave glovewart 10 before fighting her? I've found 3 ghost 10s but my highest grave summon is 7 at the moment.
 
Last edited:

Bloodeyes

Arcane
Joined
Jan 30, 2007
Messages
2,650
This thing basically nullifies it and gives you the opportunity to smack the shit out of him while he does that thing which basicallys cuts down his second phase to nothing:

https://eldenring.wiki.fextralife.com/Purifying+Crystal+Tear

Or you can just eat it by that point you should have a large supply of healing potions, far more than you'll realistically use in the fight (if you need to heal that much you most likely won't actually beat him).

Yeah I've already been informed about this Crystal Tear, I'll be using it next time. I have 11 healing flasks and 2 mana flasks, as I love using that Rivers of Blood weapon art a lot. I don't know if this is close to maximum I can get, but it did seem plenty until this fight.
14 flasks is the max, AFAIK he max sacred tear level is +12. You can have that before where you are in the game if you explore. I've got 14 flasks with I think 5 leftover golden seeds and I'm not as far through as you.
 

Bloodeyes

Arcane
Joined
Jan 30, 2007
Messages
2,650
I've been trying to get an iron greatsword. This fucking sucks. The red maned misbegotten is so far from the site of grace and the drop rate must be super low. I didn't have any chicken feet so I burned a couple of larval tears to dump everything into having 99 arcane. It didn't work. I must have killed him 50 or 60 times. I gave up and changed my stats back but I'm going to give it another go when I have the energy. As much as I have loved the Guts I want a handier option, and the IG has AR that's almost comparable while being a size category lower. I'm thinking it would make a great weapon for NG+, if I can ever get one.
 

NJClaw

OoOoOoOoOoh
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Pronouns: rusts/rusty
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I'm Ridin' with Biden I'm Ridin' with Biden
I've been trying to get an iron greatsword. This fucking sucks. The red maned misbegotten is so far from the site of grace and the drop rate must be super low. I didn't have any chicken feet so I burned a couple of larval tears to dump everything into having 99 arcane. It didn't work. I must have killed him 50 or 60 times.
This doesn't make any sense. Even with mediocre Arcane, I never had to kill him more than 5-6 times to get the sword by just wearing the silver scarab. And it wasn't a single lucky run, I've done it at least 5 times.

If you want to switch to greatswords, the Gargoyle's Greatsword has a very similar attack power (slightly higher for very high STR scores).
 

Bloodeyes

Arcane
Joined
Jan 30, 2007
Messages
2,650
I've been trying to get an iron greatsword. This fucking sucks. The red maned misbegotten is so far from the site of grace and the drop rate must be super low. I didn't have any chicken feet so I burned a couple of larval tears to dump everything into having 99 arcane. It didn't work. I must have killed him 50 or 60 times.
This doesn't make any sense. Even with mediocre Arcane, I never had to kill him more than 5-6 times to get the sword by just wearing the silver scarab. And it wasn't a single lucky run, I've done it at least 5 times.

If you want to switch to greatswords, the Gargoyle's Greatsword has a very similar attack power (slightly higher for very high STR scores).
I hate how it looks. I really want to get an iron. I did want 2 but holy shit I can't stand the grind. Am I even killing the right guy? The red maned misbegotten on the road near the capital. The one with the blind dog next to him.
 

Alrik

Educated
Joined
May 14, 2020
Messages
68
I've taken a day off the game, but its been on my mind. I'm thinking about Malenia, planning how I'd beat her. I think I've got it. Here's the idea:

Talismans: Blue dancer charm, claw talisman, lord of blood's favor, kindred of rot's exultation.
Clothing: Raptor's black feathers and nothing else, not even trousers.
Armaments: Primary weapon heavy star fist with royal knight's resolve, secondary dagger with seppuku. Offhand Clawmark seal.

At the start of the fight I'd throw a shit pot away from her to poison myself, eat exulted flesh, cast golden vow and FGMS then seppuku. I've seen videos where at the start Malenia takes ages to aggro and just slow walks towards you. So hopefully I'd have time to do this. From there I'd have 20 seconds to switch to the fists, RKR and jump attack her. I'm hoping this would one shot her first phase, though a second or even third jump attack may be needed. I'd need to practice my buffing sequence because I only get one chance to beat Malenia first try. If it doesn't work I may as well just fight her properly with my normal gear.

In the second phase I'm thinking I run away. I think she does a big attack at the start of the phase and this may give me time to summon Black Knife Tiche and drink a blue. From there I figured I'd just dodge roll like crazy until she aggros on Tiche. Once she's on Tiche I should try to proc frost with Dragonice, then probably run away more until I can set up again. From there I've seen a rumor that Rotten breath is affected by blue dancer, given it's pure physical. So maybe seppuku and shit pot again and try that? I know she's immune to rot, but if she's aggrod on Tiche it could be a safe way to get the finish. Or I could just try to jump attack her back when she's attacking Tiche. That could be a lot simpler, but it's risky because I've seen a lot of clips of her one shotting people.

The visualization phase is hard because I've never fought her, only seen vids. It's a high risk plan and very precise. Not much chance I'd get it first try. But how awesome would it be if I did?
Exalted Flesh and FGMS are mutually exclusive and overwrite each other. Malenia has 18 473 HP with 123 flat defence and 10% physical reduction so you need to be able to do over 20 800 raw damage in a single attack if you want to one-shot her.

Not sure it's possible to go that high without powerstancing and buffing both weapons with RKR (which boosts both weapons by 224%). Don't think you can do this with fist weapons as the buff disappears if you 2-hand the other weapon, but I've never tried myself.

Skip BDC (Raptor's Black Feathers takes you above the first soft cap, will not give the full +20%) and replace it with Red-Feathered Branchsword (+20% damage below 20% HP) if you disregard defence. Go for Bloodboil Aromatic over Exalted Flesh/FGMS for a 30% boost to physical damage. Do a hardswap with Commander's Standard instead of Golden Vow. Wear the White Mask or Mushroom Crown for an extra 10% on top of LoB/KoR. Including 2x RKR and assuming a 230 MV for a jumping L1 you'd need 745 unbuffed physical AR on each weapon you powerstance assuming you're able to get off the attack before any buff expires. If you don't want to be below 20% HP use the Ritual Sword Talisman instead for +10% when at full HP, though that increases the unbuffed AR requirement to 812.

Also, you can't just run straight away from Scarlet Aeonia as she can reach you no matter how far you run. The best strategy is to run directly below her to trigger the dive and then keep running away from her. I think you might be able to out run the delayed shockwave, but I usually roll to be on the safe side.

E: Updated the required ARs as I initially forgot to add her flat defence twice. Once for each weapon.

E2: If you powerstance +25 Heavy Guts' Greatswords you need 63 STR to reach 745 and 80 STR to reach 812. With Heavy Giant Crushers you need 51/66 STR.
Thanks so much! I don't have two Guts Greatswords so I guess I'll try powerstancing Giant crusher with prelate's inferno crosier. I just checked and thankfully I can carry both while medium without needing great jar's. I can even wear trousers! But not a helm, so that's I problem. I'd need to either grind or do a temporary respec to add endurance for the mushroom crown. At max upgrade level both weapons would exceed 812 AR single handed with my current STR score.

One thing about your post confuses me: How would I use the ritual sword when I'd need to poison myself? Or would I not need to do this?

As I write this I'm realizing how insanely precise all of this is and thinking I should simplify the process as much as possible, to minimize the number of variables and opportunities for mistakes. I'll be very tense and even if I practice I'm likely to fuck something up.

I'm wondering if I should skip the poison and the mushroom crown and instead go with the white mask, powerstance my Guts Greatsword with a watchdog's greatsword (Better range than the hammers, less practice needed to not miss), and attack multiple times instead of going for the one shot.

My crystal tear gives me heath regen and a boost to health, and Morgott's great rune boosts health. I've got 40 vigor. Maybe I could survive getting hit by her if I'm quick with my reds. I rarely win boss fights without getting hit, let alone against frickin Malenia. I could also do a temporary respec before the fight and dump FTH, DEX, arcane and INT into vigor. This would give me 29 extra points, so I could have 60 vigor and STR above 80. If I'm not casting in the fight I wouldn't need the FTH and I'd put everything back after. I could also drop mind to the minimum needed to summon, or perhaps increase it enough to summon and buff without needing a blue. I think I like the second better as it's less steps under pressure.

So I could use ritual sword, claw talisman, raptor's black feathers and lord of blood's exultation. 4th talisman could be dragoncrest greatshield or whatever would be best for survivability.

Buff with commander's standard, bloodboil aromatic and seppuku then immediately drink a red, double RKR and attack. Obviously this would take more attacks but it seems like it would have a smaller margin of error. I've seen the Malenia one shot and it's so precise it probably would take fewer attempts to fight her legitimately. So maybe I should go for a four or five shot instead, relying on the summon to draw aggro so I can set up carefully and attack her back. The one shot isn't important, the goal is first try with the most bullshit tactics possible - nothing less than what is deserved by reportedly one of the most bullshit enemies in the Souls franchise.

Further questions: Is there a respawning enemy in the world with similar defense to Malenia's that's near to a site of grace? It would be good to do some trial runs with the buffs and check the damage first.

Also, I'm planning to distract with a summon during the second phase. I don't care too much about how much damage the summon does, just their aggression and survivability. I can't find a table for max upgraded summons listing their HP, but I'm thinking the jellyfish could work. Its very good at drawing aggro and quite tanky, though I'm not sure how its HP compares to Mimic tear or Tiche who are both great at drawing aggro but very mobile, meaning they make enemies jump all over the place which often makes them quite tricky to hit, even from behind.

Does this sound realistic? Or would she just immediately kill a +10 jellyfish? Can I even find grave glovewart 10 before fighting her? I've found 3 ghost 10s but my highest grave summon is 7 at the moment.
Good point regarding poison. You might be able to counteract it with regen, but I'm not sure that would work (might fluctuate between slight damage and full HP) and even then would likely require a hefty FAI investment as I don't think Bestial Vitality or Crimsonburst Tear are enough.

Probably better to skip Ritual Sword then as it would require healing after the Seppuku bleed trigger which would decrease your window to buff and land the attack. But I'm not sure what you could replace it with to counteract the loss of the +10% damage boost. Losing that 10% puts you at 894 AR requirement which is 2x Giant Crusher at 90 STR. The Crozier has a lower AR and as such you need higher STR if it's one of your weapons, but the average AR of Crusher+Crozier should be enough at 97 STR.

In any case I'd recommend you test the setup on something like the Omen at Subterranean Shunning-Grounds to see that you're doing enough damage. They have 117.2 flat defence and 0% negation so you likely need to do 20 684 damage in one attack on them (IIRC regular mobs show you unlimited damage numbers above their max HP).
 

Alrik

Educated
Joined
May 14, 2020
Messages
68
I've taken a day off the game, but its been on my mind. I'm thinking about Malenia, planning how I'd beat her. I think I've got it. Here's the idea:

Talismans: Blue dancer charm, claw talisman, lord of blood's favor, kindred of rot's exultation.
Clothing: Raptor's black feathers and nothing else, not even trousers.
Armaments: Primary weapon heavy star fist with royal knight's resolve, secondary dagger with seppuku. Offhand Clawmark seal.

At the start of the fight I'd throw a shit pot away from her to poison myself, eat exulted flesh, cast golden vow and FGMS then seppuku. I've seen videos where at the start Malenia takes ages to aggro and just slow walks towards you. So hopefully I'd have time to do this. From there I'd have 20 seconds to switch to the fists, RKR and jump attack her. I'm hoping this would one shot her first phase, though a second or even third jump attack may be needed. I'd need to practice my buffing sequence because I only get one chance to beat Malenia first try. If it doesn't work I may as well just fight her properly with my normal gear.

In the second phase I'm thinking I run away. I think she does a big attack at the start of the phase and this may give me time to summon Black Knife Tiche and drink a blue. From there I figured I'd just dodge roll like crazy until she aggros on Tiche. Once she's on Tiche I should try to proc frost with Dragonice, then probably run away more until I can set up again. From there I've seen a rumor that Rotten breath is affected by blue dancer, given it's pure physical. So maybe seppuku and shit pot again and try that? I know she's immune to rot, but if she's aggrod on Tiche it could be a safe way to get the finish. Or I could just try to jump attack her back when she's attacking Tiche. That could be a lot simpler, but it's risky because I've seen a lot of clips of her one shotting people.

The visualization phase is hard because I've never fought her, only seen vids. It's a high risk plan and very precise. Not much chance I'd get it first try. But how awesome would it be if I did?
Exalted Flesh and FGMS are mutually exclusive and overwrite each other. Malenia has 18 473 HP with 123 flat defence and 10% physical reduction so you need to be able to do over 20 800 raw damage in a single attack if you want to one-shot her.

Not sure it's possible to go that high without powerstancing and buffing both weapons with RKR (which boosts both weapons by 224%). Don't think you can do this with fist weapons as the buff disappears if you 2-hand the other weapon, but I've never tried myself.

Skip BDC (Raptor's Black Feathers takes you above the first soft cap, will not give the full +20%) and replace it with Red-Feathered Branchsword (+20% damage below 20% HP) if you disregard defence. Go for Bloodboil Aromatic over Exalted Flesh/FGMS for a 30% boost to physical damage. Do a hardswap with Commander's Standard instead of Golden Vow. Wear the White Mask or Mushroom Crown for an extra 10% on top of LoB/KoR. Including 2x RKR and assuming a 230 MV for a jumping L1 you'd need 745 unbuffed physical AR on each weapon you powerstance assuming you're able to get off the attack before any buff expires. If you don't want to be below 20% HP use the Ritual Sword Talisman instead for +10% when at full HP, though that increases the unbuffed AR requirement to 812.

Also, you can't just run straight away from Scarlet Aeonia as she can reach you no matter how far you run. The best strategy is to run directly below her to trigger the dive and then keep running away from her. I think you might be able to out run the delayed shockwave, but I usually roll to be on the safe side.

E: Updated the required ARs as I initially forgot to add her flat defence twice. Once for each weapon.

E2: If you powerstance +25 Heavy Guts' Greatswords you need 63 STR to reach 745 and 80 STR to reach 812. With Heavy Giant Crushers you need 51/66 STR.
Thanks so much! I don't have two Guts Greatswords so I guess I'll try powerstancing Giant crusher with prelate's inferno crosier. I just checked and thankfully I can carry both while medium without needing great jar's. I can even wear trousers! But not a helm, so that's I problem. I'd need to either grind or do a temporary respec to add endurance for the mushroom crown. At max upgrade level both weapons would exceed 812 AR single handed with my current STR score.

One thing about your post confuses me: How would I use the ritual sword when I'd need to poison myself? Or would I not need to do this?

As I write this I'm realizing how insanely precise all of this is and thinking I should simplify the process as much as possible, to minimize the number of variables and opportunities for mistakes. I'll be very tense and even if I practice I'm likely to fuck something up.

I'm wondering if I should skip the poison and the mushroom crown and instead go with the white mask, powerstance my Guts Greatsword with a watchdog's greatsword (Better range than the hammers, less practice needed to not miss), and attack multiple times instead of going for the one shot.

My crystal tear gives me heath regen and a boost to health, and Morgott's great rune boosts health. I've got 40 vigor. Maybe I could survive getting hit by her if I'm quick with my reds. I rarely win boss fights without getting hit, let alone against frickin Malenia. I could also do a temporary respec before the fight and dump FTH, DEX, arcane and INT into vigor. This would give me 29 extra points, so I could have 60 vigor and STR above 80. If I'm not casting in the fight I wouldn't need the FTH and I'd put everything back after. I could also drop mind to the minimum needed to summon, or perhaps increase it enough to summon and buff without needing a blue. I think I like the second better as it's less steps under pressure.

So I could use ritual sword, claw talisman, raptor's black feathers and lord of blood's exultation. 4th talisman could be dragoncrest greatshield or whatever would be best for survivability.

Buff with commander's standard, bloodboil aromatic and seppuku then immediately drink a red, double RKR and attack. Obviously this would take more attacks but it seems like it would have a smaller margin of error. I've seen the Malenia one shot and it's so precise it probably would take fewer attempts to fight her legitimately. So maybe I should go for a four or five shot instead, relying on the summon to draw aggro so I can set up carefully and attack her back. The one shot isn't important, the goal is first try with the most bullshit tactics possible - nothing less than what is deserved by reportedly one of the most bullshit enemies in the Souls franchise.

Further questions: Is there a respawning enemy in the world with similar defense to Malenia's that's near to a site of grace? It would be good to do some trial runs with the buffs and check the damage first.

Also, I'm planning to distract with a summon during the second phase. I don't care too much about how much damage the summon does, just their aggression and survivability. I can't find a table for max upgraded summons listing their HP, but I'm thinking the jellyfish could work. Its very good at drawing aggro and quite tanky, though I'm not sure how its HP compares to Mimic tear or Tiche who are both great at drawing aggro but very mobile, meaning they make enemies jump all over the place which often makes them quite tricky to hit, even from behind.

Does this sound realistic? Or would she just immediately kill a +10 jellyfish? Can I even find grave glovewart 10 before fighting her? I've found 3 ghost 10s but my highest grave summon is 7 at the moment.
Good point regarding poison. You might be able to counteract it with regen, but I'm not sure that would work (might fluctuate between slight damage and full HP) and even then would likely require a hefty FAI investment as I don't think Bestial Vitality or Crimsonburst Tear are enough.

Probably better to skip Ritual Sword then as it would require healing after the Seppuku bleed trigger which would decrease your window to buff and land the attack. But I'm not sure what you could replace it with to counteract the loss of the +10% damage boost. Losing that 10% puts you at 894 AR requirement which is 2x Giant Crusher at 90 STR. The Crozier has a lower AR and as such you need higher STR if it's one of your weapons, but the average AR of Crusher+Crozier should be enough at 97 STR.

In any case I'd recommend you test the setup on something like the Omen at Subterranean Shunning-Grounds to see that you're doing enough damage. They have 117.2 flat defence and 0% negation so you likely need to do 20 684 damage in one attack on them (IIRC regular mobs show you unlimited damage numbers above their max HP).

Honestly, it's probably easier to go the Flame Art/Fire route as her fire negation is 0% and you get a free +20% from the flask (Flame Art might be better than Fire in this case as the damage is skewed more towards fire rather than being an even split). You have to replace Bloodboil with FGMS though and make sure not to attack her while she's wet from the puddle in the middle of the arena (not sure if the effect wears off as soon as she steps out of it or if it's delayed). Oil pots would be a decent bet for a significant damage boost in this scenario, but you aren't going to hit her unless she's in an attack animation so you likely don't have the time to do it before your buffs expire.
 

NJClaw

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I hate how it looks. I really want to get an iron. I did want 2 but holy shit I can't stand the grind. Am I even killing the right guy? The red maned misbegotten on the road near the capital. The one with the blind dog next to him.
Try to kill the one in the Haligtree. I don't want to spoil you too much if you haven't been there, so maybe once you reach the boss of the area check the wiki.
 

Bloodeyes

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So I just fought the fire giant. The camera won. I did massive damage to him, it only took 3 or 4 hits to get him to phase 2, and the same to finish him. He wasn't one shotting me, I could survive his hits and he gave me plenty of time to heal. But it took me six fucking tries because I couldn't see shit most of the time. That fight annoyed me. Why do I have to go for the burning hands in phase 2? Like, just target the other leg moron! I hate getting knocked all over the place and not being able to see shit. Fights against big things are the worst.

Still he's dead and I have another remembrance to add to my collection. I haven't used any without duping them, so I've got all the ones I've earned.
 

Bloodeyes

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I've taken a day off the game, but its been on my mind. I'm thinking about Malenia, planning how I'd beat her. I think I've got it. Here's the idea:

Talismans: Blue dancer charm, claw talisman, lord of blood's favor, kindred of rot's exultation.
Clothing: Raptor's black feathers and nothing else, not even trousers.
Armaments: Primary weapon heavy star fist with royal knight's resolve, secondary dagger with seppuku. Offhand Clawmark seal.

At the start of the fight I'd throw a shit pot away from her to poison myself, eat exulted flesh, cast golden vow and FGMS then seppuku. I've seen videos where at the start Malenia takes ages to aggro and just slow walks towards you. So hopefully I'd have time to do this. From there I'd have 20 seconds to switch to the fists, RKR and jump attack her. I'm hoping this would one shot her first phase, though a second or even third jump attack may be needed. I'd need to practice my buffing sequence because I only get one chance to beat Malenia first try. If it doesn't work I may as well just fight her properly with my normal gear.

In the second phase I'm thinking I run away. I think she does a big attack at the start of the phase and this may give me time to summon Black Knife Tiche and drink a blue. From there I figured I'd just dodge roll like crazy until she aggros on Tiche. Once she's on Tiche I should try to proc frost with Dragonice, then probably run away more until I can set up again. From there I've seen a rumor that Rotten breath is affected by blue dancer, given it's pure physical. So maybe seppuku and shit pot again and try that? I know she's immune to rot, but if she's aggrod on Tiche it could be a safe way to get the finish. Or I could just try to jump attack her back when she's attacking Tiche. That could be a lot simpler, but it's risky because I've seen a lot of clips of her one shotting people.

The visualization phase is hard because I've never fought her, only seen vids. It's a high risk plan and very precise. Not much chance I'd get it first try. But how awesome would it be if I did?
Exalted Flesh and FGMS are mutually exclusive and overwrite each other. Malenia has 18 473 HP with 123 flat defence and 10% physical reduction so you need to be able to do over 20 800 raw damage in a single attack if you want to one-shot her.

Not sure it's possible to go that high without powerstancing and buffing both weapons with RKR (which boosts both weapons by 224%). Don't think you can do this with fist weapons as the buff disappears if you 2-hand the other weapon, but I've never tried myself.

Skip BDC (Raptor's Black Feathers takes you above the first soft cap, will not give the full +20%) and replace it with Red-Feathered Branchsword (+20% damage below 20% HP) if you disregard defence. Go for Bloodboil Aromatic over Exalted Flesh/FGMS for a 30% boost to physical damage. Do a hardswap with Commander's Standard instead of Golden Vow. Wear the White Mask or Mushroom Crown for an extra 10% on top of LoB/KoR. Including 2x RKR and assuming a 230 MV for a jumping L1 you'd need 745 unbuffed physical AR on each weapon you powerstance assuming you're able to get off the attack before any buff expires. If you don't want to be below 20% HP use the Ritual Sword Talisman instead for +10% when at full HP, though that increases the unbuffed AR requirement to 812.

Also, you can't just run straight away from Scarlet Aeonia as she can reach you no matter how far you run. The best strategy is to run directly below her to trigger the dive and then keep running away from her. I think you might be able to out run the delayed shockwave, but I usually roll to be on the safe side.

E: Updated the required ARs as I initially forgot to add her flat defence twice. Once for each weapon.

E2: If you powerstance +25 Heavy Guts' Greatswords you need 63 STR to reach 745 and 80 STR to reach 812. With Heavy Giant Crushers you need 51/66 STR.
Thanks so much! I don't have two Guts Greatswords so I guess I'll try powerstancing Giant crusher with prelate's inferno crosier. I just checked and thankfully I can carry both while medium without needing great jar's. I can even wear trousers! But not a helm, so that's I problem. I'd need to either grind or do a temporary respec to add endurance for the mushroom crown. At max upgrade level both weapons would exceed 812 AR single handed with my current STR score.

One thing about your post confuses me: How would I use the ritual sword when I'd need to poison myself? Or would I not need to do this?

As I write this I'm realizing how insanely precise all of this is and thinking I should simplify the process as much as possible, to minimize the number of variables and opportunities for mistakes. I'll be very tense and even if I practice I'm likely to fuck something up.

I'm wondering if I should skip the poison and the mushroom crown and instead go with the white mask, powerstance my Guts Greatsword with a watchdog's greatsword (Better range than the hammers, less practice needed to not miss), and attack multiple times instead of going for the one shot.

My crystal tear gives me heath regen and a boost to health, and Morgott's great rune boosts health. I've got 40 vigor. Maybe I could survive getting hit by her if I'm quick with my reds. I rarely win boss fights without getting hit, let alone against frickin Malenia. I could also do a temporary respec before the fight and dump FTH, DEX, arcane and INT into vigor. This would give me 29 extra points, so I could have 60 vigor and STR above 80. If I'm not casting in the fight I wouldn't need the FTH and I'd put everything back after. I could also drop mind to the minimum needed to summon, or perhaps increase it enough to summon and buff without needing a blue. I think I like the second better as it's less steps under pressure.

So I could use ritual sword, claw talisman, raptor's black feathers and lord of blood's exultation. 4th talisman could be dragoncrest greatshield or whatever would be best for survivability.

Buff with commander's standard, bloodboil aromatic and seppuku then immediately drink a red, double RKR and attack. Obviously this would take more attacks but it seems like it would have a smaller margin of error. I've seen the Malenia one shot and it's so precise it probably would take fewer attempts to fight her legitimately. So maybe I should go for a four or five shot instead, relying on the summon to draw aggro so I can set up carefully and attack her back. The one shot isn't important, the goal is first try with the most bullshit tactics possible - nothing less than what is deserved by reportedly one of the most bullshit enemies in the Souls franchise.

Further questions: Is there a respawning enemy in the world with similar defense to Malenia's that's near to a site of grace? It would be good to do some trial runs with the buffs and check the damage first.

Also, I'm planning to distract with a summon during the second phase. I don't care too much about how much damage the summon does, just their aggression and survivability. I can't find a table for max upgraded summons listing their HP, but I'm thinking the jellyfish could work. Its very good at drawing aggro and quite tanky, though I'm not sure how its HP compares to Mimic tear or Tiche who are both great at drawing aggro but very mobile, meaning they make enemies jump all over the place which often makes them quite tricky to hit, even from behind.

Does this sound realistic? Or would she just immediately kill a +10 jellyfish? Can I even find grave glovewart 10 before fighting her? I've found 3 ghost 10s but my highest grave summon is 7 at the moment.
Good point regarding poison. You might be able to counteract it with regen, but I'm not sure that would work (might fluctuate between slight damage and full HP) and even then would likely require a hefty FAI investment as I don't think Bestial Vitality or Crimsonburst Tear are enough.

Probably better to skip Ritual Sword then as it would require healing after the Seppuku bleed trigger which would decrease your window to buff and land the attack. But I'm not sure what you could replace it with to counteract the loss of the +10% damage boost. Losing that 10% puts you at 894 AR requirement which is 2x Giant Crusher at 90 STR. The Crozier has a lower AR and as such you need higher STR if it's one of your weapons, but the average AR of Crusher+Crozier should be enough at 97 STR.

In any case I'd recommend you test the setup on something like the Omen at Subterranean Shunning-Grounds to see that you're doing enough damage. They have 117.2 flat defence and 0% negation so you likely need to do 20 684 damage in one attack on them (IIRC regular mobs show you unlimited damage numbers above their max HP).
Ok... so with my normal greatsword and two buffs I'm doing 2630. That's... rather shit actually. This is with the sword at +22 and my STR at 74 of a planned 80. That means if I just fought her as I am I'd need around 10 hits to get the kill. That doesn't sound like much but it's a lot to pull off a buffed jump attack in a boss room, especially against an aggressive boss that can one shot you.

I'll definitely try buff stacking and powerstancing when I see her. I've got the recipe for bloodboil aromatic. Never used it before. I've found the ash for seppuku. I don't have the white mask but I'll jump attack Varre next time I see him and take it off him. I won't be able to do much until I run into the last bell bearing. I think I won't over think things too much actually.

I'll just respec before the fight and dump everything into getting 60 vigor and 99 STR, smith my greatsword and troll's golden sword to +25 (Don't want to waste ancient dragon stones on weapons I won't re-use actually, I've only found 1 so far) then throw on a few stacking buffs, summon my jellyfish and have at it. If my plan is too complex I won't be able to concentrate on fighting her.
 

Lyric Suite

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While i was dicking around alts, it just dawned me there was actually one last challenge:



The sweet taste of revenge.

BTW, i decided to go SL1 after all. First of all, i think it's better if i stay away from multiplayer since it's too much of an addicting time sink for me. Second, more than half of the connections are for PvP with twinks anyway, which is just obnoxious. And lastly, considering the amount of random gear i'm going to have to use it makes no sense to stick to a particular "theme" anyway. I'll save that for NG+.

Now that i've finished the game i was checking out some lore videos and to be honest i actually kinda like the story, all though i don't see how any normal human being can actually remember item descriptions for a game this long, enough to actually piece out an actual story line, i mean seriously:



Still, the whole concept of the Golden Order is actually kinda fascinating. The fact the "holy" path is actually a combination of both intelligence and faith is not something i've ever seen before. In retrospective, knowing what the actual story is and who the characters are makes the experience of going through all the vague shit in the game better. I was utterly in the dark on my playthrough and that made the world appear just empty and without meaning.
 

Bloodeyes

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Crumbling Farum Azula is really cool. Mountaintop of the Giants was OK, but probably my least favorite area visually. I thought the dungeons were really cool though, especially the spiritcaller snail cave. It definitely had its moments, and I don't think the area was made so sparse and short because of time constraints. It fits tonally with what's going on with the plot.

The sense of elevation, emptiness, desolation. They could have done some unique enemies for the area though. Reskins of all the cuntiest stuff I've met across the world was a bit disappointing - though it did show how powerful I've gotten, given I was able to knock the shit out of all of them with little trouble. Plus more powerful reskins of enemies in the late game are a fairly standard videogame trope. Can't really complain about that one. Still, I'm glad it was short and I've moved on to somewhere a bit more on-par with the rest of the game aesthetically.

I was a little sad to see Melina go. Only a little though. I haven't actually interacted with her very much so it's not like we actually bonded. She's the levelup chick. I may have talked to her 5 or 6 times in 170 odd hours. That's the thing about this game - you talk to NPCs two or three times and then they drop dead. Every time. Are you supposed to be heartbroken? Someone you've hardly spoken to and learned nothing about, have no actual connection to, just died for no obvious reason. At least they usually drop loot.

The only NPC I actually liked was the boiled crab guy, but obviously I had to jump attack him because it was too far to walk to buy crab.
 

Lyric Suite

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Here's a good example of the difference of knowing what the hell the game is talking about. I was reading the description of loot i got from the Scion, and the shield mentions Serosh, who i now know all about it. The first time i read it i was like, random made up fantasy lore? Lol who cares.
 

Lyric Suite

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So some dude in PvP dropped 999 golden centepes.

This is lame it's basically all cheaters in Limgrave. Was low level PvP like this in previous Souls games?
The only souls game I played on pc was 2, and I played a lot of pvp in that, I rarely came across cheaters. Maybe a couple per week.

I didn't come across cheaters through out my entire time with my first character, however thousands of hours that was. I mean sometimes i got one shotted without knowing why but could have just been some overpowered weapon art or something. The vast majority of time the fight seemed normal, including in Haligtree which seems to be PvP central.

However, ALL PvP summons i got in Limegrave were with twinks or cheaters, no exceptions. Even the one that seemed fair the guy had magic pebbles, poison throwing crap, crystal darts etc.

It's really strange in a way, and also hilarious since the twinks are fighting each other which seems to me it kinda defeats the purpose. What's the point of twinking your character if you are fighting other twinks? Might as well do late game PvP and be done with it.

I never tried "low level" PvP in other Souls games which is why i was wondering if this is a thing.
 

NJClaw

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I'll definitely try buff stacking and powerstancing when I see her. I've got the recipe for bloodboil aromatic. Never used it before. I've found the ash for seppuku. I don't have the white mask but I'll jump attack Varre next time I see him and take it off him. I won't be able to do much until I run into the last bell bearing. I think I won't over think things too much actually.
Killing Varrè would prevent you from ever getting the mask in this playthrough. The invader in Mohg's area drops it and he only spawns if Varrè is alive.
 

Lyric Suite

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Still not sure why so many people want to kill NPCs.

I get getting gear early but sometimes there's nothing to gain (and a whole lot to lose) and they still do it.
 

Bloodeyes

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Still not sure why so many people want to kill NPCs.

I get getting gear early but sometimes there's nothing to gain (and a whole lot to lose) and they still do it.
This game is really long and the NPCs are basic mannequins that spout nonsense at you. The quests are either "Talk to them a couple of times then they die" or you need to use a walkthrough to find them. Sorceress Sellen for example. No idea WTF is going on with her. I may go back and kill her just because I'm annoyed about that. Both of her. Boc too.
 
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